WEBVTT FILE

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council and members of the public.

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I declare the council meeting agenda

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open at 11 a.m.

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You councelor Stewart please councelor

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wishes to show its respect to the first

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custodians on the land on which we meet

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the Ngarigo People and pays its respects

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to Elders past and present. We welcome

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to the members of the public. Thank you

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for taking the time to attend with us

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today. Please turn off mobile phones or

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turn them to silent.

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Members of the public, please note

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photography or recording via any device

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is strictly prohibited at council

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meetings in accordance with council's

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code of meeting practice unless prior

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permission has been granted by council.

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By attending this meeting, all persons

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consent to an audio visual live webcast

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and recording for council's website. I

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do remind counselors and staff that the

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code of conduct applies at this meeting

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and members of the public must adhere to

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the behavioral section in the code of

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meeting practice. Toilets are located

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upstairs  through the door to my left.

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Please note all of the exits. There are

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two exits in this room and if we need to

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evacuate the room, people are to

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assemble in the marshalling area of the

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council car park located on the

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commissioner street side of the

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building.

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Excuse me, Madam Deputy Mayor. Can I

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just raise an issue? Yes

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that is the there's some contention

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about councelor Thaler's eligibility to

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be at the meeting today. So,

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as I understand it and we only received

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this information yesterday that 

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there's an opinion from the office of

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local government.

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Yes.

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 and but there's also a legal ruling

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as I understand it. I don't understand

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all the details, but are you in a

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position to make a ruling about whether

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councelor Thaler is able to or not?

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Thank you, councelor Rose. Look, I 

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appreciate it. It's difficult. I

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understand there are some legal 

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discussions still happening that is

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outside of the remitt of what we're

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doing here today. We did receive

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notification from the Office of Local

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Government last night and I understand

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all counselors have received that. I'm

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happy to read a section of this so

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that everybody is aware which is as

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follows. On Monday the 23rd of February

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2026, the suspension order took effect

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for a period of 3 months. Accordingly,

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under section 440K subsection 1 of the

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act, councelor Thaler is not entitled to

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exercise any of the functions of the

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civic office of a counselor for that

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period. Nor is he entitled to any fee,

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remuneration, payment of expenses or the

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use of council or facilities to which he

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would otherwise be entitled to as the

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holder of that office. That is the

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latest information that we have

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received. That is our direction and that

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is my ruling today that councelor Thaler

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is not permitted to participate in the

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council meeting today.

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Thanks. And can you just I just clarify

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that's on the basis of an opinion from

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Rick Witworth as the responsible

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officer. Is that is that right?

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That's right. In accordance to the

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written information that we received

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yesterday.

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Okay, I understand.

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Have we received actually in an order

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completing the procedure at the office

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of the under the acting

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the period of the suspension?

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Not not to my knowledge. I understand

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that there are many legal discussions

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still ongoing and that is fine. We have

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not received any transcripts of any

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legal decisions. The most up-to-date

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information we have is what I have just

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read to you and that is my ruling today.

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On that basis, councelor Thaler will not

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be committed.

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Just to clarify, we've received an

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opinion. We've not received an order.

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We have received advice from the office

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of local government in relation to the

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dates of councelor the suspension which

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as I read but I will repeat from

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Monday 23 February 2026 for a period of

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3 months chair if I may address you

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the actual order I have legal advice

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which can be handed up

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and the actual order is not those dates.

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The order is

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transcript of the order.

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I have the order. The order hasn't been

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varied. On Wednesday, the department sec

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 the department barrister Mr

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McAullet

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asked the tribunal to impose a

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suspension and he said "I do not have

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that power." and he encouraged the

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parties to get legal advice. I have

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received legal advice from XD Law.

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We can give you the actual order which

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is dated the 29th of October and it says

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you shall be suspended for a period of 3

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months 7 days from the date of this

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order. Nothing has changed those dates

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and that is now past time. The

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suspension period expired on please. The

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suspension period expired on the 5th of

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February, 2026.

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Nothing has been done to revive that

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period. I have Supreme Court case law on

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my side and it's an opinion. It is not a

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fact. I have lawyers who have said our

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opinion is you are not suspended. Your

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period has now passed. Nothing can

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revive it. So the risk here is to

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deprive a publicly elected public

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official in front of the constituents

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from doing their job. You might make a

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ruling all you like but you are not

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making a ruling based on fact. Councelor

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Williamson has copies. Council Rose, you

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have copies. I can hand you the order

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and I would encourage you to read the

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order.

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Council, thank you. I have politely

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listened to what you have said. So if

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you would allow me to respond to your

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comments.

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Allow me to pass the order. Sure.

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Everything turns care on this order.

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Council, you must understand that this

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is actually not a court of law and so we

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will not be conducting this in terms of

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your legal arguments. That is for a

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court of law, not for this council.

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The court does not issue. Please allow I

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politely listened to you.

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I want to hand the order.

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Hand me the order. I believe it's a copy

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of what I've already got in front of me.

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Yep.

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And can you read out the operating

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dates?

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No, I'm sorry. again. I'm sorry. You

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don't read out dates.

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Please allow me to speak.

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Read out the dates.

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23 February 2026 for

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That's not the order. You're reading the

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legal letter.

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Excuse me, Councilor Thaler.

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Again, I will let you know this is not a

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court of law. We will not be having a

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legal argument here. That there are

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times and places for that and that is in

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a court of law here. And as you said,

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you said the court has not given an

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order for your suspension. That is

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correct. That is not the role of the

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court. The  body that gives

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the the suspension is is that comes from

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the office of local government. So we

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are operating under the direction of the

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office of local government. You are

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welcome to continue to pursue this in

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the courts. You are welcome to do that.

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And if an alternative  finding is

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given that will be addressed when and if

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it happens. But based on the information

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we have here today, our directive as the

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governing body is that your suspension

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is effective as of and I say again 23.

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Please give me legal. This is for a

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court of law. This is not for this

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council.

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This is the order. Please read the dates

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on this order. This is the order, not

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Mr. Witworth's opinion via email. This

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is the legal instrument. In order to

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move this along, what what section would

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you like me to read?

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2 ABC.

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Read the whole order.

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Yep. Weird reading. I've done it.

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We having a meeting. No, I will not.

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You're going to

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I will not engage in a legal argument

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with you here now. I have said several

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times this is a council meeting. You

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take your legal arguments to the courts.

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That is the and continue to do so. Do

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not do

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Excuse me, chair. I won.

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Give me the transcript. Give me the

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transcript. that says you are not

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suspended as of February 23.

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This is the transcript. This is the read

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the whole document.

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Thaler, you will soon be ejected from

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this meeting if you do not sit down.

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Please, there's no you are you are

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welcome to attend this meeting as a

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member of the public. I will if there

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are no chairs in the gallery, I will

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happily have another one brought out.

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My ruling as chair of this meeting is

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that you are not participating in the

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meeting today.

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If there are legal ramifications, we

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will deal with that at the time. But my

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ruling and this is the end of this

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argument. You would not be permitted to

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to to participate in the meeting today.

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I have legal advice saying that these

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dates are not the dates.

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Not relevant.

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Sorry, that's not the answer.

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That is not relevant. I will not answer

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the question. It is not relevant. We

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don't have legal take your seat.

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Please take your seat. Councelor Thaler.

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With that, we will move to the first

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item on the agenda, which is item 9.3.

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Do we do we have

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moved by council? Members of the public,

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I will ask you to be respectful. I do

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have the power to evict you from the the

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premises. So, please please have to go.

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Moved by councelor Davis, seconded by

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councelor Summers. Councelor Davis, you

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have five minutes to speak.

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Thank you.

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Thank you, Madam Chair.  this strategy

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has been long

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a long awaited strategy for this

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council. There are many arts

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organizations and many groups that are

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reliant on this strategy to be able to

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get funding to actually have a clear

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understanding of what

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the council and the regional strategy is

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for arts and culture.

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It has been out in the community. has

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had good feedback and we need to move

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forward and there are lots of reasons

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why we need to move forward and one of

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the key groups that are looking forward

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to this strategy being is the Raglin

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Gallery who can actually get funding 

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in this realm to actually upgrade the

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building down in Lambi Street. It is a a

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well recognized gallery.  we also have

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lots of other organizations such as Lake

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Light, the Bombala community with the

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old primary school,  the arts program

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that's happening down in Bombala at the

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moment and all of our smaller

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communities. And also we need to look at

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our heritage buildings  that can also

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be supported well within this strategy.

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So I recommend to everybody that we vote

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for this strategy  and allow the art

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community to actually move forward and

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have some  have an endorse

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strategy that will allow them to get

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funding into the future.

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Thank you.  speaker against

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 to take another speaker for if

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required council summers.

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Thank you madam. Yes, I'm very pleased

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to support council Davies in relation to

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recommending that this  strate policy

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goes through and I would go a little

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further and say  we have been having

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discussions amongst us in earlier days

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in relation to tourism and there is

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no better driver for passive tourism and

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and different sorts of tourism other

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than hurtling down a hill to arts and

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arts and heritage and culture and that

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sort of thing. And we have a very strong

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 arts community in our area and 

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this will go one small step to giving

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them encouragement and the capacity to

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apply for the grants that come along.

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They've been waiting for this and  we

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really need to um to to um vote for it

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today, get it in place and and then work

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on implementing the recommendations that

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are there. And that includes I hope

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support going forward. I know we're in

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difficult circumstance, difficult

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financial circumstances, but I think

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this is one area where we can look

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carefully at um helping. So I I

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recommend this to my counselors. Thank

318
12:08.720 --> 12:09.096
you.

319
12:09.120 --> 12:10.615
Thank you. We better put the motion.

320
12:10.639 --> 12:11.896
Sorry, Council Williamson.

321
12:11.920 --> 12:14.920
Um yeah, thank you. Um

322
12:16.160 --> 12:19.016
madam, you may deputy mayor. Madam

323
12:19.040 --> 12:19.736
Chair,

324
12:19.760 --> 12:21.016
Madam Chair,

325
12:21.040 --> 12:24.040
um I I understand looking at the paper

326
12:25.920 --> 12:28.216
that there's

327
12:28.240 --> 12:31.240
money to be allocated via the strategy.

328
12:31.600 --> 12:33.815
Is that correct?

329
12:33.839 --> 12:36.055
 C

330
12:36.079 --> 12:38.696
um the sorry

331
12:38.720 --> 12:41.096
to our coordinate coordinator strategy.

332
12:41.120 --> 12:43.656
Thanks. So at the so at the moment what

333
12:43.680 --> 12:45.336
you'll see within the strategy is a

334
12:45.360 --> 12:46.776
number of actions that have been

335
12:46.800 --> 12:48.536
identified for delivery over the next

336
12:48.560 --> 12:50.456
four years.

337
12:50.480 --> 12:52.776
They've been costed out and you'll find

338
12:52.800 --> 12:55.495
that the costing out is staff time. It's

339
12:55.519 --> 12:58.375
not necessarily additional budget for

340
12:58.399 --> 13:00.615
materials and contracts so to speak. It

341
13:00.639 --> 13:03.639
is staff time that will be absorbed

342
13:03.680 --> 13:04.615
get paid

343
13:04.639 --> 13:07.016
within the current BAU. It's absorbed

344
13:07.040 --> 13:08.456
within the current BAU. If we're going

345
13:08.480 --> 13:10.456
to allocate budget to this, don't we

346
13:10.480 --> 13:13.255
have to identify a source of the funding

347
13:13.279 --> 13:15.815
and the documents as unresourced?

348
13:15.839 --> 13:17.495
Yeah, through you madam chair. If I

349
13:17.519 --> 13:19.495
could just jump in on that one. Um the

350
13:19.519 --> 13:21.815
actions are identified. The ones that

351
13:21.839 --> 13:23.576
are not resourced are marked as

352
13:23.600 --> 13:25.096
unresourced.

353
13:25.120 --> 13:27.176
So it is clear there and then anything

354
13:27.200 --> 13:29.656
that is business as usual um as our

355
13:29.680 --> 13:31.576
coordinative strategy has just outlined

356
13:31.600 --> 13:34.600
is is absorbed into um the business as

357
13:35.040 --> 13:37.736
usual that the staff carry out. So if

358
13:37.760 --> 13:39.815
there was if there were actions to be

359
13:39.839 --> 13:41.576
future funded that's for council's

360
13:41.600 --> 13:43.096
consideration there you are not being

361
13:43.120 --> 13:45.976
asked today to fund those unresourced um

362
13:46.000 --> 13:47.896
actions. They're clearly identified as

363
13:47.920 --> 13:50.920
unresor strategy isn't

364
13:51.440 --> 13:51.896
thank you.

365
13:51.920 --> 13:53.336
Thank you. Um with that I put the

366
13:53.360 --> 13:56.136
motion. All those in favor councelor

367
13:56.160 --> 13:59.160
Summers Higgins um Stewart Williamson

368
14:00.560 --> 14:03.560
Rooney Davis Elliot and Hopkins.  the

369
14:04.160 --> 14:05.736
motion is carried. Note that councelor

370
14:05.760 --> 14:08.760
Rose is not in the room. Moving on to

371
14:09.120 --> 14:11.896
item 9.3.4.

372
14:11.920 --> 14:14.920
Do we have a  motion from councelors?

373
14:15.519 --> 14:16.856
Councelor Davis moving the office's

374
14:16.880 --> 14:19.880
recommendation. A seconder council.

375
14:20.720 --> 14:23.096
Councelor Davis, would you like to speak

376
14:23.120 --> 14:24.375
um to the commission?

377
14:24.399 --> 14:27.255
I sort the reports back for itself. Um

378
14:27.279 --> 14:30.279
we've had many u ex examples of um of

379
14:32.880 --> 14:35.880
how not to interact with staff.  our

380
14:35.920 --> 14:38.216
staff always do the best job they can

381
14:38.240 --> 14:41.240
with  very few resources.  whilst we

382
14:43.519 --> 14:45.736
are not perfect all of the time, we also

383
14:45.760 --> 14:47.336
need to take into account that we need

384
14:47.360 --> 14:50.216
to respect each other and respect earned

385
14:50.240 --> 14:53.240
not given. So in  this case, I support

386
14:56.240 --> 14:59.240
this  interaction policy because I

387
14:59.279 --> 15:01.736
think it's time that we all work as a

388
15:01.760 --> 15:04.055
team and this allows us to have the

389
15:04.079 --> 15:06.296
rules as how we actually work as a team.

390
15:06.320 --> 15:06.856
Thank you.

391
15:06.880 --> 15:09.416
Thank you.  speaker against counter

392
15:09.440 --> 15:12.296
just got a an amendment to the to the

393
15:12.320 --> 15:15.320
motion here. All right. Um I'm not sure

394
15:15.920 --> 15:18.375
if Jenny can find the motion.

395
15:18.399 --> 15:20.456
Do you want to just sort of slowly read

396
15:20.480 --> 15:22.856
it and see how he goes?

397
15:22.880 --> 15:25.880
Oh, we've got them all here.

398
15:26.480 --> 15:27.896
Okay.

399
15:27.920 --> 15:30.456
So, no, there's a there's a new range of

400
15:30.480 --> 15:32.856
amendments. So, um councilors might

401
15:32.880 --> 15:34.456
remember that there was an agreement

402
15:34.480 --> 15:37.480
that um Mr. Rollings and I go through

403
15:37.839 --> 15:40.839
this policy and um this isn't the I've

404
15:42.079 --> 15:44.856
just sent you a new one under under the

405
15:44.880 --> 15:47.880
Yes. Just under SMRC or is there another

406
15:48.079 --> 15:50.216
email that I can send to?

407
15:50.240 --> 15:52.935
Did you send it to the

408
15:52.959 --> 15:55.336
exact sorry do you want to move

409
15:55.360 --> 15:57.495
that to the exact office? Yeah.

410
15:57.519 --> 16:00.519
Yeah. So the the draft the new motion is

411
16:00.959 --> 16:02.375
to adopt the council and staff

412
16:02.399 --> 16:04.375
interaction policy as set out in the fe

413
16:04.399 --> 16:07.399
February paper 236 to 243 incorporating

414
16:08.320 --> 16:10.615
the provisions aligned with the office

415
16:10.639 --> 16:12.935
of local government model council and

416
16:12.959 --> 16:15.959
staff interaction policy 2021.

417
16:16.320 --> 16:18.136
Um defer consideration of additional

418
16:18.160 --> 16:20.136
amendment shown in red pending further

419
16:20.160 --> 16:22.296
consultation.

420
16:22.320 --> 16:24.536
three request this the CEO and relevant

421
16:24.560 --> 16:26.456
executive staff meet with relevant

422
16:26.480 --> 16:27.976
interest of councilors to review the

423
16:28.000 --> 16:29.576
proposed additional amendments.

424
16:29.600 --> 16:31.096
Councelor Rose, I will just stop you. We

425
16:31.120 --> 16:32.375
do actually have a motion on the table.

426
16:32.399 --> 16:34.055
So unless you're making an amendment to

427
16:34.079 --> 16:36.856
the motion that's on the table. Um I

428
16:36.880 --> 16:39.495
feel that what you're doing is contrary

429
16:39.519 --> 16:41.175
to the motion we currently have which is

430
16:41.199 --> 16:43.416
to adopt the policy and you're amending

431
16:43.440 --> 16:45.175
for us to defer the policy which is

432
16:45.199 --> 16:45.576
different.

433
16:45.600 --> 16:47.815
No I no not correct.

434
16:47.839 --> 16:49.735
Okay let's see how we go. So the first

435
16:49.759 --> 16:52.759
part says to adopt the policy

436
16:52.880 --> 16:55.175
um incorporating the provisions aligned

437
16:55.199 --> 16:56.536
with the office of local government

438
16:56.560 --> 16:57.175
model.

439
16:57.199 --> 16:59.735
Let's  we may break it down. Councelor

440
16:59.759 --> 17:01.175
Davis, are you happy for the amended

441
17:01.199 --> 17:03.175
wording?

442
17:03.199 --> 17:06.199
 so say that again that council adopts

443
17:07.839 --> 17:10.136
um we'll wait and see. I'll just give

444
17:10.160 --> 17:11.496
you an explanation.

445
17:11.520 --> 17:14.136
 we might

446
17:14.160 --> 17:16.616
get the wording on the board.

447
17:16.640 --> 17:19.640
And it's um

448
17:19.760 --> 17:22.760
four phrases um in

449
17:23.679 --> 17:25.655
can you get access to it or not?

450
17:25.679 --> 17:27.496
I'll have to put it on display for me

451
17:27.520 --> 17:29.655
from my emails.

452
17:29.679 --> 17:32.136
Okay. So the the first part is to adopt

453
17:32.160 --> 17:34.775
the council and staff interaction policy

454
17:34.799 --> 17:37.416
as set out in the February 2026 business

455
17:37.440 --> 17:40.440
paper.

456
17:46.000 --> 17:46.535
Okay.

457
17:46.559 --> 17:49.559
Incorporating the provisions

458
17:51.919 --> 17:53.655
aligned with the office of local

459
17:53.679 --> 17:56.679
government model

460
17:57.840 --> 18:00.840
councelor and staff interaction policy

461
18:01.840 --> 18:04.840
2021.

462
18:06.080 --> 18:08.775
Okay. Councelor Davis.

463
18:08.799 --> 18:10.535
That's that's

464
18:10.559 --> 18:12.376
there's three more points.

465
18:12.400 --> 18:14.136
But if we do them point by point, are

466
18:14.160 --> 18:15.496
you happy currently?

467
18:15.520 --> 18:17.736
Well, we better off doing more.

468
18:17.760 --> 18:19.895
Okay. All right then.

469
18:19.919 --> 18:22.296
To defer consideration of the additional

470
18:22.320 --> 18:25.096
amendments shown in red

471
18:25.120 --> 18:28.120
pending further consultation.

472
18:33.280 --> 18:34.535
Right. Got issue with this, but we'll

473
18:34.559 --> 18:36.535
hear the third one. And then note the

474
18:36.559 --> 18:38.775
the adopted policies intended to give

475
18:38.799 --> 18:41.736
effect to council of statutory functions

476
18:41.760 --> 18:44.760
under sections 223 and 232 of the local

477
18:45.760 --> 18:48.760
government act.

478
18:50.400 --> 18:52.216
affected counselor

479
18:52.240 --> 18:54.856
to give effect to counselor's statutory

480
18:54.880 --> 18:56.696
functions

481
18:56.720 --> 18:59.720
under sections 223 and 232

482
19:00.480 --> 19:03.480
the local government act 1993

483
19:04.320 --> 19:06.216
while maintaining appropriate staff

484
19:06.240 --> 19:09.240
protections

485
19:12.640 --> 19:15.640
appropriate staff protections

486
19:17.440 --> 19:18.535
protections

487
19:18.559 --> 19:20.616
elections

488
19:20.640 --> 19:23.176
No. 30 seconds or less.

489
19:23.200 --> 19:24.136
Rose,

490
19:24.160 --> 19:27.160
I do need to reiterate point B of your

491
19:27.520 --> 19:29.655
amendment is actually contrary to the

492
19:29.679 --> 19:31.176
motion that we have because the motion

493
19:31.200 --> 19:33.256
that is currently being debated is that

494
19:33.280 --> 19:35.416
we adopt the policy. Your amendment is

495
19:35.440 --> 19:37.015
to defer the policy which is different

496
19:37.039 --> 19:38.856
from the original motion. Now, we can

497
19:38.880 --> 19:41.015
have that as a foreshadowed motion. And

498
19:41.039 --> 19:44.039
I am happy um to  to debate A and C as

499
19:46.320 --> 19:48.136
an amendment or maybe councelor Rose

500
19:48.160 --> 19:50.456
would like to um incorporate them into

501
19:50.480 --> 19:53.480
her original motion. But B is contrary.

502
19:54.400 --> 19:56.136
Adoption and deferring are two different

503
19:56.160 --> 19:58.296
things. So, we would have to take B as a

504
19:58.320 --> 19:59.416
foreshadowed motion. I

505
19:59.440 --> 20:02.440
understand. Um if I can just if you can

506
20:02.640 --> 20:04.376
give me 30 seconds just to explain.

507
20:04.400 --> 20:07.400
Yeah, our current policy is very brief.

508
20:08.799 --> 20:10.775
In fact, it's almost non-existent.

509
20:10.799 --> 20:13.416
Secondly, the adopted policy has a

510
20:13.440 --> 20:15.895
schedule that doesn't exist. Um,

511
20:15.919 --> 20:18.616
schedule one. So, it doesn't exist. The

512
20:18.640 --> 20:21.496
the proposed policy um the current

513
20:21.520 --> 20:24.520
policy dates back to 2019 or 20. And

514
20:26.240 --> 20:27.976
what we're doing is a very significant

515
20:28.000 --> 20:31.000
amendment, but the amendment is largely

516
20:31.280 --> 20:33.976
consistent with the model policy that

517
20:34.000 --> 20:36.376
was put for proposed by the office of

518
20:36.400 --> 20:39.400
local government in 20121.

519
20:39.679 --> 20:42.216
We've got some additional parts in in

520
20:42.240 --> 20:44.856
red which  which have been discussed

521
20:44.880 --> 20:47.096
here and people have raised some

522
20:47.120 --> 20:49.015
concerns about them and I've worked with

523
20:49.039 --> 20:52.039
Mr. Rawlings on that. His suggestion was

524
20:52.240 --> 20:55.240
that we adopt the model policy basically

525
20:56.080 --> 20:58.296
um because that's the that's the

526
20:58.320 --> 21:01.320
accepted policy and any local provisions

527
21:01.520 --> 21:03.736
we have further discussion about it to

528
21:03.760 --> 21:06.376
come back to this this council. So

529
21:06.400 --> 21:09.256
that's the that's the intention here. So

530
21:09.280 --> 21:12.056
um I'm happy to to make an amendment to

531
21:12.080 --> 21:14.296
that. I suppose his point was that we

532
21:14.320 --> 21:15.895
should adopt the model policy which I

533
21:15.919 --> 21:17.816
think is correct but there is some

534
21:17.840 --> 21:20.535
contention about the additional parts in

535
21:20.559 --> 21:23.015
red. If we don't do that then I'm happy

536
21:23.039 --> 21:25.416
to have an amendment to say that that

537
21:25.440 --> 21:27.576
within 3 months that we can within the

538
21:27.600 --> 21:29.416
normal 3 month period we can come back

539
21:29.440 --> 21:31.416
with further amendments to the policy.

540
21:31.440 --> 21:33.336
Thank you councelor O. Um quite a long

541
21:33.360 --> 21:35.416
30 second explanation but we'll move on.

542
21:35.440 --> 21:35.976
Councelor

543
21:36.000 --> 21:38.056
I have to say I'm really confused. Yes.

544
21:38.080 --> 21:40.456
So we deferred this policy.

545
21:40.480 --> 21:41.576
Yes.

546
21:41.600 --> 21:44.600
So that councelor Rose could have the

547
21:44.880 --> 21:47.880
discussion with council with Mr. Rolling

548
21:48.159 --> 21:50.696
and we have the policy come back to this

549
21:50.720 --> 21:53.576
council with the changes.

550
21:53.600 --> 21:56.600
 so I'm hearing two different sides to

551
21:58.159 --> 21:59.336
the story here.

552
21:59.360 --> 22:01.895
I think we're moving into debate. So we

553
22:01.919 --> 22:03.655
have two options. We can either accept

554
22:03.679 --> 22:06.296
the amendment as is or you could

555
22:06.320 --> 22:07.576
incorporate A and C.

556
22:07.600 --> 22:08.696
But wait a minute.

557
22:08.720 --> 22:11.720
My question is if we have this in front

558
22:11.840 --> 22:14.296
of us and council Rose has had a

559
22:14.320 --> 22:16.775
discussion with Mr. Rulings,

560
22:16.799 --> 22:19.799
why have we got a disconnect?

561
22:19.919 --> 22:21.816
This is a matter for the debate. If if

562
22:21.840 --> 22:24.135
you would  like to have that as a

563
22:24.159 --> 22:24.696
portion

564
22:24.720 --> 22:26.296
I can't debate something I wasn't

565
22:26.320 --> 22:28.135
involved in the discussion on. I don't

566
22:28.159 --> 22:30.456
know. I don't know what we're actually

567
22:30.480 --> 22:32.296
discussing because we have a policy in

568
22:32.320 --> 22:34.056
front of us which I don't have a problem

569
22:34.080 --> 22:36.296
with. But I'm hearing from councelor

570
22:36.320 --> 22:38.696
Rose that he had a discussion which we

571
22:38.720 --> 22:41.576
agreed to as a council

572
22:41.600 --> 22:44.600
um to to have that discussion and he has

573
22:45.200 --> 22:45.736
a different

574
22:45.760 --> 22:48.056
council Davis. I think we I I hear your

575
22:48.080 --> 22:49.895
question. What we will do I feel what

576
22:49.919 --> 22:51.176
you're saying is that you will not

577
22:51.200 --> 22:53.096
accept any of these suggested amendments

578
22:53.120 --> 22:55.096
as part of your motion. So what we will

579
22:55.120 --> 22:57.015
do is we will debate it as an amendment

580
22:57.039 --> 22:59.256
if we can get a seconder. But I will not

581
22:59.280 --> 23:01.655
accept point B as an amendment because

582
23:01.679 --> 23:03.895
that is contrary to the original motion.

583
23:03.919 --> 23:06.135
You could if you would like councelor O

584
23:06.159 --> 23:07.736
to lead this here as a foreshadowed

585
23:07.760 --> 23:10.296
motion argue against councelor Davis's

586
23:10.320 --> 23:11.496
motion and we could have this as a

587
23:11.520 --> 23:13.976
foreshadowed motion or we can debate

588
23:14.000 --> 23:16.456
just the two points as an amendment.

589
23:16.480 --> 23:19.480
I'll suggest a f another amendment for

590
23:20.000 --> 23:22.456
simplicity then that the coun councilors

591
23:22.480 --> 23:25.480
and staff interaction policy be adopted

592
23:26.240 --> 23:28.456
 with the understanding that further

593
23:28.480 --> 23:30.535
amendments may be brought back to

594
23:30.559 --> 23:32.296
council within a 3-month period.

595
23:32.320 --> 23:33.895
Yeah, look any policy could be amended

596
23:33.919 --> 23:35.736
at any time if the council calls it.

597
23:35.760 --> 23:37.736
We've got basically we've got a 3-month

598
23:37.760 --> 23:40.216
period. So that's the the issue for a

599
23:40.240 --> 23:42.856
change to so within a three-month

600
23:42.880 --> 23:45.880
period. Certainly. Okay. Council Davis,

601
23:46.080 --> 23:47.015
I'm happy with that.

602
23:47.039 --> 23:48.616
Okay, great. So, the original motion is

603
23:48.640 --> 23:51.015
now um that council and staff  the

604
23:51.039 --> 23:52.775
council and staff interaction policy be

605
23:52.799 --> 23:54.456
adopted

606
23:54.480 --> 23:57.480
with sorry with an understanding that

607
23:57.520 --> 23:59.256
further amendments may be brought back

608
23:59.280 --> 24:01.655
to council within a 3 months period. 

609
24:01.679 --> 24:04.135
do we have a speaker against this motion

610
24:04.159 --> 24:07.015
on the board?

611
24:07.039 --> 24:09.176
Speaker Paul.

612
24:09.200 --> 24:10.056


613
24:10.080 --> 24:13.080
yes. Um,

614
24:13.679 --> 24:16.679
Madam Deputy Mayor, I think that the

615
24:19.200 --> 24:22.200
this policy intention is is is really I

616
24:22.880 --> 24:25.880
think a positive one. Um, but there are

617
24:26.159 --> 24:28.456
some potential issues

618
24:28.480 --> 24:31.480
that we face in terms of the legal

619
24:31.600 --> 24:34.216
requirements that we have under 232 and

620
24:34.240 --> 24:37.240
223 of the local government act. And so

621
24:38.640 --> 24:40.296
I think those things haven't been able

622
24:40.320 --> 24:43.320
to be completely defined because we did

623
24:44.320 --> 24:46.056
have some some discussions. You're

624
24:46.080 --> 24:49.080
right, Council Davis. Um Mr. Orlings and

625
24:49.200 --> 24:51.176
I, but there wasn't there wasn't the

626
24:51.200 --> 24:53.176
opportunity for him to him and I to sit

627
24:53.200 --> 24:55.176
down together to do this. So we had some

628
24:55.200 --> 24:57.576
email discussions. I think there are a

629
24:57.600 --> 24:59.576
few small details that we can sort out

630
24:59.600 --> 25:02.600
and so I think these can be done 

631
25:02.799 --> 25:05.176
within the next month or so and for us

632
25:05.200 --> 25:06.616
to bring back some amendments at that

633
25:06.640 --> 25:08.376
stage is probably the simplest way to do

634
25:08.400 --> 25:10.936
this. So that that's basically the story

635
25:10.960 --> 25:13.255
and I think it's an easy thing for us to

636
25:13.279 --> 25:16.279
adopt here um and and move forward with

637
25:16.320 --> 25:19.320
some small adjustments that I think that

638
25:19.520 --> 25:22.520
are necessary because the issue of

639
25:22.720 --> 25:25.255
finding out information is part of the

640
25:25.279 --> 25:27.015
story and requirements for counselors

641
25:27.039 --> 25:30.039
and um so that's that's I think there's

642
25:30.080 --> 25:32.376
a tension that's that naturally exists

643
25:32.400 --> 25:34.535
and we just have to get the the um the

644
25:34.559 --> 25:37.559
adjustment right. So  Mr. still has

645
25:37.840 --> 25:40.840
agreed for he and I to meet and um

646
25:41.279 --> 25:43.176
sometime next month I'll come back with

647
25:43.200 --> 25:45.976
that to council for people to consider

648
25:46.000 --> 25:47.895
 in accordance with the staff and

649
25:47.919 --> 25:50.056
council interaction policy I assume 

650
25:50.080 --> 25:51.416
councelor Davis do you need a right of

651
25:51.440 --> 25:52.856
reply both speakers are speaking for

652
25:52.880 --> 25:54.936
your motion with that I put the motion

653
25:54.960 --> 25:57.416
all those in favor

654
25:57.440 --> 26:00.440
coun that's unanimous

655
26:01.200 --> 26:04.056
moving on to item 9.3.5

656
26:04.080 --> 26:06.056
the quarterly delivery program progress

657
26:06.080 --> 26:09.080
report have someone to move.

658
26:10.720 --> 26:11.336
I'll move it.

659
26:11.360 --> 26:13.176
Councelor Davis. Councelor Elliot.

660
26:13.200 --> 26:14.936
Seconded.

661
26:14.960 --> 26:17.960
Councelor Davis, you have five minutes.

662
26:18.080 --> 26:20.456
Can I just have when when some questions

663
26:20.480 --> 26:22.296
would you like those after this? After

664
26:22.320 --> 26:25.096
council Davis, councelor Davis to um

665
26:25.120 --> 26:28.120
speak. I understand that councelor Rose

666
26:28.159 --> 26:30.616
has a number of questions.

667
26:30.640 --> 26:33.640
 look, the record is as given. , and

668
26:34.960 --> 26:37.960
we are noting the report.

669
26:38.720 --> 26:41.336
So, I won't take up any more time. I'll

670
26:41.360 --> 26:44.135
ask councelor Rose to ask his question.

671
26:44.159 --> 26:45.655
Do we have any questions in relation to

672
26:45.679 --> 26:48.376
item 9.3.5?

673
26:48.400 --> 26:49.096
Rose.

674
26:49.120 --> 26:52.120
Thank you. So, um, there's 15 projects

675
26:52.640 --> 26:55.640
identified as being of track or concern

676
26:56.880 --> 26:58.696
and it would be helpful to know that

677
26:58.720 --> 27:01.255
what of those of those 15 projects, what

678
27:01.279 --> 27:03.976
are resourcing constraints? what are

679
27:04.000 --> 27:07.000
those related to contractor performance?

680
27:07.200 --> 27:09.255
What are scope changes or what are

681
27:09.279 --> 27:11.895
funding issues? So I suppose that's just

682
27:11.919 --> 27:14.456
at a big picture level to know that

683
27:14.480 --> 27:15.976
information would be helpful for us in

684
27:16.000 --> 27:17.576
our governance role.

685
27:17.600 --> 27:19.976
Um sorry councelor um just in brief you

686
27:20.000 --> 27:21.655
wanted the of the 15 projects I've

687
27:21.679 --> 27:23.576
tracked how many or which of them are

688
27:23.600 --> 27:25.895
resource constraints  contractor

689
27:25.919 --> 27:26.376
issues

690
27:26.400 --> 27:28.456
contractor performance scope changes

691
27:28.480 --> 27:29.015
changes

692
27:29.039 --> 27:31.576
or funding issues.

693
27:31.600 --> 27:33.976
Um thank you.  possibly can't be

694
27:34.000 --> 27:35.655
answered quickly. Let's see.

695
27:35.679 --> 27:38.296
Yeah, brilliant, Madam Chair.  table

696
27:38.320 --> 27:40.696
one does list out a summary of projects

697
27:40.720 --> 27:42.135
that are off track in terms of

698
27:42.159 --> 27:44.856
explaining whether it has been a um

699
27:44.880 --> 27:47.496
contractor issue in terms of resourcing

700
27:47.520 --> 27:50.135
and where scope changes have happened

701
27:50.159 --> 27:52.296
and then applications for those projects

702
27:52.320 --> 27:54.775
that are grant funded have also been put

703
27:54.799 --> 27:57.096
forward to the funding body to  vary

704
27:57.120 --> 28:00.120
the end date of those projects. So those

705
28:00.559 --> 28:02.456
key projects in terms of for council

706
28:02.480 --> 28:04.616
awareness and this um mind you that this

707
28:04.640 --> 28:06.696
is also an update to the end of

708
28:06.720 --> 28:09.255
December.  so some of those updates

709
28:09.279 --> 28:10.696
have moved since then because our

710
28:10.720 --> 28:12.936
reporting period is for up to the 31st

711
28:12.960 --> 28:15.176
of December but I might pass it over to

712
28:15.200 --> 28:16.775
our manager of corporate projects if you

713
28:16.799 --> 28:19.799
wanted to add in any comment to that. Um

714
28:20.640 --> 28:22.616
happy to

715
28:22.640 --> 28:25.640
through you madam chair. Um happy to

716
28:26.640 --> 28:28.135
answer any questions that you have to

717
28:28.159 --> 28:30.856
the individual projects in question. Um

718
28:30.880 --> 28:33.880
we do have a number of  projects which

719
28:34.000 --> 28:36.216
are from a process point of view or

720
28:36.240 --> 28:38.936
external third party have held us up in

721
28:38.960 --> 28:41.960
some projects.  we have had  for

722
28:42.080 --> 28:45.080
example the  the buried um master plan

723
28:45.919 --> 28:48.135
project um as a result of last year's

724
28:48.159 --> 28:50.936
December flood. We actually relooked at

725
28:50.960 --> 28:52.616
um the flood modeling just to make sure

726
28:52.640 --> 28:54.775
that the design was fit for purpose. So

727
28:54.799 --> 28:57.176
we've enforced a sort of a design delay

728
28:57.200 --> 28:59.736
on that just to make sure it's right. Um

729
28:59.760 --> 29:01.255
there are a number of issues and they're

730
29:01.279 --> 29:03.015
all different. So if you do have any

731
29:03.039 --> 29:04.936
questions pertaining to an individual

732
29:04.960 --> 29:07.496
project, I'm happy to answer them. Um or

733
29:07.520 --> 29:10.520
in the next um report update, we could

734
29:11.120 --> 29:13.336
actually include that as a as a criteria

735
29:13.360 --> 29:14.135
if you wish.

736
29:14.159 --> 29:15.736
Thank you. Any further questions?

737
29:15.760 --> 29:18.760
Yes. So I suppose

738
29:19.679 --> 29:21.336
the issue of the swimming pool upgrades

739
29:21.360 --> 29:23.816
at Kumala Bombala is a significant one

740
29:23.840 --> 29:26.056
for the community. We've got some

741
29:26.080 --> 29:28.696
discussion but that's only in the

742
29:28.720 --> 29:30.856
confidential section.

743
29:30.880 --> 29:33.816
But from

744
29:33.840 --> 29:36.375
a community perspective, I suppose it

745
29:36.399 --> 29:39.255
would be worthwhile us understanding

746
29:39.279 --> 29:40.936
community

747
29:40.960 --> 29:43.736
understanding what's the revised

748
29:43.760 --> 29:46.535
critical path timeline timeline for this

749
29:46.559 --> 29:49.559
project the projects to be delivered and

750
29:51.200 --> 29:54.200
what's the likely process in that to

751
29:54.320 --> 29:56.375
happen.

752
29:56.399 --> 29:58.135
I'm sorry. I'm not too sure that this is

753
29:58.159 --> 30:00.856
the um  the forum from that.

754
30:00.880 --> 30:02.056
Obviously, as you're well aware,

755
30:02.080 --> 30:03.655
discussions are continuing. We have

756
30:03.679 --> 30:05.496
information in the business papers today

757
30:05.520 --> 30:07.655
to say that the projects team continuing

758
30:07.679 --> 30:09.895
to work closely with the contractor um

759
30:09.919 --> 30:11.576
to ensure that the upgrade works are

760
30:11.600 --> 30:13.255
completed and the facility is reopened

761
30:13.279 --> 30:15.015
as soon as possible. As you know, the

762
30:15.039 --> 30:17.015
discussions are ongoing and and updating

763
30:17.039 --> 30:19.496
on almost a dayto-day basis. That I I

764
30:19.520 --> 30:21.496
feel that's the most complete answer

765
30:21.520 --> 30:23.096
that you you will be able to expect

766
30:23.120 --> 30:24.936
today.

767
30:24.960 --> 30:27.960
Madame Deputy Chair, Deputy Mayor, I

768
30:28.320 --> 30:30.375
look, I understand

769
30:30.399 --> 30:31.976
that there's some confidential elements

770
30:32.000 --> 30:34.535
to this. From a community perspective,

771
30:34.559 --> 30:36.135
though,

772
30:36.159 --> 30:38.616
this is a project that was promised to

773
30:38.640 --> 30:41.496
be delivered before Christmas and then

774
30:41.520 --> 30:44.520
before Australia Day and now

775
30:44.720 --> 30:46.936
people are asking, well, when will it be

776
30:46.960 --> 30:49.960
delivered? There must be some best guess

777
30:50.320 --> 30:52.696
about this that um that that we can

778
30:52.720 --> 30:55.176
provide to the community that is

779
30:55.200 --> 30:56.696
non-confidential

780
30:56.720 --> 30:58.456
because that's the least the community

781
30:58.480 --> 31:00.775
can expect. Councelor Rose, with all due

782
31:00.799 --> 31:02.616
respect, I feel to use your term best

783
31:02.640 --> 31:04.216
guess is what has caused us to be in

784
31:04.240 --> 31:05.816
this problem in the first place. I would

785
31:05.840 --> 31:08.216
rather um that this council provides the

786
31:08.240 --> 31:10.375
community with updates that are accurate

787
31:10.399 --> 31:13.176
and and reasonable and achievable. That

788
31:13.200 --> 31:15.176
is not what we have before us at the

789
31:15.200 --> 31:18.135
moment. A best guess is I can give you a

790
31:18.159 --> 31:19.655
best guess they could open tomorrow. You

791
31:19.679 --> 31:21.895
know this it it's not I understand

792
31:21.919 --> 31:24.056
exactly what you're answer asking the

793
31:24.080 --> 31:25.576
answer is just not able to be given here

794
31:25.600 --> 31:27.336
today.

795
31:27.360 --> 31:29.176
One thing for one thing for certain

796
31:29.200 --> 31:30.856
we are questions and not debate.

797
31:30.880 --> 31:32.135
Yes. One thing certain it won't be

798
31:32.159 --> 31:34.535
happening tomorrow as you said. So but

799
31:34.559 --> 31:37.559
but I suppose the issue is from a

800
31:38.080 --> 31:40.375
community position and this is what

801
31:40.399 --> 31:42.135
people are saying to me. We don't know

802
31:42.159 --> 31:44.216
what is happening when it's going to

803
31:44.240 --> 31:45.336
happen.

804
31:45.360 --> 31:48.135
And so I suppose what you're saying is

805
31:48.159 --> 31:50.135
the best we can give the community this

806
31:50.159 --> 31:53.159
we've got no idea when this

807
31:54.640 --> 31:55.895
when the pools will be open but

808
31:55.919 --> 31:58.296
certainly not for instance this current

809
31:58.320 --> 31:58.936
season

810
31:58.960 --> 32:00.936
again councelor that is a best guess we

811
32:00.960 --> 32:03.336
are debating um

812
32:03.360 --> 32:06.360
I'm just asking deputy mayor I support

813
32:08.399 --> 32:11.096
in it that we should be getting some

814
32:11.120 --> 32:14.120
information out to the community on what

815
32:14.240 --> 32:15.336
what's going on.

816
32:15.360 --> 32:16.135
Agree.

817
32:16.159 --> 32:18.616
The more upfront we are and to put the

818
32:18.640 --> 32:21.255
cards on the table what the position is,

819
32:21.279 --> 32:24.279
we're going to be better off. And I I I

820
32:25.120 --> 32:27.096
whether this is the right time now to

821
32:27.120 --> 32:29.895
give an update, but in all honesty, the

822
32:29.919 --> 32:32.535
process so far has been nothing less

823
32:32.559 --> 32:35.559
than very ordinary. And that is why the

824
32:36.480 --> 32:39.096
community are upset. So, we've got to

825
32:39.120 --> 32:41.336
turn it around. We've got to be up front

826
32:41.360 --> 32:43.015
and we've got to go out there. If it's

827
32:43.039 --> 32:45.416
bad news, go out there and tell them.

828
32:45.440 --> 32:48.440
But don't hide behind a a a a carpet or

829
32:51.039 --> 32:53.255
a layer and saying, "Oh, it's all going

830
32:53.279 --> 32:55.816
to happen." And this is unfortunately

831
32:55.840 --> 32:57.495
with this project where it's gone wrong.

832
32:57.519 --> 32:58.936
And the sooner we get out there and be

833
32:58.960 --> 33:00.456
upfront with the community, the better

834
33:00.480 --> 33:02.775
everybody will be off.

835
33:02.799 --> 33:04.056
You got to comment.

836
33:04.080 --> 33:05.976
Yeah. Through you, Madam Chair.  in

837
33:06.000 --> 33:07.495
terms of the updates that have been

838
33:07.519 --> 33:09.255
provided. The last update out to the

839
33:09.279 --> 33:10.696
community was just around the fact that

840
33:10.720 --> 33:12.856
we were still working with um getting

841
33:12.880 --> 33:14.535
working with the contractor to work with

842
33:14.559 --> 33:16.696
the subcontractors that is still the

843
33:16.720 --> 33:19.416
position of council and happy to take on

844
33:19.440 --> 33:21.096
board in terms of putting out another

845
33:21.120 --> 33:23.015
round of communications on it. They are

846
33:23.039 --> 33:25.495
ongoing discussions and my understanding

847
33:25.519 --> 33:28.296
is that  the contractor has had some

848
33:28.320 --> 33:29.576
successful conversations with

849
33:29.600 --> 33:32.135
subcontractors this week. Um, but that

850
33:32.159 --> 33:33.816
information needs to be firmed up and

851
33:33.840 --> 33:35.816
put in writing to council.

852
33:35.840 --> 33:36.936
Thank you.

853
33:36.960 --> 33:39.960
So, so just to to to just clarify, I

854
33:40.880 --> 33:43.880
think the issues for you as the deputy

855
33:44.880 --> 33:47.880
mayor are that those confidential

856
33:49.200 --> 33:51.255
information, which is very fair and

857
33:51.279 --> 33:52.936
reasonable,

858
33:52.960 --> 33:54.936
but there's also the community's

859
33:54.960 --> 33:57.736
concerns and the community is in a

860
33:57.760 --> 34:00.056
situation where currently they know

861
34:00.080 --> 34:01.736
nothing. There's been two promises of

862
34:01.760 --> 34:03.895
dates. It's very clear that those

863
34:03.919 --> 34:05.255
haven't been fulfilled. And so

864
34:05.279 --> 34:06.696
is correct you councelor Rose because as

865
34:06.720 --> 34:08.936
the CEO said the very latest release

866
34:08.960 --> 34:10.855
that went out to the community two weeks

867
34:10.879 --> 34:13.095
ago said that for now the pools remain

868
34:13.119 --> 34:15.256
closed. Discussions are ongoing and the

869
34:15.280 --> 34:18.216
actual completion date is not yet known.

870
34:18.240 --> 34:19.895
Rick but the history is

871
34:19.919 --> 34:20.936
I understand the history.

872
34:20.960 --> 34:23.960
The history is very is very clear. So,

873
34:24.320 --> 34:26.776
we're in a situation where I don't know

874
34:26.800 --> 34:28.456
what the best thing to do is, but I do

875
34:28.480 --> 34:31.176
know I do support councelor Stewart is

876
34:31.200 --> 34:32.776
saying we need to provide information

877
34:32.800 --> 34:34.615
even if it's even even if if it's bad

878
34:34.639 --> 34:36.375
news to the community because that's the

879
34:36.399 --> 34:39.399
least that they can they can expect. So,

880
34:39.520 --> 34:42.296
I I I agree with you 100%. And again,

881
34:42.320 --> 34:44.456
the latest press release that went out

882
34:44.480 --> 34:46.456
was indeed bad news saying, "Sorry,

883
34:46.480 --> 34:47.895
nobody's working on the pools. Pools are

884
34:47.919 --> 34:48.936
closed. Don't know when they're going to

885
34:48.960 --> 34:50.456
be open." The news could not have been

886
34:50.480 --> 34:52.615
worse. Watch me mad mayor. It was very

887
34:52.639 --> 34:55.016
bad.

888
34:55.040 --> 34:56.135
Any further questions?

889
34:56.159 --> 34:58.776
Yes. So in terms of waste water and

890
34:58.800 --> 35:00.616
water projects that have noted of

891
35:00.640 --> 35:02.136
concern,

892
35:02.160 --> 35:03.976
um the report states that several water

893
35:04.000 --> 35:05.815
and wastewater capital projects are

894
35:05.839 --> 35:08.216
delayed due to key personnel leaving an

895
35:08.240 --> 35:11.240
unsuccessful recruitment.  the

896
35:12.000 --> 35:14.376
projects at risk seem to be quite

897
35:14.400 --> 35:16.296
significant I think in terms of where we

898
35:16.320 --> 35:18.776
are. So just an update about that and

899
35:18.800 --> 35:21.800
where we are in relation to um those

900
35:22.160 --> 35:24.055
particular projects and what risks we're

901
35:24.079 --> 35:27.079
facing in the in the in the face of lack

902
35:27.119 --> 35:30.119
of recruitment of appropriate personnel.

903
35:30.720 --> 35:33.095
Yeah. Through you madam chair the again

904
35:33.119 --> 35:35.575
because the updates are to the 31st of

905
35:35.599 --> 35:38.536
December we have um gone to market in

906
35:38.560 --> 35:40.216
terms of some positions and we are

907
35:40.240 --> 35:42.536
looking at how we can better resource in

908
35:42.560 --> 35:45.335
the water and wastewater team. So it has

909
35:45.359 --> 35:47.176
been almost two months since we

910
35:47.200 --> 35:49.815
obviously did this update. So um again I

911
35:49.839 --> 35:51.575
just need to remind councilors to focus

912
35:51.599 --> 35:53.496
on the fact that that's not the current

913
35:53.520 --> 35:55.656
position. We do we have gone to market

914
35:55.680 --> 35:57.176
on positions and we are looking at

915
35:57.200 --> 35:59.176
contractors as well.

916
35:59.200 --> 36:01.256
Is there any risk of continued to die in

917
36:01.280 --> 36:02.936
terms of the financial risk that we have

918
36:02.960 --> 36:04.936
here or not?

919
36:04.960 --> 36:07.016
Sorry madam chair can you just clarify

920
36:07.040 --> 36:08.216
that question council?

921
36:08.240 --> 36:10.536
I suppose there's a range of projects

922
36:10.560 --> 36:13.496
that are at risk here. there's basically

923
36:13.520 --> 36:16.520
personnel issues, but

924
36:17.200 --> 36:19.815
in terms of delivering those projects,

925
36:19.839 --> 36:22.839
there's got to be a risk to us of the

926
36:23.359 --> 36:25.976
impact of that on the actual core

927
36:26.000 --> 36:29.000
facilities. So, um, is there any problem

928
36:29.359 --> 36:32.216
with us continuing to function in these

929
36:32.240 --> 36:35.240
areas or is this just a a timing issue

930
36:35.599 --> 36:37.815
in terms of personnel?

931
36:37.839 --> 36:40.055
Um, do you madam chair? I don't believe

932
36:40.079 --> 36:43.079
that um yeah I I believe it's a timing

933
36:43.599 --> 36:45.496
issue at this point in time. I do

934
36:45.520 --> 36:47.016
believe our chief of infrastructure

935
36:47.040 --> 36:49.016
projects is online if he wanted to

936
36:49.040 --> 36:51.815
clarify further but my understanding is

937
36:51.839 --> 36:53.976
like I don't see that this is an

938
36:54.000 --> 36:56.936
immediate risk there Tony.

939
36:56.960 --> 36:59.095
Yeah this is this is literally a timing

940
36:59.119 --> 37:01.896
issue. Um we are well into recruitment

941
37:01.920 --> 37:04.920
for people. Um we'll be looking to bring

942
37:05.839 --> 37:08.696
to council at the March meeting a

943
37:08.720 --> 37:11.720
request for additional um contract labor

944
37:12.240 --> 37:14.776
to come in as well. Um and that should

945
37:14.800 --> 37:17.176
bring all this back on track.

946
37:17.200 --> 37:19.335
Thank you. Any third question?

947
37:19.359 --> 37:22.359
Yes. The the next part is around KPIs. I

948
37:23.040 --> 37:25.016
think the the information says there

949
37:25.040 --> 37:26.696
83.71%

950
37:26.720 --> 37:29.656
of KPIs are reported as being on target,

951
37:29.680 --> 37:31.656
but there are several critical KPIs that

952
37:31.680 --> 37:33.176
are underperforming. For instance, food

953
37:33.200 --> 37:35.656
premises inspections of 40% versus

954
37:35.680 --> 37:37.896
target of 98%.

955
37:37.920 --> 37:40.776
Sewer management program is n% as far as

956
37:40.800 --> 37:43.496
I could see. Subdivision certificates

957
37:43.520 --> 37:46.520
40% versus 95% target and road reserves

958
37:48.240 --> 37:51.240
approvals 38% versus 75%

959
37:52.560 --> 37:54.136
and the child safe working group

960
37:54.160 --> 37:56.776
meetings of zero held and targeted

961
37:56.800 --> 37:58.616
three. So there's a number of

962
37:58.640 --> 38:01.095
issues there that obviously need to be

963
38:01.119 --> 38:03.016
addressed. I will point out that this

964
38:03.040 --> 38:05.016
report was done 6 months into a 4-year

965
38:05.040 --> 38:07.016
plan. But I will ask the CEO to give

966
38:07.040 --> 38:08.376
further clarification.

967
38:08.400 --> 38:10.055
Yeah. Through through you, Madam Chair,

968
38:10.079 --> 38:11.976
that is correct. It is 6 months into a

969
38:12.000 --> 38:14.696
4-year plan.  today I actually in

970
38:14.720 --> 38:16.296
terms of that first one around the um

971
38:16.320 --> 38:18.216
environmental health officer have just

972
38:18.240 --> 38:20.456
approved a requisition around it. Um in

973
38:20.480 --> 38:23.176
terms of that, we um that person

974
38:23.200 --> 38:25.815
currently um has taken leave. So we're

975
38:25.839 --> 38:27.736
able to go out to market there just to

976
38:27.760 --> 38:29.496
cover the period of time and that

977
38:29.520 --> 38:32.520
vacancy there. And in terms of the sorry

978
38:33.280 --> 38:36.055
the the committee

979
38:36.079 --> 38:37.976
the child safe working group crew does

980
38:38.000 --> 38:40.616
it exist or is it meeting or

981
38:40.640 --> 38:43.640
child safe committee

982
38:43.920 --> 38:46.920
oh yes okay yes that one

983
38:47.520 --> 38:50.520
madam chair you're right um that is well

984
38:50.640 --> 38:53.335
underway as well so there's organization

985
38:53.359 --> 38:55.736
 it's an internal committee um and

986
38:55.760 --> 38:58.296
that is actually well underway as well

987
38:58.320 --> 39:00.216
I'd also like to point out in regards to

988
39:00.240 --> 39:03.240
the KPIs. So while we might be um 83% on

989
39:04.960 --> 39:07.095
target, it's relative to the number of

990
39:07.119 --> 39:09.335
KPIs that we have from a performance

991
39:09.359 --> 39:11.896
level as an organization and there is

992
39:11.920 --> 39:14.696
close to 300 of them. So if that

993
39:14.720 --> 39:17.720
provides some level of context I think

994
39:18.000 --> 39:20.055
you know the number that are behind out

995
39:20.079 --> 39:23.079
of the approximately 300 KPIs

996
39:23.280 --> 39:26.280
um and like the CEO said it is recorded

997
39:27.200 --> 39:29.095
up until

998
39:29.119 --> 39:32.119
end of December accordingly reporting

999
39:32.160 --> 39:34.376
understand but there's a few key issues

1000
39:34.400 --> 39:36.216
here that have been identified in the

1001
39:36.240 --> 39:38.456
report. So no data has been entered for

1002
39:38.480 --> 39:41.335
the sewer maintenance KPI.

1003
39:41.359 --> 39:43.575
Does that mean that no sewer maintenance

1004
39:43.599 --> 39:46.599
has happened?

1005
39:53.359 --> 39:55.176
Correct. That would mean for that for

1006
39:55.200 --> 39:57.016
that month that there was no data

1007
39:57.040 --> 39:58.616
entered. It doesn't necessarily mean

1008
39:58.640 --> 40:01.416
that it wasn't undertaken. um it just

1009
40:01.440 --> 40:02.936
may have meant that up until the end of

1010
40:02.960 --> 40:04.696
December the data might not have

1011
40:04.720 --> 40:06.296
actually um been entered into the

1012
40:06.320 --> 40:07.736
system.

1013
40:07.760 --> 40:10.760
And with with food premises inspections

1014
40:11.680 --> 40:14.136
are the is there any any that are

1015
40:14.160 --> 40:16.376
currently non-compliant with our reg

1016
40:16.400 --> 40:19.400
regulatory off regula our regulatory

1017
40:19.760 --> 40:21.896
requirements under the under the act or

1018
40:21.920 --> 40:24.616
given the fact that those aren't up to

1019
40:24.640 --> 40:25.335
days?

1020
40:25.359 --> 40:26.936
Um I will have to take that one on

1021
40:26.960 --> 40:29.176
notice councelor roads. Um I I know that

1022
40:29.200 --> 40:31.575
with the um the actual register, the

1023
40:31.599 --> 40:33.256
state government register, if it hits

1024
40:33.280 --> 40:34.856
that point, then that's public

1025
40:34.880 --> 40:36.456
information there, but any terms of

1026
40:36.480 --> 40:38.456
non-compliance and we have to reinspect.

1027
40:38.480 --> 40:40.216
I'm not quite across that data, but I

1028
40:40.240 --> 40:41.095
can find out for you.

1029
40:41.119 --> 40:42.856
Okay, take that one on notice. Um

1030
40:42.880 --> 40:44.216
councelor Rose, I'm sure you have many

1031
40:44.240 --> 40:45.496
other questions, but I might give other

1032
40:45.520 --> 40:47.016
counselors a chance to ask questions if

1033
40:47.040 --> 40:49.656
there are any. Councelor Higgins.

1034
40:49.680 --> 40:52.680
Thank you, Madam Chair. Um,

1035
40:53.359 --> 40:55.815
if I have a a couple of questions and

1036
40:55.839 --> 40:58.839
they're really short, I just want to um

1037
40:59.359 --> 41:02.359
lend my voice to  the

1038
41:03.839 --> 41:06.839
um request that we do more frequent coms

1039
41:06.880 --> 41:09.815
on the pools. Even if we don't have any

1040
41:09.839 --> 41:11.896
answers for anyone yet, I don't think it

1041
41:11.920 --> 41:14.920
hurts to apologize for the delays and to

1042
41:15.280 --> 41:18.136
provide assurance that council is  and

1043
41:18.160 --> 41:20.295
remains committed to ensuring the

1044
41:20.319 --> 41:23.319
community has quality pool facilities

1045
41:23.599 --> 41:25.656
into the future and as soon as possible.

1046
41:25.680 --> 41:28.680
I think when you create a void, it gets

1047
41:29.119 --> 41:32.119
filled with nonsense. Um, so I have a

1048
41:32.960 --> 41:35.960
question about the old dry plains road

1049
41:36.319 --> 41:39.176
 legacy landfill.

1050
41:39.200 --> 41:42.200
So were funds put aside to do that

1051
41:43.200 --> 41:45.575
originally and they're just not

1052
41:45.599 --> 41:47.095
sufficient?

1053
41:47.119 --> 41:48.856
Is that correct?

1054
41:48.880 --> 41:50.936
Yeah.

1055
41:50.960 --> 41:52.696
 through you madam chair that is

1056
41:52.720 --> 41:54.616
correct in terms of needing to um look

1057
41:54.640 --> 41:57.256
at external funding there for the um

1058
41:57.280 --> 41:59.896
closure plan for the closure works. So

1059
41:59.920 --> 42:02.920
that funding will be just put into for

1060
42:03.440 --> 42:05.575
future budgets.

1061
42:05.599 --> 42:06.616
How does that work?

1062
42:06.640 --> 42:08.936
Yeah. Um you madam chair the funding

1063
42:08.960 --> 42:11.960
there's the EPA do funding for for these

1064
42:12.000 --> 42:13.416
types of activities. So there's

1065
42:13.440 --> 42:15.496
opportunities there to apply for a grant

1066
42:15.520 --> 42:17.016
or into the future it might be a

1067
42:17.040 --> 42:18.776
reconsideration of how you actually look

1068
42:18.800 --> 42:21.176
at um the waste management charges, how

1069
42:21.200 --> 42:23.176
we set aside that fund and how we look

1070
42:23.200 --> 42:25.496
at  closure plans across our different

1071
42:25.520 --> 42:28.520
facilities, not just this one as well.

1072
42:28.720 --> 42:31.720
Okay. All right.  and um the bio gaps

1073
42:33.680 --> 42:36.055
flaring project.

1074
42:36.079 --> 42:38.055
So I just want to clarify that I've

1075
42:38.079 --> 42:39.896
understood this correctly. Is this is

1076
42:39.920 --> 42:42.920
just a timing issue because the landfill

1077
42:43.520 --> 42:46.055
site is still operational.

1078
42:46.079 --> 42:46.936
Yeah.

1079
42:46.960 --> 42:48.295
Yeah. Yes,

1080
42:48.319 --> 42:49.896
m. Yeah, that's exactly right. It's a

1081
42:49.920 --> 42:52.136
timing issue. keep the the waste

1082
42:52.160 --> 42:54.616
strategy informed what we want to do at

1083
42:54.640 --> 42:57.640
Kuma land and progress the Kuma landfill

1084
42:58.000 --> 42:59.575
upgrade project until that waste

1085
42:59.599 --> 43:01.496
strategies and we also need to identify

1086
43:01.520 --> 43:04.520
and set aside rur set aside

1087
43:05.200 --> 43:07.736
land dedicated land for that bio gas to

1088
43:07.760 --> 43:10.760
be um disrupted there so we're not

1089
43:10.800 --> 43:13.496
adversely impacting the operations of

1090
43:13.520 --> 43:14.376
this

1091
43:14.400 --> 43:17.335
okay does that delay have an impact on

1092
43:17.359 --> 43:19.815
our relationship with the contractor

1093
43:19.839 --> 43:22.839
okay great thank Any further questions?

1094
43:23.200 --> 43:25.016
Council,

1095
43:25.040 --> 43:27.256
sorry. Did I just understand we're

1096
43:27.280 --> 43:30.280
redoing the waist training?

1097
43:32.800 --> 43:33.976
Councelor Ray,

1098
43:34.000 --> 43:36.456
um, you would have noticed as well that

1099
43:36.480 --> 43:38.536
the the development assessment time

1100
43:38.560 --> 43:41.560
frames um below KPIs. Is there a a

1101
43:42.000 --> 43:45.000
remedial plan to address that issue?

1102
43:45.839 --> 43:47.656
Yeah.

1103
43:47.680 --> 43:50.055
Um, do you madam chair? Yes. It comes

1104
43:50.079 --> 43:51.656
down to also we are looking at

1105
43:51.680 --> 43:53.496
recruitment for a couple of positions in

1106
43:53.520 --> 43:56.520
that area. So um sorry my document is

1107
43:57.040 --> 43:58.376
still loading in terms of trying to find

1108
43:58.400 --> 44:01.400
that specific  reference but I do

1109
44:02.400 --> 44:04.696
understand um and correct me if I'm

1110
44:04.720 --> 44:06.536
wrong chief of community services there

1111
44:06.560 --> 44:08.456
is recruitment and restructuring that's

1112
44:08.480 --> 44:10.136
to happen in that department there as

1113
44:10.160 --> 44:10.776
well.

1114
44:10.800 --> 44:12.536
Okay so we can expect an update on that

1115
44:12.560 --> 44:15.416
at the next  delivered program report.

1116
44:15.440 --> 44:15.815
Y

1117
44:15.839 --> 44:16.536
thank you.

1118
44:16.560 --> 44:18.456
Will that be will that be is this a

1119
44:18.480 --> 44:20.936
quarter So we'll we'll see something

1120
44:20.960 --> 44:23.095
about changes in that

1121
44:23.119 --> 44:25.256
in the next

1122
44:25.280 --> 44:25.656
May.

1123
44:25.680 --> 44:28.536
Is that May the report?

1124
44:28.560 --> 44:29.976
Right.

1125
44:30.000 --> 44:31.176
Councelor Rose, did you have any other

1126
44:31.200 --> 44:31.896
questions?

1127
44:31.920 --> 44:33.016
 no.

1128
44:33.040 --> 44:33.496
Great.

1129
44:33.520 --> 44:35.896
 do we have anybody speaking against

1130
44:35.920 --> 44:38.920
the  motion on the board?

1131
44:39.599 --> 44:42.136
No.  councelor Davis, I believe it was

1132
44:42.160 --> 44:43.496
just questions. No need for right of

1133
44:43.520 --> 44:44.055
reply.

1134
44:44.079 --> 44:45.896
No, just that we just need to note that

1135
44:45.920 --> 44:48.216
this report is for the end of December.

1136
44:48.240 --> 44:50.696
Yes. So the information that we've had

1137
44:50.720 --> 44:53.176
have in the last two months is not

1138
44:53.200 --> 44:54.856
actually captured in this report and

1139
44:54.880 --> 44:57.416
that's really important to me.

1140
44:57.440 --> 44:58.936
With that I put the motion all those in

1141
44:58.960 --> 45:00.295
favor that council note the delivery

1142
45:00.319 --> 45:02.456
program progress report. Councelor

1143
45:02.480 --> 45:05.480
Summers  unanimous. Thank you.

1144
45:06.400 --> 45:09.400
Moving on to item 9.3.6

1145
45:11.359 --> 45:13.496
code of conducts complaints annual

1146
45:13.520 --> 45:15.736
report. Councelor Rose you're moving the

1147
45:15.760 --> 45:17.016
office's recommendation or something

1148
45:17.040 --> 45:20.040
different. moving um a motion.

1149
45:20.079 --> 45:22.295
I

1150
45:22.319 --> 45:25.319
I hope that I may have given it this

1151
45:25.760 --> 45:28.536
one. um that council receive and note

1152
45:28.560 --> 45:30.776
the code of conduct complaints report

1153
45:30.800 --> 45:33.800
for the period 1 September 2024 to 31st

1154
45:34.560 --> 45:36.936
of August 2025

1155
45:36.960 --> 45:39.960
and B

1156
45:40.160 --> 45:42.696
request the CEO to report to the April

1157
45:42.720 --> 45:44.456
2026

1158
45:44.480 --> 45:47.480
council meeting

1159
45:48.880 --> 45:51.880
on strategies to one

1160
45:53.359 --> 45:55.256
reduce the volume of code of conduct

1161
45:55.280 --> 45:58.280
complaints

1162
46:04.160 --> 46:05.896
to

1163
46:05.920 --> 46:08.456
increase early resolution of matters at

1164
46:08.480 --> 46:11.480
local level where appropriate.

1165
46:17.599 --> 46:20.599
Three, minimize external referral costs.

1166
46:24.400 --> 46:26.936
and four

1167
46:26.960 --> 46:29.256
strengthen council of behavioral and

1168
46:29.280 --> 46:32.280
governance practices.

1169
46:34.560 --> 46:35.896
Councelor Rose, this all seems to be in

1170
46:35.920 --> 46:37.896
line with our current um procedures. So

1171
46:37.920 --> 46:39.176
I actually don't see any issue with

1172
46:39.200 --> 46:41.335
that. CEO is there any issue with any of

1173
46:41.359 --> 46:41.736
this?

1174
46:41.760 --> 46:42.456
Yeah.

1175
46:42.480 --> 46:44.776
Through through you madam chair. The 

1176
46:44.800 --> 46:47.800
first point in terms of  sorry the

1177
46:48.160 --> 46:49.896
strategy so request the volume of code

1178
46:49.920 --> 46:52.055
of conduct complaint I think that was

1179
46:52.079 --> 46:53.736
around training. Oh, sorry. The the

1180
46:53.760 --> 46:56.696
strategy to reduce socas early

1181
46:56.720 --> 46:58.136
resolution of matters that's actually

1182
46:58.160 --> 47:00.216
outlined already in the procedures

1183
47:00.240 --> 47:02.216
councelor Rose in terms of the fact that

1184
47:02.240 --> 47:05.240
you can um resolve to manage it through

1185
47:06.240 --> 47:08.216
alternative means and not actually refer

1186
47:08.240 --> 47:10.776
it on. So the code of conduct procedures

1187
47:10.800 --> 47:13.656
allows for that already. the minimizing

1188
47:13.680 --> 47:16.216
of external referral costs. I do think

1189
47:16.240 --> 47:19.240
that that um that that sends a very

1190
47:19.760 --> 47:21.976
negative message to people who put in

1191
47:22.000 --> 47:24.295
complaints around the fact that your

1192
47:24.319 --> 47:26.456
complaint won't be considered

1193
47:26.480 --> 47:28.856
appropriately because we're trying to

1194
47:28.880 --> 47:30.616
reduce our costs here. So, it's just for

1195
47:30.640 --> 47:32.536
consideration there. Um but, you know,

1196
47:32.560 --> 47:34.136
I'll take on board in terms of what

1197
47:34.160 --> 47:36.696
counselors um consider there. And then

1198
47:36.720 --> 47:38.216
strengthen council behavior and

1199
47:38.240 --> 47:40.936
governance practices. I mean that that

1200
47:40.960 --> 47:43.095
links to your induction and induction

1201
47:43.119 --> 47:44.936
program that councilors have undertaken

1202
47:44.960 --> 47:47.176
and the annual code of conduct training

1203
47:47.200 --> 47:49.256
that um gets delivered as well. I think

1204
47:49.280 --> 47:51.016
it's important to actually do refreshes

1205
47:51.040 --> 47:52.936
on that rather than just doing it at the

1206
47:52.960 --> 47:53.575
very beginning.

1207
47:53.599 --> 47:55.416
So nothing contrary. Thank you. So move

1208
47:55.440 --> 47:57.736
councelor Rose. Do we have a seconder?

1209
47:57.760 --> 48:00.760
Can I please I'd really like a second

1210
48:01.119 --> 48:04.119
unless it's crucial to

1211
48:05.520 --> 48:08.520
second to the motion.

1212
48:12.160 --> 48:13.736
Sorry.

1213
48:13.760 --> 48:16.216
Council second.

1214
48:16.240 --> 48:17.496
, would you like to speak to your

1215
48:17.520 --> 48:18.616
motion or would you like me to take

1216
48:18.640 --> 48:19.896
questions?

1217
48:19.920 --> 48:21.736
Whichever you prefer.

1218
48:21.760 --> 48:23.095
, let's have you speak to the motion

1219
48:23.119 --> 48:24.376
and that may answer some of other

1220
48:24.400 --> 48:27.400
counselor's questions. Um,

1221
48:28.240 --> 48:31.176
Madame Deputy Mayor, I think I've I've

1222
48:31.200 --> 48:33.736
moved this amendment really because I

1223
48:33.760 --> 48:36.760
think what we've got is a a very

1224
48:37.760 --> 48:39.736
unfortunate story in terms of the number

1225
48:39.760 --> 48:42.696
of complaints that we have here. , and

1226
48:42.720 --> 48:44.216
I believe that it's something that we

1227
48:44.240 --> 48:47.240
need to address as a council. And I

1228
48:49.280 --> 48:51.496
understand the points made by by the

1229
48:51.520 --> 48:54.520
CEO. I think there are things happening

1230
48:54.800 --> 48:57.800
already. Um and there are things in the

1231
48:58.079 --> 49:00.376
code of meeting practice and there are

1232
49:00.400 --> 49:02.616
there are there are policies within our

1233
49:02.640 --> 49:05.640
own um our own system. But what I think

1234
49:06.720 --> 49:09.656
it's we can agree on as completely as

1235
49:09.680 --> 49:12.680
counselors is that the code of conduct

1236
49:13.440 --> 49:15.896
complaints the the number are very very

1237
49:15.920 --> 49:18.136
great and I think we've already heard

1238
49:18.160 --> 49:19.656
separately at a separate meeting that

1239
49:19.680 --> 49:21.575
the number of complaints in the past has

1240
49:21.599 --> 49:24.599
been quite small. So what we have got is

1241
49:26.480 --> 49:29.480
I suppose resources being put towards a

1242
49:30.319 --> 49:33.319
range of things that I think are um are

1243
49:33.920 --> 49:35.815
really just causing further problems for

1244
49:35.839 --> 49:38.216
us in terms of resources of council

1245
49:38.240 --> 49:41.240
staff and and problems that are there.

1246
49:41.440 --> 49:42.776
I've actually never been in an

1247
49:42.800 --> 49:45.176
organization. I've worked in many all

1248
49:45.200 --> 49:47.575
over the world where there has been a

1249
49:47.599 --> 49:50.599
code of conduct complaint system and the

1250
49:51.200 --> 49:53.736
system itself I believe is contributing

1251
49:53.760 --> 49:55.656
to more complaints than less. I think if

1252
49:55.680 --> 49:58.616
we had no system and we just got on with

1253
49:58.640 --> 50:00.776
it and were

1254
50:00.800 --> 50:02.376
brought up people and dealt with things

1255
50:02.400 --> 50:04.696
appropriately, we'd have less problems.

1256
50:04.720 --> 50:07.016
But this is costly for us. It's costing

1257
50:07.040 --> 50:08.776
rate payers and residents a lot of money

1258
50:08.800 --> 50:10.535
each year. is costing a lot in terms of

1259
50:10.559 --> 50:13.559
time and so I'm all I'm doing here is

1260
50:13.680 --> 50:16.456
asking for a strategy where we can

1261
50:16.480 --> 50:18.936
reduce this. The minister himself has

1262
50:18.960 --> 50:21.736
noted in the new code of conduct system

1263
50:21.760 --> 50:24.535
which was um which was part of his

1264
50:24.559 --> 50:27.016
proposal was that he said he believed

1265
50:27.040 --> 50:28.295
that there were a lot of trivial

1266
50:28.319 --> 50:30.616
complaints being being having taken time

1267
50:30.640 --> 50:32.295
up for for councils throughout New South

1268
50:32.319 --> 50:34.616
Wales. So I think this is something that

1269
50:34.640 --> 50:36.936
we have to address. We can't go on with

1270
50:36.960 --> 50:38.616
this large number of complaints coming

1271
50:38.640 --> 50:41.640
through a system. And um we I would just

1272
50:41.839 --> 50:44.216
like to note that I've I've had no code

1273
50:44.240 --> 50:46.136
of conduct complaint that I've put in

1274
50:46.160 --> 50:49.160
against anything. Um and I never will.

1275
50:49.520 --> 50:52.055
Um even if um people attack me at the

1276
50:52.079 --> 50:54.136
chamber and hold me down. So um

1277
50:54.160 --> 50:55.416
we wouldn't do that council.

1278
50:55.440 --> 50:57.095
I'm sure the council you would would

1279
50:57.119 --> 50:59.496
pull it off me. So So look,

1280
50:59.520 --> 51:00.776
we wouldn't let that happen to their

1281
51:00.800 --> 51:03.496
council. So look, I I I just think this

1282
51:03.520 --> 51:05.656
is just something we're asking the CEO

1283
51:05.680 --> 51:07.815
to report back to us. There must be

1284
51:07.839 --> 51:09.976
something we can do to actually decrease

1285
51:10.000 --> 51:11.976
number of complaints, decrease the cost.

1286
51:12.000 --> 51:14.055
Perhaps there's not, but um but that's

1287
51:14.079 --> 51:15.896
my concern. Thank you.

1288
51:15.920 --> 51:17.575
Thank you, Council Higgins. Speaking

1289
51:17.599 --> 51:20.599
against or question. 

1290
51:20.640 --> 51:22.136
well,

1291
51:22.160 --> 51:23.575
first of all with a question because

1292
51:23.599 --> 51:25.896
then that answer will depend on whether

1293
51:25.920 --> 51:28.920
I'm going to speak for or against. Um

1294
51:30.640 --> 51:33.335
through you  Madame Chair, if I could

1295
51:33.359 --> 51:36.359
ask  Council Rose, I'm assuming point

1296
51:37.040 --> 51:38.856
number one is reduce

1297
51:38.880 --> 51:39.176
Yeah.

1298
51:39.200 --> 51:40.136
the volume of

1299
51:40.160 --> 51:42.295
Oh, yes. That's a typo. Sorry.

1300
51:42.319 --> 51:44.136
Would you

1301
51:44.160 --> 51:46.295
I don't think the problem is the number

1302
51:46.319 --> 51:48.055
of complaints. I think the problem might

1303
51:48.079 --> 51:51.079
be the number of breaches. So, could we

1304
51:51.440 --> 51:54.440
change complaints to breaches because

1305
51:54.800 --> 51:56.535
breaches obviously

1306
51:56.559 --> 51:58.856
lead to complaints? I I totally agree

1307
51:58.880 --> 52:01.095
with um what you've been saying, but I

1308
52:01.119 --> 52:02.776
think 

1309
52:02.800 --> 52:04.376
the system is there to provide

1310
52:04.400 --> 52:06.136
accountability to make sure that

1311
52:06.160 --> 52:09.160
everybody um follows the same rules. So,

1312
52:09.599 --> 52:12.216
I would you accept a change of 

1313
52:12.240 --> 52:13.736
wording there or not?

1314
52:13.760 --> 52:16.760
Oh, thank you. Um, and would you remove

1315
52:16.880 --> 52:19.880
point three,

1316
52:20.720 --> 52:21.736
which is

1317
52:21.760 --> 52:22.216
minimize

1318
52:22.240 --> 52:24.136
minimize external referral costs? I'm

1319
52:24.160 --> 52:25.896
just a little bit concerned the council

1320
52:25.920 --> 52:27.416
might be looking like we're victim

1321
52:27.440 --> 52:30.440
blaming and  I think we need to

1322
52:30.559 --> 52:32.856
actually project an image of taking our

1323
52:32.880 --> 52:35.176
conduct very seriously.

1324
52:35.200 --> 52:37.815
And look, I I'm happy to do that if I

1325
52:37.839 --> 52:39.736
can just say I think that this is really

1326
52:39.760 --> 52:41.815
just to try and say how can we reduce

1327
52:41.839 --> 52:43.976
the cost of the council. No.

1328
52:44.000 --> 52:46.055
And the the main costs come once we

1329
52:46.079 --> 52:48.696
start because that's where the the main

1330
52:48.720 --> 52:50.856
the main costs come when someone

1331
52:50.880 --> 52:52.856
breaches council if I may you're

1332
52:52.880 --> 52:55.095
absolutely correct. One and two

1333
52:55.119 --> 52:58.119
basically implies three. So by removing

1334
52:58.559 --> 53:00.776
three if you achieve one and two three

1335
53:00.800 --> 53:02.696
is achieved. So it's almost 

1336
53:02.720 --> 53:05.176
superfluous to the motion.

1337
53:05.200 --> 53:06.456
I'm happy to do that.

1338
53:06.480 --> 53:07.335
Thank you.

1339
53:07.359 --> 53:09.095
Then I'm happy to support it. Thank you.

1340
53:09.119 --> 53:10.696
 so then do we have someone again?

1341
53:10.720 --> 53:12.456
Yes, councelor Williamson. I have some

1342
53:12.480 --> 53:15.176
questions if that's okay.

1343
53:15.200 --> 53:17.575
Um, and my questions relate to the first

1344
53:17.599 --> 53:19.656
point, the noting and the receiving of

1345
53:19.680 --> 53:22.680
the report. Um, so I'm

1346
53:24.640 --> 53:26.216
kind of struggling with some of the

1347
53:26.240 --> 53:28.376
presentation.

1348
53:28.400 --> 53:31.016
Um, but look, first of all, what is the

1349
53:31.040 --> 53:33.815
special complaints arrangement that we

1350
53:33.839 --> 53:35.335
currently have?

1351
53:35.359 --> 53:36.856
Yeah. , through you, Madam Chair,

1352
53:36.880 --> 53:39.256
that's actually outlined in the code of

1353
53:39.280 --> 53:41.416
conduct policy and procedures. And so

1354
53:41.440 --> 53:44.055
you can um have a special complaints

1355
53:44.079 --> 53:45.575
arrangement with the office of local

1356
53:45.599 --> 53:47.335
government. So you apply to them to go

1357
53:47.359 --> 53:48.696
through that process.

1358
53:48.720 --> 53:50.696
Who applied for that?

1359
53:50.720 --> 53:51.736
Um that

1360
53:51.760 --> 53:53.496
there's no resolution of council

1361
53:53.520 --> 53:54.776
relating to that.

1362
53:54.800 --> 53:57.095
That can just be between the officers

1363
53:57.119 --> 53:59.736
and the office of local government

1364
53:59.760 --> 54:02.055
around it could be around the number of

1365
54:02.079 --> 54:03.815
and volume of complaints that come in

1366
54:03.839 --> 54:05.016
and that's the reason why you have a

1367
54:05.040 --> 54:07.416
special complaints arrangement. There is

1368
54:07.440 --> 54:09.496
delegation to the CEO. Okay. So the the

1369
54:09.520 --> 54:12.520
the non-counsel part of the organ

1370
54:12.559 --> 54:15.335
council part established that

1371
54:15.359 --> 54:17.095
arrangement

1372
54:17.119 --> 54:19.736
but the business the organization. Yes.

1373
54:19.760 --> 54:20.055
Yeah.

1374
54:20.079 --> 54:21.335
Okay.

1375
54:21.359 --> 54:24.216
Um

1376
54:24.240 --> 54:27.095
section three

1377
54:27.119 --> 54:30.119
says that sorry um

1378
54:30.480 --> 54:33.480
number of complaints tellies to 77.

1379
54:34.880 --> 54:37.880
Um, and then, , in item two, it says

1380
54:39.359 --> 54:42.359
that all 77 were finalized in 3 months.

1381
54:43.520 --> 54:46.520
Um, I'm aware of one that wasn't, and

1382
54:46.880 --> 54:49.016
I'm aware of one that wasn't resolved at

1383
54:49.040 --> 54:51.976
all. So, that doesn't appear to be

1384
54:52.000 --> 54:53.896
accurate.

1385
54:53.920 --> 54:56.856
Any thoughts on it?

1386
54:56.880 --> 54:58.616
Don't forget, Camp Williams, this is not

1387
54:58.640 --> 55:01.640
a council report. This comes to us as

1388
55:01.920 --> 55:03.496
is, doesn't it? Council does not prepare

1389
55:03.520 --> 55:05.335
this report. Is that correct?

1390
55:05.359 --> 55:08.359
I'm going to note it.

1391
55:08.400 --> 55:09.976
It doesn't appear to be accurate. So,

1392
55:10.000 --> 55:11.656
I'm just curious as to

1393
55:11.680 --> 55:13.575
any thoughts as to why that might be the

1394
55:13.599 --> 55:16.456
case.

1395
55:16.480 --> 55:19.416
, we take that question on notice.

1396
55:19.440 --> 55:19.736
Yeah.

1397
55:19.760 --> 55:22.760
All right. Um,

1398
55:23.200 --> 55:25.496
what is the process for advising the

1399
55:25.520 --> 55:28.520
public and counselors when a complaint

1400
55:28.559 --> 55:31.256
is resolved?

1401
55:31.280 --> 55:33.095
 through you madam chair. It depends

1402
55:33.119 --> 55:36.119
on what the um complaint  coordinator

1403
55:37.359 --> 55:39.095
oh sorry the complaints reviewer and

1404
55:39.119 --> 55:41.256
then the if it goes to investigation

1405
55:41.280 --> 55:43.575
process the investigator determines in

1406
55:43.599 --> 55:45.736
terms of making that recommendation

1407
55:45.760 --> 55:47.815
whether or not there was a finding um a

1408
55:47.839 --> 55:50.839
breach or not. Um and the um it is the

1409
55:51.599 --> 55:54.599
role then to then inform the complainant

1410
55:55.040 --> 55:57.016
and then also the appellant um in terms

1411
55:57.040 --> 55:59.335
of what the status of that investigation

1412
55:59.359 --> 56:00.936
process determined

1413
56:00.960 --> 56:02.216
or the conduct review process.

1414
56:02.240 --> 56:04.456
So the complaintant is advised as to the

1415
56:04.480 --> 56:05.095
outcome.

1416
56:05.119 --> 56:07.656
Yes.

1417
56:07.680 --> 56:10.616
Um, in section three, overview of

1418
56:10.640 --> 56:13.335
complaints and false

1419
56:13.359 --> 56:16.359
says that we had 62 of the 77 complaints

1420
56:19.119 --> 56:21.095
um referred to the office of local

1421
56:21.119 --> 56:24.119
government and 15 of the complaints

1422
56:25.520 --> 56:28.520
referred to a conduct reviewer and that

1423
56:28.720 --> 56:31.095
none were resolved by the general

1424
56:31.119 --> 56:34.119
manager or the mayor. Is that in fact

1425
56:34.160 --> 56:36.775
accurate? Has the general manager not

1426
56:36.799 --> 56:39.799
resolve any complaints

1427
56:40.559 --> 56:42.216
 through you madam chair? This

1428
56:42.240 --> 56:45.240
reporting period like I started in July.

1429
56:45.280 --> 56:48.280
So I only cover a month of or two months

1430
56:48.559 --> 56:50.856
almost in terms of um that reporting

1431
56:50.880 --> 56:53.496
period. So I can't speak for the um

1432
56:53.520 --> 56:56.216
before that time. But the data would

1433
56:56.240 --> 56:58.696
show that if the general manager or the

1434
56:58.720 --> 57:00.535
CEO at the time or the mayor, so if

1435
57:00.559 --> 57:02.775
that's a complaint against the CEO chose

1436
57:02.799 --> 57:05.799
to resolve the matter, um then that

1437
57:05.839 --> 57:07.335
information would be there. But noting

1438
57:07.359 --> 57:09.095
that's um for resolution after

1439
57:09.119 --> 57:11.176
preliminary assessment. So there's

1440
57:11.200 --> 57:13.335
stages in terms of when a complaint

1441
57:13.359 --> 57:15.416
first comes in, you might not

1442
57:15.440 --> 57:17.416
necessarily refer it on to a conduct

1443
57:17.440 --> 57:19.736
reviewer and the general manager under

1444
57:19.760 --> 57:22.535
the procedures is able to resolve it

1445
57:22.559 --> 57:24.696
there. If they decide to refer it on to

1446
57:24.720 --> 57:27.095
a conduct reviewer, they might come up

1447
57:27.119 --> 57:28.775
after the preliminary assessment and

1448
57:28.799 --> 57:30.295
make some recommendations. A

1449
57:30.319 --> 57:32.856
recommendation might be not to take it

1450
57:32.880 --> 57:34.696
to a final investigation and just to

1451
57:34.720 --> 57:37.176
resolve it there. The complaint um

1452
57:37.200 --> 57:39.176
sorry, the conduct reviewer might make a

1453
57:39.200 --> 57:41.016
recommendation to refer it on to

1454
57:41.040 --> 57:42.616
investigation. So that's a final

1455
57:42.640 --> 57:45.176
investigation process. This is outlined

1456
57:45.200 --> 57:47.976
in the model OOLG procedures for the

1457
57:48.000 --> 57:50.136
code of conduct. So this is not our

1458
57:50.160 --> 57:53.160
process. This is the state's process.

1459
57:53.440 --> 57:56.376
Okay. Um, so I'm aware of at least one

1460
57:56.400 --> 57:59.400
complaint that was resolved by the CEO

1461
57:59.440 --> 58:01.095
after preliminary.

1462
58:01.119 --> 58:02.696
Yeah. So it's after preliminary

1463
58:02.720 --> 58:04.295
assessment.

1464
58:04.319 --> 58:06.856
So that's what that actually states.

1465
58:06.880 --> 58:07.335
Okay.

1466
58:07.359 --> 58:07.896
Yeah.

1467
58:07.920 --> 58:10.920
Um, so I'm a little confused by the

1468
58:10.960 --> 58:13.960
math. So if we have 62 that were

1469
58:14.079 --> 58:17.079
referred to the office of OG

1470
58:17.119 --> 58:19.575
um under a special complaints management

1471
58:19.599 --> 58:22.599
arrangement and 15 that were referred to

1472
58:23.920 --> 58:26.216
a conduct reviewer they would add

1473
58:26.240 --> 58:28.295
together to be

1474
58:28.319 --> 58:31.319
77. Is that what to to match the total

1475
58:31.599 --> 58:34.599
that seems that works?

1476
58:34.640 --> 58:37.640
It does or or because that I presume C

1477
58:37.760 --> 58:40.696
means we sent to an a conduct reviewer.

1478
58:40.720 --> 58:41.815
Mhm.

1479
58:41.839 --> 58:44.839
Um, so if we sent 60, so there are 77 in

1480
58:46.240 --> 58:47.976
total. So you add those two numbers

1481
58:48.000 --> 58:51.000
together. That's great. Um, what does K3

1482
58:52.400 --> 58:55.400
mean? So we send another 10 to the OG.

1483
58:56.559 --> 58:58.616
Was that outside of the special

1484
58:58.640 --> 59:00.775
complaints arrangement that we have and

1485
59:00.799 --> 59:03.176
suddenly we'd have 87 complaints, not

1486
59:03.200 --> 59:04.535
77?

1487
59:04.559 --> 59:05.335
Yeah.

1488
59:05.359 --> 59:07.656
Thank you for chair.

1489
59:07.680 --> 59:10.680
There were 10 complaints. referred to a

1490
59:12.559 --> 59:14.216
a conduct reviewer

1491
59:14.240 --> 59:16.936
and those were then by the conduct

1492
59:16.960 --> 59:19.095
reviewer they were then there was a

1493
59:19.119 --> 59:21.416
recommendation accept which from the OG

1494
59:21.440 --> 59:24.440
that those passed on to the OG so you

1495
59:25.040 --> 59:28.040
know the report says we did both

1496
59:28.640 --> 59:31.176
and so there's an overlap in that

1497
59:31.200 --> 59:34.200
so they were 10 of the 15

1498
59:35.119 --> 59:37.335
listed in point C then so they didn't

1499
59:37.359 --> 59:38.696
originally go under the

1500
59:38.720 --> 59:40.696
they get marked various points in the

1501
59:40.720 --> 59:41.256
journey.

1502
59:41.280 --> 59:42.696
Yeah.

1503
59:42.720 --> 59:45.720
And this this new template of reporting

1504
59:45.839 --> 59:48.839
does require that we we end up with some

1505
59:48.960 --> 59:50.775
overlap in some of this and it's not

1506
59:50.799 --> 59:51.335
what's

1507
59:51.359 --> 59:52.775
Yeah. Know it's poorly designed. That's

1508
59:52.799 --> 59:54.696
clearly the Okay. Thank you.

1509
59:54.720 --> 59:57.720
Thank you. Um so on that council Higgins

1510
00:59:58.400 --> 01:00:00.535
 I just want to confirm I think in

1511
01:00:00.559 --> 01:00:03.095
point three council rose should that be

1512
01:00:03.119 --> 01:00:06.119
counselor behavior rather than council?

1513
01:00:06.480 --> 01:00:07.496
I'm not sure.

1514
01:00:07.520 --> 01:00:10.376
Yeah. Yes, thank you for keeping your

1515
01:00:10.400 --> 01:00:13.400
eye on the screen

1516
01:00:14.240 --> 01:00:15.815
to detail me.

1517
01:00:15.839 --> 01:00:17.256
Councelor Summers, are you speaking

1518
01:00:17.280 --> 01:00:18.456
against question?

1519
01:00:18.480 --> 01:00:20.535
Sorry question.

1520
01:00:20.559 --> 01:00:22.535
Thank you. Do we

1521
01:00:22.559 --> 01:00:24.216
Good to see. Good to see. Keep us on our

1522
01:00:24.240 --> 01:00:26.216
toes. Do we have a speaker against the

1523
01:00:26.240 --> 01:00:28.216
motion?

1524
01:00:28.240 --> 01:00:31.176
Councelor Rooney.

1525
01:00:31.200 --> 01:00:32.456
You have five minutes.

1526
01:00:32.480 --> 01:00:35.416
Yeah. Thanks.  look, I speak against

1527
01:00:35.440 --> 01:00:37.256
the motion because on two grounds.

1528
01:00:37.280 --> 01:00:40.280
Firstly, I believe it's misconceived and

1529
01:00:40.799 --> 01:00:43.416
secondly, I believe it's unnecessary. So

1530
01:00:43.440 --> 01:00:45.896
why is it misconceived? Well, because

1531
01:00:45.920 --> 01:00:48.295
councilors,

1532
01:00:48.319 --> 01:00:51.319
the standards of behavior are set by the

1533
01:00:51.760 --> 01:00:52.856
office of local government and the

1534
01:00:52.880 --> 01:00:55.880
minister and breaches

1535
01:00:56.400 --> 01:00:59.400
are within our own hour. You know, if we

1536
01:00:59.680 --> 01:01:01.575
if we choose to comply with the standard

1537
01:01:01.599 --> 01:01:03.976
of behavior set, there won't be any

1538
01:01:04.000 --> 01:01:06.616
breaches. If we want to behave

1539
01:01:06.640 --> 01:01:09.176
otherwise, there will be breaches. Now,

1540
01:01:09.200 --> 01:01:10.696
breaches

1541
01:01:10.720 --> 01:01:12.696
are Richard are identified, they're

1542
01:01:12.720 --> 01:01:15.720
committed by us, but they are identified

1543
01:01:16.000 --> 01:01:19.000
by members of the public, council staff,

1544
01:01:19.920 --> 01:01:22.920
other counselors or the GM. They are

1545
01:01:23.359 --> 01:01:26.295
simply identifying transgressions that

1546
01:01:26.319 --> 01:01:29.319
we commit against the code of conduct.

1547
01:01:29.680 --> 01:01:31.256
our counselors, if you're unhappy with

1548
01:01:31.280 --> 01:01:33.896
the numbers of breaches,

1549
01:01:33.920 --> 01:01:35.496
pull up your socks and prove your own

1550
01:01:35.520 --> 01:01:36.775
behavior because you're the ones

1551
01:01:36.799 --> 01:01:39.656
committing them. Now, I'm I'm not

1552
01:01:39.680 --> 01:01:42.680
meaning to single you out, counselor, by

1553
01:01:42.960 --> 01:01:44.295
looking at you. I just happen to be

1554
01:01:44.319 --> 01:01:46.696
resting on your physics at that moment.

1555
01:01:46.720 --> 01:01:48.856
So, council, it's within your power to

1556
01:01:48.880 --> 01:01:50.295
reduce the numbers of it's not within

1557
01:01:50.319 --> 01:01:52.616
the power of the the GM. She can't

1558
01:01:52.640 --> 01:01:54.376
reduce the numbers of breaches because

1559
01:01:54.400 --> 01:01:56.456
we are the ones committing them. So

1560
01:01:56.480 --> 01:01:59.480
councilors I would suggest to you let's

1561
01:01:59.680 --> 01:02:02.616
stop committing breaches. Now now I I

1562
01:02:02.640 --> 01:02:05.176
say that it's unnecessary because

1563
01:02:05.200 --> 01:02:07.416
councilors look at that bar chart that I

1564
01:02:07.440 --> 01:02:09.736
think is in the attachment  showing

1565
01:02:09.760 --> 01:02:12.136
recorded breaches  over the period

1566
01:02:12.160 --> 01:02:15.160
from February to Christmas last year and

1567
01:02:15.280 --> 01:02:18.280
you will see a strong downward trend in

1568
01:02:18.799 --> 01:02:21.335
the numbers of recorded breaches. Well

1569
01:02:21.359 --> 01:02:23.095
done councilors. Pat yourselves on the

1570
01:02:23.119 --> 01:02:25.815
back. You're doing very well. Look at

1571
01:02:25.839 --> 01:02:28.839
the  the period from  you know from

1572
01:02:29.359 --> 01:02:31.815
New Year's to date. There's a big

1573
01:02:31.839 --> 01:02:33.016
increase in British. Well, give

1574
01:02:33.040 --> 01:02:35.095
yourselves an uppercut.

1575
01:02:35.119 --> 01:02:37.496
You're the ones doing it. Not the GM.

1576
01:02:37.520 --> 01:02:38.856
It's you.

1577
01:02:38.880 --> 01:02:41.815
Now, council, I believe that now that

1578
01:02:41.839 --> 01:02:44.136
you understand the situation that we are

1579
01:02:44.160 --> 01:02:47.160
the ones at fault, you will return to

1580
01:02:47.440 --> 01:02:49.736
the good behavioral trend that you

1581
01:02:49.760 --> 01:02:52.216
showed last year. And I'm very confident

1582
01:02:52.240 --> 01:02:55.240
that the period from  March onwards

1583
01:02:55.599 --> 01:02:58.216
will show another strong decline.

1584
01:02:58.240 --> 01:03:01.095
What are you implying council?

1585
01:03:01.119 --> 01:03:04.119
I'm imply I guess within our hands

1586
01:03:05.200 --> 01:03:06.456
bridges

1587
01:03:06.480 --> 01:03:09.176
and I'm conf I I've got confidence in

1588
01:03:09.200 --> 01:03:12.136
you council and I believe that your

1589
01:03:12.160 --> 01:03:14.616
behavior will improve dramatically  in

1590
01:03:14.640 --> 01:03:17.176
the months going forward.  and now

1591
01:03:17.200 --> 01:03:20.200
getting going back to unnecessary um I'm

1592
01:03:20.720 --> 01:03:22.856
sure councelor Rose is well intended

1593
01:03:22.880 --> 01:03:25.880
with his   third suggestion there

1594
01:03:26.240 --> 01:03:28.376
that um we strengthen council behavior

1595
01:03:28.400 --> 01:03:31.256
govern and mod practices and so on. But

1596
01:03:31.280 --> 01:03:33.896
councilors that's what the GM and her

1597
01:03:33.920 --> 01:03:36.456
predecessors were doing all last year.

1598
01:03:36.480 --> 01:03:39.095
Don't you remember those interminable

1599
01:03:39.119 --> 01:03:41.416
workshops? very valuable workshops to be

1600
01:03:41.440 --> 01:03:44.295
honest. Seven more workshops we had on

1601
01:03:44.319 --> 01:03:45.736
the code of conduct and council

1602
01:03:45.760 --> 01:03:48.696
behavior. That's what it was intended to

1603
01:03:48.720 --> 01:03:51.720
do. Improve council of behavior. Now you

1604
01:03:52.079 --> 01:03:53.575
were all there. Well, sorry, you weren't

1605
01:03:53.599 --> 01:03:55.496
all there, but mostly you were there.

1606
01:03:55.520 --> 01:03:58.456
So, you know what to do council

1607
01:03:58.480 --> 01:03:59.496
because

1608
01:03:59.520 --> 01:04:02.520
why the code of conduct you know how to

1609
01:04:03.200 --> 01:04:05.416
behave well. I'm confident that you will

1610
01:04:05.440 --> 01:04:07.656
behave well and I'm very confident that

1611
01:04:07.680 --> 01:04:10.136
the numbers of preachers going forward

1612
01:04:10.160 --> 01:04:12.856
 will decline dramatically. So as well

1613
01:04:12.880 --> 01:04:15.880
intentioned as Gor Rose's amendment is

1614
01:04:17.359 --> 01:04:20.295
I I unfortunately cannot support it

1615
01:04:20.319 --> 01:04:22.616
because it is misconceived as to the

1616
01:04:22.640 --> 01:04:25.496
causes of breaches and is unnecessary

1617
01:04:25.520 --> 01:04:26.936
given that we're all going to be on our

1618
01:04:26.960 --> 01:04:28.376
investigation from now on. I'm quite

1619
01:04:28.400 --> 01:04:29.335
sure.

1620
01:04:29.359 --> 01:04:30.216
Thank you council.

1621
01:04:30.240 --> 01:04:31.976
Thank you councelor. Um just to um point

1622
01:04:32.000 --> 01:04:33.256
out this is not an amendment. is the

1623
01:04:33.280 --> 01:04:34.856
actual motion we're debating. Councelor

1624
01:04:34.880 --> 01:04:35.815
Stewart, you speaking?

1625
01:04:35.839 --> 01:04:37.575
No, I just not often I agree with

1626
01:04:37.599 --> 01:04:39.976
councelor Rooney, but we'll agree with

1627
01:04:40.000 --> 01:04:42.456
him on this point. I think he he made a

1628
01:04:42.480 --> 01:04:44.616
very very valid point that but rest with

1629
01:04:44.640 --> 01:04:47.640
us. We're elected to do this job and and

1630
01:04:48.079 --> 01:04:50.936
you know, you can be you can be stern in

1631
01:04:50.960 --> 01:04:52.535
your in what what you want in the

1632
01:04:52.559 --> 01:04:54.136
arguments and that, but we've still got

1633
01:04:54.160 --> 01:04:56.376
a code of conduct go under and we should

1634
01:04:56.400 --> 01:04:58.856
adhere to that. So, no, I think we're

1635
01:04:58.880 --> 01:05:01.736
just carrying on. just get over it,

1636
01:05:01.760 --> 01:05:02.775
get on with the job.

1637
01:05:02.799 --> 01:05:03.815
Thank you. So, it's two speakers

1638
01:05:03.839 --> 01:05:05.256
against. Do we have a speaker for

1639
01:05:05.280 --> 01:05:06.535
I wanted to foreshadow it.

1640
01:05:06.559 --> 01:05:08.696
A foreshadowed amendment or foreshadowed

1641
01:05:08.720 --> 01:05:11.256
motion motion to be the officer's

1642
01:05:11.280 --> 01:05:13.015
recommendation. We have a foreshadowed

1643
01:05:13.039 --> 01:05:13.496
against.

1644
01:05:13.520 --> 01:05:15.575
Okay. Foreshadowed motion. Thank you,

1645
01:05:15.599 --> 01:05:18.376
councelor Summers.

1646
01:05:18.400 --> 01:05:20.456
Um, so do we have a speaker for the

1647
01:05:20.480 --> 01:05:23.480
current motion on the board?

1648
01:05:24.319 --> 01:05:25.736
, with that, councelor Rose, would you

1649
01:05:25.760 --> 01:05:26.775
like your right of reply?

1650
01:05:26.799 --> 01:05:28.216
I'd actually like to speak against it.

1651
01:05:28.240 --> 01:05:30.616
And so here. Oh, we've really just had

1652
01:05:30.640 --> 01:05:32.456
two speakers against in a row.

1653
01:05:32.480 --> 01:05:35.015
Um,

1654
01:05:35.039 --> 01:05:37.736
agree with councelor Rooney and

1655
01:05:37.760 --> 01:05:38.936
councelor Stewart.

1656
01:05:38.960 --> 01:05:39.736
Okay,

1657
01:05:39.760 --> 01:05:41.575
this is about us.

1658
01:05:41.599 --> 01:05:44.599
We need to respect

1659
01:05:46.480 --> 01:05:48.295
respect our position

1660
01:05:48.319 --> 01:05:50.775
and actually demonstrate leadership in

1661
01:05:50.799 --> 01:05:52.136
this community.

1662
01:05:52.160 --> 01:05:53.815
And it's been really really difficult

1663
01:05:53.839 --> 01:05:55.176
because we have had difficult

1664
01:05:55.200 --> 01:05:57.656
circumstances. However,

1665
01:05:57.680 --> 01:06:00.680
we still need to just behave. I

1666
01:06:01.280 --> 01:06:03.176
understand. I can actually see what

1667
01:06:03.200 --> 01:06:06.200
council Rose is endeavoring to do, but

1668
01:06:06.720 --> 01:06:09.335
we're just creating more red tape. We're

1669
01:06:09.359 --> 01:06:10.936
just creating another report from the

1670
01:06:10.960 --> 01:06:12.216
CEO

1671
01:06:12.240 --> 01:06:14.456
and we need her to do the things that we

1672
01:06:14.480 --> 01:06:17.480
really want her to do and not be bogged

1673
01:06:17.599 --> 01:06:20.599
down with our

1674
01:06:20.799 --> 01:06:23.335
our reports. That shouldn't even have to

1675
01:06:23.359 --> 01:06:26.359
happen because we have a process where

1676
01:06:26.480 --> 01:06:27.976
we didn't comply with the code of

1677
01:06:28.000 --> 01:06:31.000
conduct or we haven't built up enough

1678
01:06:31.839 --> 01:06:34.839
respect for the role of being a

1679
01:06:35.119 --> 01:06:37.736
counselor and a leader in our community

1680
01:06:37.760 --> 01:06:40.055
and we just need to get on with it.

1681
01:06:40.079 --> 01:06:41.015
Thank you.

1682
01:06:41.039 --> 01:06:42.295
Thank you counelor. I thought they might

1683
01:06:42.319 --> 01:06:43.656
help you with your right of reply given

1684
01:06:43.680 --> 01:06:44.936
that you may want to address many of the

1685
01:06:44.960 --> 01:06:46.456
issues raised in the debate. I cannot

1686
01:06:46.480 --> 01:06:47.896
have another speaker again. Specific

1687
01:06:47.920 --> 01:06:49.176
question. Yes, this is a question

1688
01:06:49.200 --> 01:06:52.200
through you madame mayor to the  to

1689
01:06:52.640 --> 01:06:55.640
the speaker item  question item three

1690
01:06:56.480 --> 01:06:59.480
B3 could you give me an example of how

1691
01:06:59.520 --> 01:07:01.976
the CEO can strengthen counselor

1692
01:07:02.000 --> 01:07:04.216
behavior when you have an individual

1693
01:07:04.240 --> 01:07:06.856
who's perhaps

1694
01:07:06.880 --> 01:07:08.216
or maybe 11 council

1695
01:07:08.240 --> 01:07:11.176
11 councils who perhaps don't want to

1696
01:07:11.200 --> 01:07:12.936
change their behavior I think you're

1697
01:07:12.960 --> 01:07:15.960
asking of the staff the impossible

1698
01:07:16.799 --> 01:07:18.856
thank you I may But that's the that's

1699
01:07:18.880 --> 01:07:20.775
the resolution that I'm wanting. I

1700
01:07:20.799 --> 01:07:22.216
believe there are things that the CEO

1701
01:07:22.240 --> 01:07:24.456
can see. Yes, that's one of her

1702
01:07:24.480 --> 01:07:27.416
important roles and um is to interact

1703
01:07:27.440 --> 01:07:29.575
with us around this. So I'll just have

1704
01:07:29.599 --> 01:07:31.976
my writer reply which I think is I

1705
01:07:32.000 --> 01:07:34.936
understand people's people's concern to

1706
01:07:34.960 --> 01:07:36.856
that we just sort of reinventing the

1707
01:07:36.880 --> 01:07:38.295
wheel. I don't think it is a reinvention

1708
01:07:38.319 --> 01:07:40.936
of the wheel here because I think what

1709
01:07:40.960 --> 01:07:42.856
we've got is a very significant number

1710
01:07:42.880 --> 01:07:45.496
of complaints, 77 complaints. is taking

1711
01:07:45.520 --> 01:07:48.376
up huge amounts of staff time and

1712
01:07:48.400 --> 01:07:50.535
enormous cost. The problem is with the

1713
01:07:50.559 --> 01:07:52.136
code of conduct procedures, we don't

1714
01:07:52.160 --> 01:07:53.736
even know what they are.

1715
01:07:53.760 --> 01:07:55.976
So there's a there's a hidden story here

1716
01:07:56.000 --> 01:07:59.000
and only the CEO knows. So we're kept in

1717
01:07:59.039 --> 01:08:01.095
the dark and you know there's there's

1718
01:08:01.119 --> 01:08:03.015
nothing transparent about this. You

1719
01:08:03.039 --> 01:08:05.015
couldn't actually have a more closed and

1720
01:08:05.039 --> 01:08:07.736
 and  obscure process because

1721
01:08:07.760 --> 01:08:09.815
there's complaints about which none of

1722
01:08:09.839 --> 01:08:12.839
us know anything. So it's a it's a crazy

1723
01:08:13.039 --> 01:08:15.176
situation. We're caught in a trap where

1724
01:08:15.200 --> 01:08:16.775
these complaints are confidential. We

1725
01:08:16.799 --> 01:08:18.376
don't know what they are. There's 77 of

1726
01:08:18.400 --> 01:08:20.376
them. It's costing tens of thousands of

1727
01:08:20.400 --> 01:08:22.376
dollars and we don't know what the what

1728
01:08:22.400 --> 01:08:23.896
we need to do. It's not just a matter of

1729
01:08:23.920 --> 01:08:26.920
adhering to the code of conduct because

1730
01:08:27.359 --> 01:08:29.416
councelor Davis as you would have noted

1731
01:08:29.440 --> 01:08:31.496
with the minister

1732
01:08:31.520 --> 01:08:34.135
the minister's own

1733
01:08:34.159 --> 01:08:35.815
statement on this issue are the reasons

1734
01:08:35.839 --> 01:08:37.655
for the change in the code of conduct is

1735
01:08:37.679 --> 01:08:38.856
because he believes that there are

1736
01:08:38.880 --> 01:08:41.576
various trivial various trivial

1737
01:08:41.600 --> 01:08:43.735
weaponized code of conducts being used

1738
01:08:43.759 --> 01:08:45.655
around counselors not only just ours but

1739
01:08:45.679 --> 01:08:47.976
across the state. So there is a pro

1740
01:08:48.000 --> 01:08:49.815
process and problem in the process

1741
01:08:49.839 --> 01:08:52.215
already. So firstly, we don't know what

1742
01:08:52.239 --> 01:08:55.175
the 77 things are and we'll never know.

1743
01:08:55.199 --> 01:08:56.456
Um, so we don't even know what we're

1744
01:08:56.480 --> 01:08:58.295
dealing with. The second thing is there

1745
01:08:58.319 --> 01:09:00.775
are a range of trivial complaints and

1746
01:09:00.799 --> 01:09:03.096
and the process has been weaponized

1747
01:09:03.120 --> 01:09:05.255
according to the minister. So we already

1748
01:09:05.279 --> 01:09:06.856
know that this is being misused and

1749
01:09:06.880 --> 01:09:08.215
there's an intention to do something

1750
01:09:08.239 --> 01:09:10.775
different. All we're asking for here is

1751
01:09:10.799 --> 01:09:13.799
for the CEO to provide some strategies.

1752
01:09:14.000 --> 01:09:15.815
We don't know what the issues are. We

1753
01:09:15.839 --> 01:09:17.735
don't know what the complaints are. It's

1754
01:09:17.759 --> 01:09:19.815
very reasonable to actually ask the CEO

1755
01:09:19.839 --> 01:09:21.255
having considered all these things to

1756
01:09:21.279 --> 01:09:22.695
provide come back and provide us with

1757
01:09:22.719 --> 01:09:25.416
some advice. This isn't something that's

1758
01:09:25.440 --> 01:09:27.175
this is um I could knock this off. It

1759
01:09:27.199 --> 01:09:30.199
was me doing it in half an hour. So um I

1760
01:09:30.239 --> 01:09:31.976
I don't think there's a big load here on

1761
01:09:32.000 --> 01:09:33.815
the CEO. I think it's a very reasonable

1762
01:09:33.839 --> 01:09:36.536
story given the extent of the number of

1763
01:09:36.560 --> 01:09:38.056
complaints, the cost, and the fact that

1764
01:09:38.080 --> 01:09:39.896
we just don't know anything. This will

1765
01:09:39.920 --> 01:09:41.416
give us a way forward. So I think it's

1766
01:09:41.440 --> 01:09:43.576
something we just should support.

1767
01:09:43.600 --> 01:09:44.775
Thank you, Councelor Rose. With that,

1768
01:09:44.799 --> 01:09:47.735
I'll put the motion. All those in favor,

1769
01:09:47.759 --> 01:09:49.896
councelor Higgins, Councelor Williamson,

1770
01:09:49.920 --> 01:09:52.920
Councelor Rose, those against, Councelor

1771
01:09:53.600 --> 01:09:55.816
Summers, Councelor Stewart, Councelor

1772
01:09:55.840 --> 01:09:57.816
Rooney, Councelor Davis, Councelor

1773
01:09:57.840 --> 01:10:00.616
Elliot, Councelor Hopkins. The motion is

1774
01:10:00.640 --> 01:10:03.496
lost. With that, we will return to the

1775
01:10:03.520 --> 01:10:05.655
foreshadowed motion from Linda Summers,

1776
01:10:05.679 --> 01:10:08.679
Councelor Summers, which is  that just

1777
01:10:09.120 --> 01:10:12.120
moment up. Um the motion we will now

1778
01:10:12.239 --> 01:10:15.239
debate is that  council receive a note

1779
01:10:16.480 --> 01:10:18.616
the code of conduct complaints report

1780
01:10:18.640 --> 01:10:21.640
for the period 1 September 2024 to 31

1781
01:10:21.679 --> 01:10:24.536
August 2025. Do I have a second for this

1782
01:10:24.560 --> 01:10:27.016
motion? Councelor Davis, Council

1783
01:10:27.040 --> 01:10:28.215
Summers, would you like to speak to your

1784
01:10:28.239 --> 01:10:28.616
motion?

1785
01:10:28.640 --> 01:10:30.456
Yes, very briefly. I think a lot of the

1786
01:10:30.480 --> 01:10:32.456
um lot of the discussion has been had

1787
01:10:32.480 --> 01:10:35.480
that I'm very much  in favor of 

1788
01:10:35.520 --> 01:10:38.520
reducing um unnecessary  work for the

1789
01:10:39.360 --> 01:10:42.360
staff and I really can't see how um we

1790
01:10:42.400 --> 01:10:45.096
could expect of the staff being able to

1791
01:10:45.120 --> 01:10:48.120
ameliate the behavior of um of intangent

1792
01:10:48.880 --> 01:10:51.416
um counselors regardless of who they are

1793
01:10:51.440 --> 01:10:53.976
is definitely on to us. So I think the

1794
01:10:54.000 --> 01:10:56.536
fact that it's noted I I do have one

1795
01:10:56.560 --> 01:10:59.016
query though on it it there was mention

1796
01:10:59.040 --> 01:11:02.040
made that the 77 complaints that some

1797
01:11:02.080 --> 01:11:04.456
may have been weaponized even though

1798
01:11:04.480 --> 01:11:06.296
they are trivial. It's not my

1799
01:11:06.320 --> 01:11:08.616
understanding that a great number of our

1800
01:11:08.640 --> 01:11:11.640
complaints are trivial. I might need to

1801
01:11:11.679 --> 01:11:14.679
seek advice on that, but  I think it's

1802
01:11:14.800 --> 01:11:16.776
just appropriate to note it and I'm

1803
01:11:16.800 --> 01:11:19.336
looking forward to um the next three

1804
01:11:19.360 --> 01:11:21.736
months, which I'd like to confidently

1805
01:11:21.760 --> 01:11:24.056
predict with  other councils that

1806
01:11:24.080 --> 01:11:26.856
mentioned it may see improvement.

1807
01:11:26.880 --> 01:11:28.536
Um councils, given that councilors don't

1808
01:11:28.560 --> 01:11:29.896
know the details of complaints, it's

1809
01:11:29.920 --> 01:11:31.175
probably difficult for us to decide if

1810
01:11:31.199 --> 01:11:32.456
they're trivial or not given we don't

1811
01:11:32.480 --> 01:11:33.976
know

1812
01:11:34.000 --> 01:11:35.416
that they were weaponized. That's right.

1813
01:11:35.440 --> 01:11:37.336
But it would be personal opinion.

1814
01:11:37.360 --> 01:11:39.336
Sorry. Can I um councelor Summers as

1815
01:11:39.360 --> 01:11:41.096
through you madam chair just to clarify

1816
01:11:41.120 --> 01:11:43.736
councelor Summer's question. So the code

1817
01:11:43.760 --> 01:11:45.576
of um conduct procedures for the

1818
01:11:45.600 --> 01:11:46.856
administration of the model code of

1819
01:11:46.880 --> 01:11:49.016
conduct is actually a publicly available

1820
01:11:49.040 --> 01:11:50.936
document. It's the state government's

1821
01:11:50.960 --> 01:11:53.336
document there. So the procedures is

1822
01:11:53.360 --> 01:11:55.976
like a recipe. It goes step by step. So

1823
01:11:56.000 --> 01:11:57.816
when a first when a complaint actually

1824
01:11:57.840 --> 01:12:00.840
comes in under clauses 4.1 through to

1825
01:12:01.520 --> 01:12:04.520
4.3, it actually outlines what is a code

1826
01:12:04.880 --> 01:12:06.936
of conduct complaint. So when a

1827
01:12:06.960 --> 01:12:08.776
complaint comes in, it's assessed

1828
01:12:08.800 --> 01:12:11.175
through those criteria to um to see

1829
01:12:11.199 --> 01:12:13.175
whether or not um it meets the

1830
01:12:13.199 --> 01:12:14.695
definition of what a code of conduct

1831
01:12:14.719 --> 01:12:17.016
complaint is. And then the procedures

1832
01:12:17.040 --> 01:12:19.336
then outlines how the complaint is then

1833
01:12:19.360 --> 01:12:21.175
handled. Is it handled at that first

1834
01:12:21.199 --> 01:12:23.576
stage that I explained earlier where you

1835
01:12:23.600 --> 01:12:25.496
decide to resolve it through alternative

1836
01:12:25.520 --> 01:12:27.336
means without referring it on to a

1837
01:12:27.360 --> 01:12:29.175
conduct reviewer or if you decide to

1838
01:12:29.199 --> 01:12:31.416
refer it on to the conduct reviewer um

1839
01:12:31.440 --> 01:12:34.296
taking into um consideration of their

1840
01:12:34.320 --> 01:12:36.135
recommendations whether or not to refer

1841
01:12:36.159 --> 01:12:38.135
it to the next stage or to then resolve

1842
01:12:38.159 --> 01:12:40.296
it there and then or if they decide to

1843
01:12:40.320 --> 01:12:42.536
refer it on um whether it's to another

1844
01:12:42.560 --> 01:12:45.560
agency or um refer it for investigation.

1845
01:12:45.920 --> 01:12:47.736
It's also outlined in the procedures.

1846
01:12:47.760 --> 01:12:49.655
This is not a secret document. It's a

1847
01:12:49.679 --> 01:12:51.736
publicly available doc document.

1848
01:12:51.760 --> 01:12:54.760
Thank you.  speaker against councelor

1849
01:12:55.920 --> 01:12:58.695
Rose. Um

1850
01:12:58.719 --> 01:13:00.456
thank you for the opportunity to to say

1851
01:13:00.480 --> 01:13:03.336
something. I think that there's I think

1852
01:13:03.360 --> 01:13:04.695
councelor Summers may have

1853
01:13:04.719 --> 01:13:06.536
misunderstood. I didn't say any of these

1854
01:13:06.560 --> 01:13:07.896
things were trivial, but they could be

1855
01:13:07.920 --> 01:13:10.056
trivial. The the issue that the minister

1856
01:13:10.080 --> 01:13:11.736
pointed out is that there are very large

1857
01:13:11.760 --> 01:13:14.135
number of complaints in all councils and

1858
01:13:14.159 --> 01:13:16.536
many of them are trivial. So I think

1859
01:13:16.560 --> 01:13:19.416
that that's the the issue. We don't know

1860
01:13:19.440 --> 01:13:22.215
and and while the CEO has outlined the

1861
01:13:22.239 --> 01:13:25.175
process, we've got no idea of knowing

1862
01:13:25.199 --> 01:13:26.616
what the complaints are and what they

1863
01:13:26.640 --> 01:13:29.496
relate to. And secondly, I think we've

1864
01:13:29.520 --> 01:13:32.520
already heard in a separate meeting that

1865
01:13:32.640 --> 01:13:35.496
there's a tendency for complaints to be

1866
01:13:35.520 --> 01:13:38.056
to be pushed up the line so rather than

1867
01:13:38.080 --> 01:13:40.056
resolved locally. So we've heard that

1868
01:13:40.080 --> 01:13:42.456
that's happening and um that be

1869
01:13:42.480 --> 01:13:45.480
abundance of caution or issues around

1870
01:13:45.520 --> 01:13:47.816
concerns or potential risk about the

1871
01:13:47.840 --> 01:13:50.536
complaints but for whatever it is almost

1872
01:13:50.560 --> 01:13:53.016
nothing is being resolved here locally.

1873
01:13:53.040 --> 01:13:55.256
I still make my point that this is not

1874
01:13:55.280 --> 01:13:57.896
just a matter of noting because there's

1875
01:13:57.920 --> 01:13:59.655
a serious issue that lies behind this

1876
01:13:59.679 --> 01:14:01.576
which we have no knowledge of and we'll

1877
01:14:01.600 --> 01:14:03.816
never know but it's important for us to

1878
01:14:03.840 --> 01:14:06.616
know something because otherwise we will

1879
01:14:06.640 --> 01:14:08.695
just keep on going on in this situation

1880
01:14:08.719 --> 01:14:11.096
and I must say that we won't know it in

1881
01:14:11.120 --> 01:14:13.175
3 months because this is a report that's

1882
01:14:13.199 --> 01:14:15.576
annual and so the report that we've got

1883
01:14:15.600 --> 01:14:17.655
here is a a report that we've had over a

1884
01:14:17.679 --> 01:14:19.175
12-month period. We won't know anything

1885
01:14:19.199 --> 01:14:21.256
in 3 months. We've got a separate issue

1886
01:14:21.280 --> 01:14:24.280
which is the PIO report and there's no

1887
01:14:24.320 --> 01:14:26.296
indication this date that we're going to

1888
01:14:26.320 --> 01:14:28.776
continue with the PIO report. So I think

1889
01:14:28.800 --> 01:14:30.616
this we need to do much more than noting

1890
01:14:30.640 --> 01:14:32.536
this and I think it's been a mistake so

1891
01:14:32.560 --> 01:14:35.096
I'd have to vote against it.

1892
01:14:35.120 --> 01:14:38.120
I speak for the motion

1893
01:14:38.480 --> 01:14:39.816
Davis.

1894
01:14:39.840 --> 01:14:42.776
 I'm speaking for this motion.  the

1895
01:14:42.800 --> 01:14:45.800
whole process around the code of conduct

1896
01:14:45.840 --> 01:14:48.695
complaints is that they're confidential.

1897
01:14:48.719 --> 01:14:51.576
nobody does and they can't be spoken

1898
01:14:51.600 --> 01:14:53.736
about. That is part of the process that

1899
01:14:53.760 --> 01:14:55.736
the confidentiality

1900
01:14:55.760 --> 01:14:58.456
whilst that's very very frustrating.

1901
01:14:58.480 --> 01:15:01.480
Um my view is that most of the councils

1902
01:15:02.800 --> 01:15:05.655
have very good intention to be

1903
01:15:05.679 --> 01:15:08.456
respectful and comply with the code of

1904
01:15:08.480 --> 01:15:11.480
conduct but some don't. And in that case

1905
01:15:12.719 --> 01:15:15.719
 it's not just us who have  been 

1906
01:15:18.880 --> 01:15:20.856
affected by the code of conduct. It's

1907
01:15:20.880 --> 01:15:22.695
also staff. It could be community

1908
01:15:22.719 --> 01:15:25.496
members and anybody can put in a breach

1909
01:15:25.520 --> 01:15:28.520
of code of conduct. So we won't know

1910
01:15:28.800 --> 01:15:30.856
because of the confidentiality around

1911
01:15:30.880 --> 01:15:33.576
the process which is in the act. It is

1912
01:15:33.600 --> 01:15:36.296
confidential.  and no matter what we

1913
01:15:36.320 --> 01:15:39.320
do in regard to a report or we do we

1914
01:15:40.080 --> 01:15:43.080
have had so much training and I don't

1915
01:15:43.520 --> 01:15:45.096
think any more training is going to

1916
01:15:45.120 --> 01:15:47.896
actually change exactly what our

1917
01:15:47.920 --> 01:15:50.695
understanding is of the of this part of

1918
01:15:50.719 --> 01:15:53.719
the act and we just need to move forward

1919
01:15:55.120 --> 01:15:57.096
and work with our staff and be

1920
01:15:57.120 --> 01:16:00.120
respectful work as a team and actually

1921
01:16:00.159 --> 01:16:03.159
try and improve our processes so that

1922
01:16:03.360 --> 01:16:05.096
the community gets the services that

1923
01:16:05.120 --> 01:16:07.976
they need and that means we just need to

1924
01:16:08.000 --> 01:16:10.776
get on with it.  and unfortunately

1925
01:16:10.800 --> 01:16:13.416
because of this part of the act we won't

1926
01:16:13.440 --> 01:16:15.736
know what you would like to know council

1927
01:16:15.760 --> 01:16:18.760
rose and that's frustrating but it is

1928
01:16:18.880 --> 01:16:21.880
what it is.

1929
01:16:22.960 --> 01:16:25.960
Thank you speaker against.

1930
01:16:27.120 --> 01:16:29.416
 do we have another speaker Paul or

1931
01:16:29.440 --> 01:16:30.536
should we just go straight to the right

1932
01:16:30.560 --> 01:16:32.456
of reply? Councelor Summers, would you

1933
01:16:32.480 --> 01:16:34.296
like a right of reply? It's just very

1934
01:16:34.320 --> 01:16:37.320
briefly to say that um  I agree with

1935
01:16:38.000 --> 01:16:39.976
councelor Davies. I don't think um

1936
01:16:40.000 --> 01:16:43.000
councelor um Rose needs to be too

1937
01:16:43.360 --> 01:16:45.496
perturbed by this because we will

1938
01:16:45.520 --> 01:16:48.135
continue to get  reports. There is a

1939
01:16:48.159 --> 01:16:50.135
very strict framework that code of

1940
01:16:50.159 --> 01:16:52.296
conducts code of conduct complaints go

1941
01:16:52.320 --> 01:16:54.776
in under and the members of the

1942
01:16:54.800 --> 01:16:57.655
community also contribute. So, councelor

1943
01:16:57.679 --> 01:16:59.896
Rose says he hasn't put any in and never

1944
01:16:59.920 --> 01:17:02.135
will. And there are other councils in

1945
01:17:02.159 --> 01:17:03.576
the same boat, but there are members of

1946
01:17:03.600 --> 01:17:05.496
the community who have a right to

1947
01:17:05.520 --> 01:17:07.976
express their concerns as well. So the

1948
01:17:08.000 --> 01:17:11.000
numbers are difficult and it's difficult

1949
01:17:11.120 --> 01:17:12.695
that we don't know what they are but

1950
01:17:12.719 --> 01:17:14.776
it's the process that we have and I just

1951
01:17:14.800 --> 01:17:17.416
don't think we need to add another layer

1952
01:17:17.440 --> 01:17:20.440
to the um CEO's um responsibilities

1953
01:17:22.000 --> 01:17:25.000
which is trying to um alter human

1954
01:17:25.920 --> 01:17:28.920
behavior in in the face of I think quite

1955
01:17:29.520 --> 01:17:31.175
difficult but it would be a very

1956
01:17:31.199 --> 01:17:33.096
difficult challenge. So I think we note

1957
01:17:33.120 --> 01:17:36.120
it. We all abide by the code of conduct.

1958
01:17:37.120 --> 01:17:39.336
It's our behavior that is the issue, not

1959
01:17:39.360 --> 01:17:41.655
the number of code of conducts and leave

1960
01:17:41.679 --> 01:17:43.976
it rest with one less report for the CEO

1961
01:17:44.000 --> 01:17:46.376
to have to worry about. Thank you. With

1962
01:17:46.400 --> 01:17:47.655
that, I put the motion that council

1963
01:17:47.679 --> 01:17:49.096
receive and note the code of conduct

1964
01:17:49.120 --> 01:17:51.496
complaints for the period 1 September 24

1965
01:17:51.520 --> 01:17:54.520
to 3125. All those in favor, councelor

1966
01:17:54.719 --> 01:17:57.719
Summers, Higgins, Stewart, Rose, Rooney,

1967
01:17:58.640 --> 01:18:01.496
Davis, Elliot, and Hopkins. Those

1968
01:18:01.520 --> 01:18:04.135
against councelor Williamson. The motion

1969
01:18:04.159 --> 01:18:05.896
is carried.

1970
01:18:05.920 --> 01:18:08.920
Moving on to 9.3.7, an update on the

1971
01:18:09.440 --> 01:18:11.816
financial sustainability review actions.

1972
01:18:11.840 --> 01:18:13.256
Councelor Rose,

1973
01:18:13.280 --> 01:18:15.336
um could you just clarify? We've got the

1974
01:18:15.360 --> 01:18:17.496
resolution action sheets. Will are they

1975
01:18:17.520 --> 01:18:18.776
going to be dealt with under this

1976
01:18:18.800 --> 01:18:20.135
particular item or

1977
01:18:20.159 --> 01:18:21.416
No, that will be dealt with under item

1978
01:18:21.440 --> 01:18:23.976
9.5.1.

1979
01:18:24.000 --> 01:18:27.000
We're currently at 9.3.7.

1980
01:18:27.840 --> 01:18:30.840
 sorry 9.3.7 update on the financial

1981
01:18:30.960 --> 01:18:32.695
sustainability review actions that the

1982
01:18:32.719 --> 01:18:34.376
progress against the recommendations

1983
01:18:34.400 --> 01:18:37.016
recommendations be noted or do we have a

1984
01:18:37.040 --> 01:18:38.536
council Davis you moving the office's

1985
01:18:38.560 --> 01:18:41.560
recommendation and second era

1986
01:18:41.920 --> 01:18:44.920
anybody like to second this council rose

1987
01:18:45.120 --> 01:18:47.256
councelor Davis would you like to move

1988
01:18:47.280 --> 01:18:49.416
councelor Davis second to councelor Rose

1989
01:18:49.440 --> 01:18:50.776
councelor Davis

1990
01:18:50.800 --> 01:18:52.616
 we're noting this report and it's

1991
01:18:52.640 --> 01:18:55.416
around our progress

1992
01:18:55.440 --> 01:18:58.440
 I I'd actually personally like to see

1993
01:18:59.440 --> 01:19:02.440
 the service level  the service

1994
01:19:02.480 --> 01:19:05.480
levels be  sorted out this year. It it

1995
01:19:06.560 --> 01:19:09.560
would make it so much easier for us to

1996
01:19:09.600 --> 01:19:11.496
make good decisions in regard to budget

1997
01:19:11.520 --> 01:19:14.135
preparation if we know exactly what our

1998
01:19:14.159 --> 01:19:17.096
required service level is.  and I know

1999
01:19:17.120 --> 01:19:19.576
it's a hard piece of work and that the

2000
01:19:19.600 --> 01:19:21.576
strategic team have been really working

2001
01:19:21.600 --> 01:19:24.600
on this very very hard but   after a

2002
01:19:25.760 --> 01:19:27.256
number of years of asking for this piece

2003
01:19:27.280 --> 01:19:28.695
of work I'd actually like to see that

2004
01:19:28.719 --> 01:19:30.695
happen. It's good to see that we're

2005
01:19:30.719 --> 01:19:33.256
still progressing against this  really

2006
01:19:33.280 --> 01:19:36.280
important  program and that um we

2007
01:19:37.920 --> 01:19:40.920
actually  get to a  an outcome where

2008
01:19:42.640 --> 01:19:44.296
most of these actions are actually

2009
01:19:44.320 --> 01:19:47.320
completed in this next financial year.

2010
01:19:47.440 --> 01:19:47.896
Thank you.

2011
01:19:47.920 --> 01:19:49.496
Thank you. Do we have any questions?

2012
01:19:49.520 --> 01:19:50.936
Yes, councelor Rose.

2013
01:19:50.960 --> 01:19:52.536
I've got a number of questions. I think

2014
01:19:52.560 --> 01:19:53.736
this is one of the most important

2015
01:19:53.760 --> 01:19:55.416
reports we've received because it

2016
01:19:55.440 --> 01:19:58.376
identifies a range of issues for us.

2017
01:19:58.400 --> 01:20:00.135
The first one really is the overall

2018
01:20:00.159 --> 01:20:02.856
financial position where we've got

2019
01:20:02.880 --> 01:20:05.016
underlying financial deficit and the

2020
01:20:05.040 --> 01:20:07.896
financial sustainability risks remains

2021
01:20:07.920 --> 01:20:10.920
high. Um, and that's not acceptable.

2022
01:20:11.840 --> 01:20:14.215
So what is the current projected

2023
01:20:14.239 --> 01:20:16.215
timeline for moving from an underlying

2024
01:20:16.239 --> 01:20:18.616
deficit to a structurally sustainable

2025
01:20:18.640 --> 01:20:21.640
surplus position? And I suppose what are

2026
01:20:22.239 --> 01:20:25.239
the the the major assumptions in a

2027
01:20:25.280 --> 01:20:28.215
long-term financial plan that present

2028
01:20:28.239 --> 01:20:31.096
the greatest risk. So we've got a

2029
01:20:31.120 --> 01:20:33.976
significant financial risk. We as

2030
01:20:34.000 --> 01:20:37.000
counselors need to um oversee that to

2031
01:20:37.600 --> 01:20:39.976
see to understand what that financial

2032
01:20:40.000 --> 01:20:41.416
risk is. And we need to know what

2033
01:20:41.440 --> 01:20:44.376
strategies are being put in place to

2034
01:20:44.400 --> 01:20:47.400
minimize that risk and change the risk

2035
01:20:47.679 --> 01:20:50.679
from high to something in the acceptable

2036
01:20:50.880 --> 01:20:51.336
range.

2037
01:20:51.360 --> 01:20:52.695
Council Rose, we do have a long-term

2038
01:20:52.719 --> 01:20:54.536
financial plan which does span 10 years

2039
01:20:54.560 --> 01:20:56.056
which obviously is broken down to the

2040
01:20:56.080 --> 01:20:57.496
delivery program and the operational

2041
01:20:57.520 --> 01:21:00.135
plan which is indeed addressing this.

2042
01:21:00.159 --> 01:21:01.416
I don't think it does address it because

2043
01:21:01.440 --> 01:21:03.336
the 10-year financial plan only just

2044
01:21:03.360 --> 01:21:06.360
assumes a range of increases in in KPIs

2045
01:21:08.320 --> 01:21:10.376
over that 10 period. We've we've got the

2046
01:21:10.400 --> 01:21:13.400
the um the SRV, but the rate peg um um

2047
01:21:14.880 --> 01:21:17.016
is is a is an issue for us because I

2048
01:21:17.040 --> 01:21:19.016
think it's the inflation rate is greater

2049
01:21:19.040 --> 01:21:20.936
than the rate peg increase. We've we've

2050
01:21:20.960 --> 01:21:23.256
got a range of issues like that. What

2051
01:21:23.280 --> 01:21:26.280
we've got is a high risk and we've got I

2052
01:21:26.719 --> 01:21:29.336
haven't seen a a plan that says here's

2053
01:21:29.360 --> 01:21:32.360
our program for reducing our high risk

2054
01:21:33.280 --> 01:21:35.016
of financial sustainability.

2055
01:21:35.040 --> 01:21:37.736
We can take that on notice um if you

2056
01:21:37.760 --> 01:21:39.576
like. We don't have the CEO visit with

2057
01:21:39.600 --> 01:21:40.215
us today.

2058
01:21:40.239 --> 01:21:42.856
Madam Chair, can can we ask that the CEO

2059
01:21:42.880 --> 01:21:45.096
actually answer the question in regard

2060
01:21:45.120 --> 01:21:45.816
to

2061
01:21:45.840 --> 01:21:47.576
um yeah through you madam chair I can

2062
01:21:47.600 --> 01:21:50.536
probably only part answer and not answer

2063
01:21:50.560 --> 01:21:52.456
the question but um just give my

2064
01:21:52.480 --> 01:21:55.096
thoughts on it in terms of the long-term

2065
01:21:55.120 --> 01:21:57.976
financial plan in the um integrated

2066
01:21:58.000 --> 01:21:59.896
planning and reporting workshops. It has

2067
01:21:59.920 --> 01:22:01.816
been stated that we are looking at the

2068
01:22:01.840 --> 01:22:03.655
different models within the long-term

2069
01:22:03.679 --> 01:22:06.135
financial plan and acknowledging that in

2070
01:22:06.159 --> 01:22:07.816
terms of what councelor Rose has stated

2071
01:22:07.840 --> 01:22:10.456
that's around increasing um revenue

2072
01:22:10.480 --> 01:22:11.976
through that process there. I think

2073
01:22:12.000 --> 01:22:14.296
where you're um possibly heading is

2074
01:22:14.320 --> 01:22:16.776
around looking at cost efficiencies and

2075
01:22:16.800 --> 01:22:19.655
reducing um you know the level of

2076
01:22:19.679 --> 01:22:21.896
operational expenditure. Um that

2077
01:22:21.920 --> 01:22:23.576
probably links to your notice of motion

2078
01:22:23.600 --> 01:22:25.736
there. But in saying that  there is a

2079
01:22:25.760 --> 01:22:27.416
lot of work that needs to be done that's

2080
01:22:27.440 --> 01:22:29.096
outlined in this report whether it's at

2081
01:22:29.120 --> 01:22:31.096
activity based costing our service level

2082
01:22:31.120 --> 01:22:33.976
reviews all of that will feed into the

2083
01:22:34.000 --> 01:22:36.056
um you know the bigger picture in terms

2084
01:22:36.080 --> 01:22:38.456
of looking at how we can manage our

2085
01:22:38.480 --> 01:22:40.215
finances better and reduce that deficit

2086
01:22:40.239 --> 01:22:42.376
as well. It's not something that I can

2087
01:22:42.400 --> 01:22:44.376
answer here today but we are working on

2088
01:22:44.400 --> 01:22:46.776
it. I I appreciate it and if I could

2089
01:22:46.800 --> 01:22:49.800
just follow up um madam chair really

2090
01:22:51.040 --> 01:22:54.040
that the report says a few things that

2091
01:22:54.400 --> 01:22:55.896
are very important I think for the whole

2092
01:22:55.920 --> 01:22:58.056
community to understand firstly

2093
01:22:58.080 --> 01:22:59.496
that's where I do need to have a

2094
01:22:59.520 --> 01:22:59.896
question

2095
01:22:59.920 --> 01:23:01.976
there is a question so funding is

2096
01:23:02.000 --> 01:23:04.215
insufficient to sustain sustainably

2097
01:23:04.239 --> 01:23:05.496
renew infrastructure

2098
01:23:05.520 --> 01:23:06.456
is that your question

2099
01:23:06.480 --> 01:23:08.856
the road network modeling suggests gradu

2100
01:23:08.880 --> 01:23:11.175
gradual deterioration over 10 years

2101
01:23:11.199 --> 01:23:11.416
yes

2102
01:23:11.440 --> 01:23:13.655
and a significant funding shortfall

2103
01:23:13.679 --> 01:23:16.679
remains so the question is what is the

2104
01:23:17.040 --> 01:23:19.896
strategy to to deal with this underlying

2105
01:23:19.920 --> 01:23:22.376
and ongoing deficit

2106
01:23:22.400 --> 01:23:25.400
which I think has to be the level of

2107
01:23:25.679 --> 01:23:28.679
increasing our rates. Um but but that's

2108
01:23:28.960 --> 01:23:31.816
the you know it's a it's a pretty it's

2109
01:23:31.840 --> 01:23:33.096
probably the most significant question

2110
01:23:33.120 --> 01:23:35.655
facing the council um madam chair

2111
01:23:35.679 --> 01:23:37.816
because we we know that we haven't got

2112
01:23:37.840 --> 01:23:39.496
it we've got an insufficient population

2113
01:23:39.520 --> 01:23:42.520
to sustain the infrastructure. We have

2114
01:23:42.719 --> 01:23:44.296
to have a plan to deal with it.

2115
01:23:44.320 --> 01:23:46.215
And so you're absolutely correct. There

2116
01:23:46.239 --> 01:23:48.056
are two ways of improving the situation.

2117
01:23:48.080 --> 01:23:50.056
Either we increase revenue as the CEO

2118
01:23:50.080 --> 01:23:51.736
stated out or we decrease our

2119
01:23:51.760 --> 01:23:53.096
expenditure. That's either reduce

2120
01:23:53.120 --> 01:23:55.175
spending or reduce services which as a

2121
01:23:55.199 --> 01:23:57.016
result is reduce spending. So this is

2122
01:23:57.040 --> 01:23:59.576
indeed the difficult decision that we

2123
01:23:59.600 --> 01:24:01.175
need to make as counselors every single

2124
01:24:01.199 --> 01:24:03.256
year when deciding on our operational

2125
01:24:03.280 --> 01:24:05.175
plan and delivery program as to what are

2126
01:24:05.199 --> 01:24:08.199
the acceptable service levels and what

2127
01:24:08.400 --> 01:24:10.215
income is required in order to deliver

2128
01:24:10.239 --> 01:24:12.615
those service levels. Are we going to,

2129
01:24:12.639 --> 01:24:15.175
as you know, work on a a program of

2130
01:24:15.199 --> 01:24:17.976
increasing our unrestricted cash? We

2131
01:24:18.000 --> 01:24:21.000
this this is what we have to do as

2132
01:24:21.040 --> 01:24:23.256
counselors pretty well every day, every

2133
01:24:23.280 --> 01:24:26.280
time we sit down and and and um build

2134
01:24:26.800 --> 01:24:28.215
the operational plan and delivery

2135
01:24:28.239 --> 01:24:30.056
program. That's you you're absolutely

2136
01:24:30.080 --> 01:24:31.816
right. This financial sustainability

2137
01:24:31.840 --> 01:24:34.615
view very clearly highlighted what the

2138
01:24:34.639 --> 01:24:36.615
problems are with our structural

2139
01:24:36.639 --> 01:24:38.536
deficit. And absolutely, you're correct.

2140
01:24:38.560 --> 01:24:40.695
It's a very serious situation and there

2141
01:24:40.719 --> 01:24:42.215
were options I think it was 24

2142
01:24:42.239 --> 01:24:43.896
recommendations in terms of pathway

2143
01:24:43.920 --> 01:24:46.296
forward which we have been working

2144
01:24:46.320 --> 01:24:48.215
through which is again why the SRV

2145
01:24:48.239 --> 01:24:50.296
happened. I think it was four years ago.

2146
01:24:50.320 --> 01:24:51.976
So there's absolutely no question the

2147
01:24:52.000 --> 01:24:53.976
situation is serious but there are

2148
01:24:54.000 --> 01:24:55.736
that's what we work to every year with

2149
01:24:55.760 --> 01:24:57.256
the operational plan that counselors

2150
01:24:57.280 --> 01:24:59.816
need to have feedback into and  and

2151
01:24:59.840 --> 01:25:02.456
approve. So what so what I'd like to do

2152
01:25:02.480 --> 01:25:05.480
then is to to move that we ask through

2153
01:25:06.080 --> 01:25:09.080
the CEO for a a simple plan to move the

2154
01:25:15.120 --> 01:25:16.936
to move

2155
01:25:16.960 --> 01:25:19.096
the the council

2156
01:25:19.120 --> 01:25:22.120
into a sustainable financial position as

2157
01:25:22.400 --> 01:25:25.400
regards its infrastructure

2158
01:25:26.960 --> 01:25:29.016
and and for

2159
01:25:29.040 --> 01:25:31.096
you may not like the answer.

2160
01:25:31.120 --> 01:25:34.120
No, no, but we need we need to know the

2161
01:25:34.400 --> 01:25:37.016
answer because I think what I asked you

2162
01:25:37.040 --> 01:25:39.175
before is that there we know there

2163
01:25:39.199 --> 01:25:41.736
there's a whole range of documents

2164
01:25:41.760 --> 01:25:43.416
but if you ask the community there's no

2165
01:25:43.440 --> 01:25:46.440
one that knows out there firstly the the

2166
01:25:46.480 --> 01:25:48.376
issues that we have around these

2167
01:25:48.400 --> 01:25:50.776
fundamental structural issues and

2168
01:25:50.800 --> 01:25:52.456
secondly what the plan is and the

2169
01:25:52.480 --> 01:25:54.856
options for it. So what I would like to

2170
01:25:54.880 --> 01:25:57.256
do is to ask with the CEO to get the CFO

2171
01:25:57.280 --> 01:26:00.215
to provide such a document that we can

2172
01:26:00.239 --> 01:26:02.856
actually discuss with the community

2173
01:26:02.880 --> 01:26:04.936
before decisions are made because I

2174
01:26:04.960 --> 01:26:06.695
think that that's a crucial thing for us

2175
01:26:06.719 --> 01:26:09.719
to deal with in the in the forthcoming

2176
01:26:10.320 --> 01:26:12.936
6 12 months.

2177
01:26:12.960 --> 01:26:13.416
Yeah.

2178
01:26:13.440 --> 01:26:16.440
Yeah. Um so um sorry I will um pass over

2179
01:26:17.120 --> 01:26:20.120
to the  to to  the CEO but this this

2180
01:26:20.480 --> 01:26:22.936
is exactly the discussion that happens

2181
01:26:22.960 --> 01:26:25.496
when we review the as part of the IPR

2182
01:26:25.520 --> 01:26:26.776
process when we review the operation

2183
01:26:26.800 --> 01:26:28.695
plan and the delivery plan there are one

2184
01:26:28.719 --> 01:26:30.215
page I guess we can call them cheat

2185
01:26:30.239 --> 01:26:32.056
sheets that explain the situation and

2186
01:26:32.080 --> 01:26:34.856
the service levels that that are that

2187
01:26:34.880 --> 01:26:37.816
we being asked to vote upon. So that the

2188
01:26:37.840 --> 01:26:39.655
the short answer to your question is yes

2189
01:26:39.679 --> 01:26:41.256
that is indeed happening and will

2190
01:26:41.280 --> 01:26:43.256
continue to happen. that would like to

2191
01:26:43.280 --> 01:26:44.536
elaborate.

2192
01:26:44.560 --> 01:26:46.296
Yeah, for you, Madam Chair. That is

2193
01:26:46.320 --> 01:26:48.936
something that um

2194
01:26:48.960 --> 01:26:51.896
is a fundamental element of the IPNR

2195
01:26:51.920 --> 01:26:54.456
process because it is all long-term

2196
01:26:54.480 --> 01:26:57.096
financial planning. Um that's our

2197
01:26:57.120 --> 01:26:59.576
long-term rolling forecast be able to

2198
01:26:59.600 --> 01:27:02.215
deliver our delivery program primarily

2199
01:27:02.239 --> 01:27:04.056
and then the operational plan that comes

2200
01:27:04.080 --> 01:27:07.080
out of that on an annual basis. um the

2201
01:27:08.320 --> 01:27:10.215
service level component is significant

2202
01:27:10.239 --> 01:27:13.239
to that and um the mayor is 100%

2203
01:27:13.280 --> 01:27:16.280
correct. Um it's either increasing rates

2204
01:27:16.560 --> 01:27:18.615
or reducing the service levels that we

2205
01:27:18.639 --> 01:27:20.936
provide to our community and that's the

2206
01:27:20.960 --> 01:27:23.960
significant conversation to be had. Um,

2207
01:27:24.080 --> 01:27:25.816
and I'd also like to remind you a couple

2208
01:27:25.840 --> 01:27:27.655
of years ago, we actually did go down

2209
01:27:27.679 --> 01:27:29.976
that pathway in in potentially putting

2210
01:27:30.000 --> 01:27:31.736
out to the community of what a reduction

2211
01:27:31.760 --> 01:27:33.256
of service levels looks like,

2212
01:27:33.280 --> 01:27:34.776
particularly for the maintenance of our

2213
01:27:34.800 --> 01:27:37.800
roads. And um, you know, it it's a very

2214
01:27:38.239 --> 01:27:39.896
difficult conversation to have with our

2215
01:27:39.920 --> 01:27:42.135
community as to what service levels we

2216
01:27:42.159 --> 01:27:44.456
can actually afford. And if we want to

2217
01:27:44.480 --> 01:27:46.456
increase the service levels , and

2218
01:27:46.480 --> 01:27:48.615
become more financially sustainable, you

2219
01:27:48.639 --> 01:27:50.776
do have to increase your revenue. and an

2220
01:27:50.800 --> 01:27:53.736
SF SRV increase is one of those as well

2221
01:27:53.760 --> 01:27:55.816
as other revenue options whether it

2222
01:27:55.840 --> 01:27:57.256
could be increasing our grant

2223
01:27:57.280 --> 01:28:00.280
opportunities or um feast and charges

2224
01:28:00.480 --> 01:28:01.896
etc. So yes,

2225
01:28:01.920 --> 01:28:03.096
thank you. Any other

2226
01:28:03.120 --> 01:28:05.256
so look y

2227
01:28:05.280 --> 01:28:08.280
the point is that the IPR process does

2228
01:28:08.880 --> 01:28:10.695
not capture this story at all. It's it's

2229
01:28:10.719 --> 01:28:12.056
complex it's

2230
01:28:12.080 --> 01:28:13.016
getting into debate.

2231
01:28:13.040 --> 01:28:16.040
Yes. Yes. The question is um we got my

2232
01:28:17.199 --> 01:28:18.695
motion that um

2233
01:28:18.719 --> 01:28:19.736
is it an amendment

2234
01:28:19.760 --> 01:28:20.695
that

2235
01:28:20.719 --> 01:28:23.016
or is it

2236
01:28:23.040 --> 01:28:24.615
yes an amendment right

2237
01:28:24.639 --> 01:28:27.639
this motion the amendment is that the

2238
01:28:29.679 --> 01:28:32.679
CEO be requested

2239
01:28:33.280 --> 01:28:36.280
to examine

2240
01:28:42.880 --> 01:28:45.880
a process to examine a process whereby

2241
01:28:46.000 --> 01:28:49.000
residents can be informed.

2242
01:28:53.120 --> 01:28:56.120
Yeah.

2243
01:28:59.760 --> 01:29:02.760
They always are informed the discussion

2244
01:29:03.920 --> 01:29:06.615
that the CEO examined process

2245
01:29:06.639 --> 01:29:09.639
whereby residents can be informed

2246
01:29:12.960 --> 01:29:15.960
of challenge

2247
01:29:20.400 --> 01:29:23.400
faced by

2248
01:29:24.320 --> 01:29:27.320
the lack of funds to sustainably renew

2249
01:29:27.520 --> 01:29:30.520
infrastructure

2250
01:29:37.760 --> 01:29:40.615
and the deterioration in our road

2251
01:29:40.639 --> 01:29:42.936
network.

2252
01:29:42.960 --> 01:29:44.135
Given that this is something that goes

2253
01:29:44.159 --> 01:29:45.655
out in our communications on a regular

2254
01:29:45.679 --> 01:29:47.655
basis, Davis, do you have any problem

2255
01:29:47.679 --> 01:29:49.896
adding this to your

2256
01:29:49.920 --> 01:29:52.056
original motion? Sorry, miss madam

2257
01:29:52.080 --> 01:29:54.296
chair. I think you're inappropriate with

2258
01:29:54.320 --> 01:29:56.456
me interfering with this motion before I

2259
01:29:56.480 --> 01:29:57.655
even got it on the by the amendment

2260
01:29:57.679 --> 01:29:59.416
before I even got on the board.

2261
01:29:59.440 --> 01:30:02.440
So, so no it's just been typed up. So um

2262
01:30:04.960 --> 01:30:06.615
of the challenge faced by the lack of

2263
01:30:06.639 --> 01:30:08.456
funds to sustainably renew

2264
01:30:08.480 --> 01:30:09.976
infrastructure and deteriorate and the

2265
01:30:10.000 --> 01:30:12.536
deterioration our road work and suggest

2266
01:30:12.560 --> 01:30:15.560
options

2267
01:30:15.600 --> 01:30:18.456
for strategies to remedy

2268
01:30:18.480 --> 01:30:21.480
these issues these challenges.

2269
01:30:24.480 --> 01:30:26.215
As the chair of the meeting it is my

2270
01:30:26.239 --> 01:30:27.976
role to determine if a motion or

2271
01:30:28.000 --> 01:30:31.000
amendment is lawful or not. Um,

2272
01:30:31.040 --> 01:30:33.496
councelor Davis, would you  be happy

2273
01:30:33.520 --> 01:30:35.655
to include this as part of the original

2274
01:30:35.679 --> 01:30:37.336
 motion or would you like it to be as

2275
01:30:37.360 --> 01:30:40.056
a separate amendment?

2276
01:30:40.080 --> 01:30:43.080
I'll

2277
01:30:44.320 --> 01:30:46.936
this report is all about that.

2278
01:30:46.960 --> 01:30:48.695
Exactly.

2279
01:30:48.719 --> 01:30:51.175
Your call, councelor Davis.

2280
01:30:51.199 --> 01:30:54.199
 I I'm happy to debate  councelor

2281
01:30:55.280 --> 01:30:57.655
Rose's amendment because I think it

2282
01:30:57.679 --> 01:30:59.336
would be an interesting debate.

2283
01:30:59.360 --> 01:31:00.776
Okay. So councelor So the amendment

2284
01:31:00.800 --> 01:31:02.296
moved by councelor Rose. Do I have a

2285
01:31:02.320 --> 01:31:05.320
seconder?

2286
01:31:08.239 --> 01:31:08.936
Oh sure.

2287
01:31:08.960 --> 01:31:11.256
Councelor Williamson seconded. Councelor

2288
01:31:11.280 --> 01:31:13.976
Rose, you have five minutes.

2289
01:31:14.000 --> 01:31:15.655
I ask some questions before

2290
01:31:15.679 --> 01:31:16.936
 should we let him speak to it first?

2291
01:31:16.960 --> 01:31:19.736
They may clarify your questions.

2292
01:31:19.760 --> 01:31:22.760
I'm sure they won't.

2293
01:31:27.440 --> 01:31:30.215
Madame chair, I think councilors seem to

2294
01:31:30.239 --> 01:31:32.056
be unaware

2295
01:31:32.080 --> 01:31:33.576
that

2296
01:31:33.600 --> 01:31:35.416
the majority of residents, the vast

2297
01:31:35.440 --> 01:31:37.175
majority of residents don't follow in

2298
01:31:37.199 --> 01:31:38.776
detail what's happening, nor the

2299
01:31:38.800 --> 01:31:41.800
reports. nor for instance the 1500 pages

2300
01:31:42.080 --> 01:31:43.816
that we've been required to look at in

2301
01:31:43.840 --> 01:31:46.840
this last period of time which itself

2302
01:31:47.120 --> 01:31:49.736
provide governance challenges

2303
01:31:49.760 --> 01:31:52.536
the issue really here is the IPNR

2304
01:31:52.560 --> 01:31:54.776
process is obscure people don't

2305
01:31:54.800 --> 01:31:56.456
understand it they can't understand even

2306
01:31:56.480 --> 01:31:58.215
the planning process there's a there's a

2307
01:31:58.239 --> 01:32:00.456
diagram that's impossible to understand

2308
01:32:00.480 --> 01:32:02.695
no one in this region understands the

2309
01:32:02.719 --> 01:32:04.776
process I can guarantee it I can go out

2310
01:32:04.800 --> 01:32:06.296
the streets and I can interview a 100

2311
01:32:06.320 --> 01:32:09.320
people no one will understand it what we

2312
01:32:09.679 --> 01:32:12.679
Madame chair is a simple story here to

2313
01:32:12.719 --> 01:32:15.719
go to residents saying we have a problem

2314
01:32:15.920 --> 01:32:17.976
as a community. We have too few people.

2315
01:32:18.000 --> 01:32:20.376
We have too big infrastructure costs and

2316
01:32:20.400 --> 01:32:23.400
there's an issue that we have to face.

2317
01:32:23.520 --> 01:32:25.416
This is the issue. This is the extent of

2318
01:32:25.440 --> 01:32:27.416
it and this is what some of the options

2319
01:32:27.440 --> 01:32:29.496
are for us to deal with.

2320
01:32:29.520 --> 01:32:32.520
Unless we have that simple simple one

2321
01:32:32.639 --> 01:32:34.856
pager, people will never know as they

2322
01:32:34.880 --> 01:32:36.456
weigh their way through thousands of

2323
01:32:36.480 --> 01:32:39.256
council pages. So what I'm asking for is

2324
01:32:39.280 --> 01:32:41.175
a simple way for residents to be

2325
01:32:41.199 --> 01:32:43.416
informed. If they're not informed, they

2326
01:32:43.440 --> 01:32:45.016
can't actually make any decisions about

2327
01:32:45.040 --> 01:32:47.736
this and we get a whole lot of problems.

2328
01:32:47.760 --> 01:32:49.896
I'm I've stood on a on a platform of

2329
01:32:49.920 --> 01:32:52.920
being against any rate rises. But um I'm

2330
01:32:52.960 --> 01:32:55.016
increasingly seeing councelor Davis that

2331
01:32:55.040 --> 01:32:56.536
this there may be an inevitability of

2332
01:32:56.560 --> 01:32:59.096
this that we may have to face because

2333
01:32:59.120 --> 01:33:00.776
well gender bind residents are burying

2334
01:33:00.800 --> 01:33:03.256
the bulk of that um and we can debate

2335
01:33:03.280 --> 01:33:06.280
that but but

2336
01:33:08.320 --> 01:33:10.215
what about the southerners

2337
01:33:10.239 --> 01:33:13.239
the southerners what about them

2338
01:33:15.040 --> 01:33:17.816
I think um I think if we if we think of

2339
01:33:17.840 --> 01:33:19.256
the presentations over the last period

2340
01:33:19.280 --> 01:33:21.655
of time about our road network we've got

2341
01:33:21.679 --> 01:33:23.736
a problem just in terms of the amount of

2342
01:33:23.760 --> 01:33:26.296
material we have to to to m maintain and

2343
01:33:26.320 --> 01:33:28.695
our roads are our most important and

2344
01:33:28.719 --> 01:33:30.536
people agreed last time with the the

2345
01:33:30.560 --> 01:33:32.456
special rate variation went through the

2346
01:33:32.480 --> 01:33:34.376
basis of iPart because it was going to

2347
01:33:34.400 --> 01:33:36.615
be devoted for road repair but we've got

2348
01:33:36.639 --> 01:33:39.416
an ongoing problem and I believe that we

2349
01:33:39.440 --> 01:33:41.256
need a simple process if we just rely on

2350
01:33:41.280 --> 01:33:43.896
the IPNR process this is going to fail

2351
01:33:43.920 --> 01:33:46.776
we need a separate align process that

2352
01:33:46.800 --> 01:33:48.695
actually has a simple story that we can

2353
01:33:48.719 --> 01:33:51.719
inform residents so I think this is as a

2354
01:33:51.760 --> 01:33:54.760
mustd do for us as councilors. The the

2355
01:33:55.199 --> 01:33:57.736
issue of how to do it, I think Mr. Renie

2356
01:33:57.760 --> 01:33:59.496
has got the the skills and ability to

2357
01:33:59.520 --> 01:34:01.416
actually provide that information

2358
01:34:01.440 --> 01:34:03.256
because it's a stark choice we have and

2359
01:34:03.280 --> 01:34:04.615
I think it's really important that we

2360
01:34:04.639 --> 01:34:06.536
have that information otherwise we'll

2361
01:34:06.560 --> 01:34:08.376
sail on everyone will go away. We

2362
01:34:08.400 --> 01:34:10.215
shouldn't actually have any rate rises.

2363
01:34:10.239 --> 01:34:12.936
I mean I also agree with you councelor

2364
01:34:12.960 --> 01:34:14.296
Hopkins is that it sounds like you're

2365
01:34:14.320 --> 01:34:15.896
going to support my motion to look at a

2366
01:34:15.920 --> 01:34:18.856
5% decrease in cost but that's a that's

2367
01:34:18.880 --> 01:34:21.880
a separate issue. Um I know that the

2368
01:34:22.239 --> 01:34:24.296
council I I've got great confidence in

2369
01:34:24.320 --> 01:34:26.776
 Mr. Renie as the CFO but I think

2370
01:34:26.800 --> 01:34:28.456
we've got a a problem here we have to

2371
01:34:28.480 --> 01:34:30.056
face up to in fact it's the biggest

2372
01:34:30.080 --> 01:34:33.080
problem we face in this whole region is

2373
01:34:33.440 --> 01:34:35.896
this problem of too few unless we see a

2374
01:34:35.920 --> 01:34:37.416
baby boom which I don't think we're

2375
01:34:37.440 --> 01:34:38.615
going to see in the next little while

2376
01:34:38.639 --> 01:34:40.615
and anyway it's too late baby's even

2377
01:34:40.639 --> 01:34:42.296
just cautious maybe they don't give us

2378
01:34:42.320 --> 01:34:44.615
anything

2379
01:34:44.639 --> 01:34:47.576
so um the the issue is we've got too few

2380
01:34:47.600 --> 01:34:49.416
people to sustain what we need to do so

2381
01:34:49.440 --> 01:34:51.416
we have to face this at some stage and

2382
01:34:51.440 --> 01:34:53.655
we need to have that material

2383
01:34:53.679 --> 01:34:55.816
information available

2384
01:34:55.840 --> 01:34:58.376
in advance of whether we consider an SRV

2385
01:34:58.400 --> 01:35:00.215
again. So that's really what this is

2386
01:35:00.239 --> 01:35:03.239
about. If we reject this, it's rejecting

2387
01:35:03.840 --> 01:35:05.976
really the key information we need as as

2388
01:35:06.000 --> 01:35:08.936
a as a as a region to make decisions.

2389
01:35:08.960 --> 01:35:10.776
Okay. Do I have a speak? Councelor Wson,

2390
01:35:10.800 --> 01:35:12.695
did that answer your questions?

2391
01:35:12.719 --> 01:35:13.175
No.

2392
01:35:13.199 --> 01:35:15.416
Right. Questions?

2393
01:35:15.440 --> 01:35:17.496
Um

2394
01:35:17.520 --> 01:35:20.520
I'm I'm just a little concerned that the

2395
01:35:20.880 --> 01:35:23.880
list um kind of conveys things that

2396
01:35:24.400 --> 01:35:27.400
aren't quite accurate. So when I submit

2397
01:35:28.400 --> 01:35:31.400
a special rate variation application

2398
01:35:31.440 --> 01:35:32.456
Williamson, we're talking about the

2399
01:35:32.480 --> 01:35:35.480
amendment only.

2400
01:35:36.000 --> 01:35:37.816
Well, the amendment if I vote on it

2401
01:35:37.840 --> 01:35:40.615
relates to the report. It includes

2402
01:35:40.639 --> 01:35:43.016
noting it questions in relation to the

2403
01:35:43.040 --> 01:35:46.040
things. Sure, that's okay. Thank you. So

2404
01:35:47.520 --> 01:35:49.736
1A, submit a special rate variation

2405
01:35:49.760 --> 01:35:52.760
application. We did submit one. I don't

2406
01:35:53.520 --> 01:35:55.496
understand why the last status isn't

2407
01:35:55.520 --> 01:35:57.416
therefore

2408
01:35:57.440 --> 01:36:00.376
noted that it's complete. Um we haven't

2409
01:36:00.400 --> 01:36:03.400
voted to submit another one.

2410
01:36:03.679 --> 01:36:05.736
Do you Madam Chair, my understanding is

2411
01:36:05.760 --> 01:36:07.896
that there's a fifth year consideration.

2412
01:36:07.920 --> 01:36:08.856
Yeah, there is. Yeah.

2413
01:36:08.880 --> 01:36:10.056
Yeah.

2414
01:36:10.080 --> 01:36:11.736
Yeah. Got to come back.

2415
01:36:11.760 --> 01:36:13.976
Sorry. This is a report into the

2416
01:36:14.000 --> 01:36:16.215
recommendations. The recommendation was

2417
01:36:16.239 --> 01:36:19.239
to submit one. We did.

2418
01:36:20.400 --> 01:36:21.336
Sorry. Three.

2419
01:36:21.360 --> 01:36:22.615
You're arguing. You're debating.

2420
01:36:22.639 --> 01:36:24.936
Well, no. I'm questioning I'm wondering

2421
01:36:24.960 --> 01:36:27.960
why. My question is why doesn't complete

2422
01:36:29.520 --> 01:36:31.976
this is a report on what what we said we

2423
01:36:32.000 --> 01:36:33.976
would do when we did it. Williamson, I

2424
01:36:34.000 --> 01:36:36.056
guess to to explain and and it's gray

2425
01:36:36.080 --> 01:36:38.615
and I'm sure you can um follow this

2426
01:36:38.639 --> 01:36:41.639
logic in that the um the SRV that was

2427
01:36:42.800 --> 01:36:45.016
recommended was for a 5year period boy

2428
01:36:45.040 --> 01:36:47.576
was granted. So I guess technically

2429
01:36:47.600 --> 01:36:49.256
there may be further conversations

2430
01:36:49.280 --> 01:36:51.416
required to be had around the SRV. We

2431
01:36:51.440 --> 01:36:53.095
can over complicate the table with sub

2432
01:36:53.119 --> 01:36:55.175
columns and things like that, but that's

2433
01:36:55.199 --> 01:36:57.016
in essence answering your question.

2434
01:36:57.040 --> 01:36:58.615
Well, I'm using it to track whether we

2435
01:36:58.639 --> 01:37:00.536
did what we said we would do. That's

2436
01:37:00.560 --> 01:37:03.416
what I thought the intent was. Um when

2437
01:37:03.440 --> 01:37:06.440
would we need to make a new SRV

2438
01:37:06.560 --> 01:37:09.256
application? Why?

2439
01:37:09.280 --> 01:37:11.655
Um sorry through you madame may

2440
01:37:11.679 --> 01:37:13.736
obviously we'll need to consider what

2441
01:37:13.760 --> 01:37:16.056
happens around the fifth year process.

2442
01:37:16.080 --> 01:37:18.695
Um whether or not we go back to iPart

2443
01:37:18.719 --> 01:37:20.536
around that and then anything post that

2444
01:37:20.560 --> 01:37:21.976
period of time will be the fresh

2445
01:37:22.000 --> 01:37:23.256
application that we will need to start

2446
01:37:23.280 --> 01:37:23.576
working

2447
01:37:23.600 --> 01:37:26.536
when we need to go back to iPod that

2448
01:37:26.560 --> 01:37:26.936
process

2449
01:37:26.960 --> 01:37:29.095
the fifth year or the new part

2450
01:37:29.119 --> 01:37:31.976
for the fifth year. the fifth year. Um,

2451
01:37:32.000 --> 01:37:32.536
when

2452
01:37:32.560 --> 01:37:34.456
did it just come to council to to

2453
01:37:34.480 --> 01:37:35.336
approve?

2454
01:37:35.360 --> 01:37:36.456
Yeah, we apply.

2455
01:37:36.480 --> 01:37:38.776
So, I'm just

2456
01:37:38.800 --> 01:37:41.800
question need to apply to IPA 350

2457
01:37:45.760 --> 01:37:46.856
be this year, wouldn't it?

2458
01:37:46.880 --> 01:37:48.615
Soon soon I think is the shortest answer

2459
01:37:48.639 --> 01:37:49.816
to your question. We can take that on

2460
01:37:49.840 --> 01:37:52.135
notice for details.

2461
01:37:52.159 --> 01:37:55.159
Yeah. Thank you. Um, in terms of 1B,

2462
01:37:56.159 --> 01:37:58.536
um, I understand that there is a

2463
01:37:58.560 --> 01:38:01.560
competitive neutral neutrality policy of

2464
01:38:01.600 --> 01:38:03.736
the New South Wales government

2465
01:38:03.760 --> 01:38:06.215
reflecting that from a co-ag agreement a

2466
01:38:06.239 --> 01:38:09.239
number of years ago that requires us to

2467
01:38:09.360 --> 01:38:10.856
charge

2468
01:38:10.880 --> 01:38:13.880
, full cost for services or statutory

2469
01:38:14.639 --> 01:38:17.016
cost where specified

2470
01:38:17.040 --> 01:38:19.016
um, and in particular where those

2471
01:38:19.040 --> 01:38:21.736
services are contestable in the market

2472
01:38:21.760 --> 01:38:24.296
with the private sector. Um, so what

2473
01:38:24.320 --> 01:38:26.695
risk do we face because we haven't done

2474
01:38:26.719 --> 01:38:29.719
this

2475
01:38:33.920 --> 01:38:35.256
sorry

2476
01:38:35.280 --> 01:38:38.280
so just um briefly some as this report

2477
01:38:39.360 --> 01:38:42.215
and the recommendations came in

2478
01:38:42.239 --> 01:38:44.376
2021 so obviously there there's a

2479
01:38:44.400 --> 01:38:46.215
journey some visa charges have been

2480
01:38:46.239 --> 01:38:48.215
reviewed some are still to be reviewed

2481
01:38:48.239 --> 01:38:50.215
or are

2482
01:38:50.239 --> 01:38:51.416
continuously reviewed

2483
01:38:51.440 --> 01:38:53.655
so the So I'm I'm asking what risk do we

2484
01:38:53.679 --> 01:38:54.135
face?

2485
01:38:54.159 --> 01:38:55.816
Well, the risk of not charging

2486
01:38:55.840 --> 01:38:57.016
appropriate prices. So there's a

2487
01:38:57.040 --> 01:38:58.936
financial risk there of of providing

2488
01:38:58.960 --> 01:39:00.856
services for which we're not fully that

2489
01:39:00.880 --> 01:39:02.615
not cost neutral for which we're not

2490
01:39:02.639 --> 01:39:04.456
fully compensated. So that's obviously a

2491
01:39:04.480 --> 01:39:06.135
risk.

2492
01:39:06.159 --> 01:39:07.655
And you're also suggesting there may be

2493
01:39:07.679 --> 01:39:09.816
a risk of some price some of our fees

2494
01:39:09.840 --> 01:39:12.456
and prices not in line with statutory

2495
01:39:12.480 --> 01:39:14.215
requirements. So obviously that's

2496
01:39:14.239 --> 01:39:14.856
action. Yes.

2497
01:39:14.880 --> 01:39:16.695
Yes. So yes, that is that

2498
01:39:16.719 --> 01:39:19.719
to be taken on notice if that's okay.

2499
01:39:20.000 --> 01:39:23.000
Um in regards to 2C conduct a strategic

2500
01:39:24.719 --> 01:39:26.776
review of services that appears not to

2501
01:39:26.800 --> 01:39:28.936
have been happened not to have happened

2502
01:39:28.960 --> 01:39:31.960
yet. Um but

2503
01:39:32.960 --> 01:39:35.960
in 3A we say we have undertaken a review

2504
01:39:36.239 --> 01:39:39.016
of services. So what is the difference

2505
01:39:39.040 --> 01:39:41.256
between the review that was completed in

2506
01:39:41.280 --> 01:39:44.280
3A and the review yet to be completed in

2507
01:39:45.760 --> 01:39:48.760
respect to QC?

2508
01:39:49.280 --> 01:39:51.095
3A is the um yeah so continue to

2509
01:39:51.119 --> 01:39:52.936
undertake service review so that's

2510
01:39:52.960 --> 01:39:55.416
linked to what we outlined in our IPNR

2511
01:39:55.440 --> 01:39:57.655
and then the activities based costing is

2512
01:39:57.679 --> 01:40:00.679
for all services across council

2513
01:40:00.800 --> 01:40:03.655
well so three says undertake re continue

2514
01:40:03.679 --> 01:40:05.976
undertake reviews of services it's

2515
01:40:06.000 --> 01:40:07.655
complete

2516
01:40:07.679 --> 01:40:10.679
so if it's complete my question is so do

2517
01:40:11.360 --> 01:40:13.496
we review the services in the absence of

2518
01:40:13.520 --> 01:40:16.520
doing a strategic review of services

2519
01:40:17.040 --> 01:40:18.695
and and what's the difference between

2520
01:40:18.719 --> 01:40:19.736
the two items.

2521
01:40:19.760 --> 01:40:21.816
Yeah, I'll have to take that one on

2522
01:40:21.840 --> 01:40:23.736
notice because my understanding is that

2523
01:40:23.760 --> 01:40:26.296
the um service reviews are put forward

2524
01:40:26.320 --> 01:40:29.016
in our IPR documents of what services

2525
01:40:29.040 --> 01:40:31.095
we'll be undertaking for that specific

2526
01:40:31.119 --> 01:40:33.736
year um and as part of the delivery

2527
01:40:33.760 --> 01:40:35.576
program. So I will have to take that one

2528
01:40:35.600 --> 01:40:36.856
on notice.

2529
01:40:36.880 --> 01:40:39.880
So would it perhaps be that 3A is not

2530
01:40:40.560 --> 01:40:42.536
actually complete?

2531
01:40:42.560 --> 01:40:44.056
Mr. Williamson, you could be right in

2532
01:40:44.080 --> 01:40:45.736
that possibly that that flipped, but

2533
01:40:45.760 --> 01:40:46.856
that's something that would need to be

2534
01:40:46.880 --> 01:40:49.880
taken on notice. Um, in terms of 4A,

2535
01:40:50.639 --> 01:40:53.639
maintain integration to says it's

2536
01:40:54.080 --> 01:40:56.456
complete, but obviously it's an ongoing

2537
01:40:56.480 --> 01:40:59.480
action item to maintain. It can't

2538
01:40:59.600 --> 01:41:02.600
actually be complete. So, can I ask um

2539
01:41:03.679 --> 01:41:06.679
that to be reviewed, please?

2540
01:41:07.360 --> 01:41:10.360
Sure.

2541
01:41:11.280 --> 01:41:12.695
We are nitpicking because what is

2542
01:41:12.719 --> 01:41:14.056
completion is maintaining the

2543
01:41:14.080 --> 01:41:15.576
integration. The integration will be

2544
01:41:15.600 --> 01:41:17.496
maintained. So that's complete. So we

2545
01:41:17.520 --> 01:41:19.095
are starting to nitpick. That's okay.

2546
01:41:19.119 --> 01:41:20.376
We'll keep going.

2547
01:41:20.400 --> 01:41:23.256
Oh yeah, there's reasonable pressure on

2548
01:41:23.280 --> 01:41:24.695
I think it's no different to the first

2549
01:41:24.719 --> 01:41:26.856
question that was asked around the SRV

2550
01:41:26.880 --> 01:41:28.936
in terms of the fact that your in your

2551
01:41:28.960 --> 01:41:31.416
view that was complete. Um as the madam

2552
01:41:31.440 --> 01:41:33.655
chair has just said around it was around

2553
01:41:33.679 --> 01:41:35.576
introducing that system and maintaining

2554
01:41:35.600 --> 01:41:37.256
that integration which has been done.

2555
01:41:37.280 --> 01:41:40.280
And so we're currently using a um system

2556
01:41:40.719 --> 01:41:42.615
of cams in terms of managing that

2557
01:41:42.639 --> 01:41:44.056
process there.

2558
01:41:44.080 --> 01:41:46.536
Um so I'm very excited to read that we

2559
01:41:46.560 --> 01:41:48.296
have implemented

2560
01:41:48.320 --> 01:41:51.320
budget and financial controls. Um point

2561
01:41:52.639 --> 01:41:55.416
but obviously it was quite alarming to

2562
01:41:55.440 --> 01:41:57.496
hear that we didn't have those in place.

2563
01:41:57.520 --> 01:42:00.520
Um would it be possible for councilors

2564
01:42:00.719 --> 01:42:03.719
to be given copies of the budget and

2565
01:42:04.239 --> 01:42:06.376
financial controls that we have in place

2566
01:42:06.400 --> 01:42:08.056
please?

2567
01:42:08.080 --> 01:42:11.016
report it as council.

2568
01:42:11.040 --> 01:42:13.416
We approved policies around that exact

2569
01:42:13.440 --> 01:42:15.896
item exactly where were you, Council

2570
01:42:15.920 --> 01:42:16.936
Williams,

2571
01:42:16.960 --> 01:42:19.960
when when we debated it in this council,

2572
01:42:20.239 --> 01:42:23.239
those policies around exactly that. I'm

2573
01:42:23.760 --> 01:42:25.896
a bit confused about why we're having

2574
01:42:25.920 --> 01:42:28.296
all of these questions which are very

2575
01:42:28.320 --> 01:42:30.296
clearly articulated over the last four

2576
01:42:30.320 --> 01:42:31.256
years.

2577
01:42:31.280 --> 01:42:32.936
Okay. Thank you for answering the

2578
01:42:32.960 --> 01:42:34.536
question. I'm not really bored, but

2579
01:42:34.560 --> 01:42:36.056
thank you for answering. Councelor Wson,

2580
01:42:36.080 --> 01:42:37.896
do you have any subsequent questions?

2581
01:42:37.920 --> 01:42:39.896
I suppose, well, yes, I do have another

2582
01:42:39.920 --> 01:42:41.816
question, but it may lead to an

2583
01:42:41.840 --> 01:42:44.776
amendment. Um, so there are a number of

2584
01:42:44.800 --> 01:42:47.800
um items on here that are noted as high

2585
01:42:48.159 --> 01:42:49.736
concern.

2586
01:42:49.760 --> 01:42:52.376
Could I ask what the plan is to reduce

2587
01:42:52.400 --> 01:42:55.400
the level of concern in regards to those

2588
01:42:55.600 --> 01:42:57.175
items, please?

2589
01:42:57.199 --> 01:42:58.695
There's a comprehensive report in the

2590
01:42:58.719 --> 01:42:59.655
document.

2591
01:42:59.679 --> 01:43:01.175
I'm councelor Williams.

2592
01:43:01.199 --> 01:43:03.095
Sorry, sorry, I'm reading and scrolling.

2593
01:43:03.119 --> 01:43:05.336
My apologies.

2594
01:43:05.360 --> 01:43:07.896
So um you madam chair in terms of the

2595
01:43:07.920 --> 01:43:10.296
status  where there's red text that is

2596
01:43:10.320 --> 01:43:13.016
the latest information there.

2597
01:43:13.040 --> 01:43:15.896
So council would like are not satisfied

2598
01:43:15.920 --> 01:43:18.056
with those responses we can reconsider

2599
01:43:18.080 --> 01:43:19.496
in terms of how we present that

2600
01:43:19.520 --> 01:43:22.520
information.

2601
01:43:22.639 --> 01:43:23.976
Any further questions? Any other

2602
01:43:24.000 --> 01:43:25.175
councilors? Then we can come back to

2603
01:43:25.199 --> 01:43:26.695
councelor Williamson.

2604
01:43:26.719 --> 01:43:27.655
No. Okay.

2605
01:43:27.679 --> 01:43:30.615
Okay. Well perhaps whose motion is it?

2606
01:43:30.639 --> 01:43:32.376
It's councelor Rose's amendment at the

2607
01:43:32.400 --> 01:43:35.400
moment. Um well perhaps um

2608
01:43:36.080 --> 01:43:37.976
 if we could amend the amendment

2609
01:43:38.000 --> 01:43:41.000
please to um request a plan you know

2610
01:43:42.480 --> 01:43:44.135
including

2611
01:43:44.159 --> 01:43:47.159
time frame to reduce

2612
01:43:48.080 --> 01:43:51.080
those  high risk concern items to a

2613
01:43:52.400 --> 01:43:55.175
lower level of concern.

2614
01:43:55.199 --> 01:43:57.016
Would you consider that council

2615
01:43:57.040 --> 01:43:59.095
rest

2616
01:43:59.119 --> 01:44:01.896
in the event the amendment is not upheld

2617
01:44:01.920 --> 01:44:04.456
I'd seek to make the same amendment with

2618
01:44:04.480 --> 01:44:07.256
a normal motion.

2619
01:44:07.280 --> 01:44:09.976
Can we if an amendment is lo or cy you

2620
01:44:10.000 --> 01:44:12.135
may be getting because once it's lost we

2621
01:44:12.159 --> 01:44:14.135
can't put it back. So would you like to

2622
01:44:14.159 --> 01:44:16.695
debate it as a separate if this entire

2623
01:44:16.719 --> 01:44:19.095
amendment is lost you can't put the same

2624
01:44:19.119 --> 01:44:21.816
thing back again. So you can't just put

2625
01:44:21.840 --> 01:44:24.840
a portion of it back. So what

2626
01:44:24.960 --> 01:44:26.456
let's leave it where it is.

2627
01:44:26.480 --> 01:44:28.376
Yep. Just want you to be aware. Okay.

2628
01:44:28.400 --> 01:44:29.416
Thank you.

2629
01:44:29.440 --> 01:44:32.056
 so um what should we do? Do we have a

2630
01:44:32.080 --> 01:44:32.615
speaker

2631
01:44:32.639 --> 01:44:33.336
speaker against

2632
01:44:33.360 --> 01:44:35.016
against the amendment? So

2633
01:44:35.040 --> 01:44:37.976
councelor Davis.

2634
01:44:38.000 --> 01:44:41.000
So this report the financial

2635
01:44:41.280 --> 01:44:43.016
sustainability

2636
01:44:43.040 --> 01:44:45.576
plan was put together and endorsed by

2637
01:44:45.600 --> 01:44:48.600
this council at the end of 2022.

2638
01:44:49.040 --> 01:44:52.040
It was a very long process and it

2639
01:44:52.880 --> 01:44:55.880
started off with Professor Joseph Drew

2640
01:44:56.880 --> 01:44:59.016
coming to this council and suggesting we

2641
01:44:59.040 --> 01:45:01.256
actually do this process because of our

2642
01:45:01.280 --> 01:45:04.280
financial sustainability issues and the

2643
01:45:04.400 --> 01:45:05.896
fact that we were struggling to have

2644
01:45:05.920 --> 01:45:08.056
cash in the bank at the beginning of any

2645
01:45:08.080 --> 01:45:10.456
financial year.

2646
01:45:10.480 --> 01:45:12.695
Recently there was an article in I think

2647
01:45:12.719 --> 01:45:15.719
about regional  um

2648
01:45:17.199 --> 01:45:20.199
social media document that said that 

2649
01:45:20.719 --> 01:45:23.416
60% of rural households are

2650
01:45:23.440 --> 01:45:24.936
unsustainable.

2651
01:45:24.960 --> 01:45:25.496
Mhm.

2652
01:45:25.520 --> 01:45:28.520
And that was the same story back in 2022

2653
01:45:29.119 --> 01:45:32.119
and we did something about it and four

2654
01:45:32.639 --> 01:45:35.016
years down the track we are far more

2655
01:45:35.040 --> 01:45:36.776
financially sustainable than what we

2656
01:45:36.800 --> 01:45:39.800
were then. Yes, we do have a deficit. We

2657
01:45:40.960 --> 01:45:43.736
have a deficit on paper which will

2658
01:45:43.760 --> 01:45:46.695
continue to increase because our asset

2659
01:45:46.719 --> 01:45:49.496
value will continue to increase and the

2660
01:45:49.520 --> 01:45:52.456
capacity for this council to ever ever

2661
01:45:52.480 --> 01:45:55.480
meet. that on paper figure is probably

2662
01:45:56.639 --> 01:45:59.639
not achievable and it's a government

2663
01:46:00.080 --> 01:46:03.080
requirement that we have this paper

2664
01:46:04.400 --> 01:46:07.175
um figure.

2665
01:46:07.199 --> 01:46:10.199
The financial sustainability plan is

2666
01:46:10.400 --> 01:46:13.400
around the fact that we need to have a

2667
01:46:13.760 --> 01:46:15.976
process in place and was around going

2668
01:46:16.000 --> 01:46:17.736
back to scratch and reviewing every

2669
01:46:17.760 --> 01:46:20.760
service. We've reviewed the services but

2670
01:46:21.040 --> 01:46:24.040
review of our service levels

2671
01:46:24.960 --> 01:46:27.960
 has not been completed and we need to

2672
01:46:28.080 --> 01:46:29.816
actually have that so we can actually

2673
01:46:29.840 --> 01:46:32.536
make a decision about what we can afford

2674
01:46:32.560 --> 01:46:35.560
to do or are we actually overervicing in

2675
01:46:35.679 --> 01:46:38.215
some areas and underervicing in other

2676
01:46:38.239 --> 01:46:41.095
areas and what is the baseline that we

2677
01:46:41.119 --> 01:46:43.336
think the community would be happy with

2678
01:46:43.360 --> 01:46:44.936
or go out to the community and actually

2679
01:46:44.960 --> 01:46:47.576
ask them

2680
01:46:47.600 --> 01:46:50.376
when we actually did this plan with the

2681
01:46:50.400 --> 01:46:53.016
consultants.

2682
01:46:53.040 --> 01:46:55.736
A lot of it was around risk management.

2683
01:46:55.760 --> 01:46:58.760
We do not have a risk appetite appetite

2684
01:46:59.679 --> 01:47:02.376
statement  in regard to this council

2685
01:47:02.400 --> 01:47:05.016
and I think if we had one we would have

2686
01:47:05.040 --> 01:47:08.040
a better  discussion around our 

2687
01:47:10.239 --> 01:47:12.135
level of risk that we'd be happy to

2688
01:47:12.159 --> 01:47:15.159
accept and the fact is that in that risk

2689
01:47:16.080 --> 01:47:18.695
what it is that we're actually 

2690
01:47:18.719 --> 01:47:21.719
prepared to  focus on as far as high

2691
01:47:22.239 --> 01:47:23.816
risk.

2692
01:47:23.840 --> 01:47:25.655
We just do not have enough money to

2693
01:47:25.679 --> 01:47:27.576
replace all of our assets. We need to

2694
01:47:27.600 --> 01:47:29.736
make strategic decisions about how we

2695
01:47:29.760 --> 01:47:32.760
actually manage that. And roads  are

2696
01:47:34.719 --> 01:47:37.719
probably our biggest liability. The SRV

2697
01:47:38.480 --> 01:47:40.856
went into roads.

2698
01:47:40.880 --> 01:47:43.016
We require more money from the federal

2699
01:47:43.040 --> 01:47:45.016
and state governments to maintain our

2700
01:47:45.040 --> 01:47:48.040
roads. And for us to do that, we need to

2701
01:47:48.480 --> 01:47:51.480
lobby really hard in this pre-election

2702
01:47:51.520 --> 01:47:54.520
year for that. also around our base

2703
01:47:54.719 --> 01:47:57.336
infrastructure in regard to water and

2704
01:47:57.360 --> 01:48:00.360
wastewater um assets. This is our

2705
01:48:01.280 --> 01:48:02.856
opportunities.

2706
01:48:02.880 --> 01:48:04.856
We can talk about the fact that we need

2707
01:48:04.880 --> 01:48:07.816
to reduce  costs. We need to do this.

2708
01:48:07.840 --> 01:48:10.615
We need to do that. We already run a

2709
01:48:10.639 --> 01:48:13.336
pretty tight ship. We're we're really

2710
01:48:13.360 --> 01:48:16.360
really just providing base services to

2711
01:48:16.800 --> 01:48:19.736
our community. If we want to provide

2712
01:48:19.760 --> 01:48:22.376
less than that, then we'd be in really

2713
01:48:22.400 --> 01:48:24.936
big trouble because all we do is decline

2714
01:48:24.960 --> 01:48:27.576
our asset base, decline the service

2715
01:48:27.600 --> 01:48:29.416
delivery to the community and the

2716
01:48:29.440 --> 01:48:31.816
community really get upset with us. So,

2717
01:48:31.840 --> 01:48:34.296
at the end of the day, we have a plan.

2718
01:48:34.320 --> 01:48:35.976
We have this report that clearly

2719
01:48:36.000 --> 01:48:37.736
articulates where we're up to with this

2720
01:48:37.760 --> 01:48:40.760
plan. It's a fiveyear plan and we may

2721
01:48:41.920 --> 01:48:44.920
need to go out for another SRB. I'm

2722
01:48:45.119 --> 01:48:46.936
sorry if I'm upsetting any community

2723
01:48:46.960 --> 01:48:49.960
members, but costs increase and we need

2724
01:48:50.639 --> 01:48:53.639
to actually  be out there talking to

2725
01:48:53.679 --> 01:48:55.256
the community and the community have

2726
01:48:55.280 --> 01:48:56.936
access to this document. They've had it

2727
01:48:56.960 --> 01:48:59.496
for four years. We talked about it

2728
01:48:59.520 --> 01:49:01.976
extensively. I still wear the pain from

2729
01:49:02.000 --> 01:49:03.576
when we actually talked about it and

2730
01:49:03.600 --> 01:49:06.456
went out for community consultation. So,

2731
01:49:06.480 --> 01:49:09.336
I can't support that amendment. Exactly

2732
01:49:09.360 --> 01:49:12.360
what we're actually talking about here.

2733
01:49:13.040 --> 01:49:15.416
Thank you.  do we have a speaker um

2734
01:49:15.440 --> 01:49:18.440
for the amendment?

2735
01:49:20.159 --> 01:49:21.256
And with that, councelor Rose, would you

2736
01:49:21.280 --> 01:49:22.376
like your right of reply on the

2737
01:49:22.400 --> 01:49:24.776
amendment? Thank you.

2738
01:49:24.800 --> 01:49:26.376
Um

2739
01:49:26.400 --> 01:49:28.776
look, I think

2740
01:49:28.800 --> 01:49:31.175
firstly I acknowledge councelor Davis's

2741
01:49:31.199 --> 01:49:34.199
great service to this community over the

2742
01:49:34.239 --> 01:49:37.239
years. And um and

2743
01:49:37.760 --> 01:49:40.760
she's not she's not um doing that.

2744
01:49:40.880 --> 01:49:43.095
Well said, councelor Rose. She's um

2745
01:49:43.119 --> 01:49:45.736
she's got she's got information that

2746
01:49:45.760 --> 01:49:47.736
very few people have.

2747
01:49:47.760 --> 01:49:49.816
That is it's all in the council

2748
01:49:49.840 --> 01:49:51.736
documents. I agree. Um there's a lot of

2749
01:49:51.760 --> 01:49:54.215
material there. The problem is that no

2750
01:49:54.239 --> 01:49:56.936
one knows what what they are and there's

2751
01:49:56.960 --> 01:49:58.936
no way of anyone knowing what they are.

2752
01:49:58.960 --> 01:50:01.960
I believe we have a problem.

2753
01:50:02.080 --> 01:50:03.175
I suppose you could say it's a

2754
01:50:03.199 --> 01:50:06.199
communication problem. Um you've worked

2755
01:50:06.400 --> 01:50:09.400
hard and tirelessly to try and get some

2756
01:50:09.840 --> 01:50:12.456
of these issues on the table. the

2757
01:50:12.480 --> 01:50:15.480
financial sustainability process and I

2758
01:50:15.840 --> 01:50:18.056
really applaud what you've done to try

2759
01:50:18.080 --> 01:50:21.080
and do that.  whether there's still

2760
01:50:21.920 --> 01:50:24.296
some fat to be trimmed  in the whole

2761
01:50:24.320 --> 01:50:26.695
system, I don't know. I suspect that any

2762
01:50:26.719 --> 01:50:29.719
organization cut 5% a a great 

2763
01:50:31.600 --> 01:50:34.296
restructuring  consultant told me that

2764
01:50:34.320 --> 01:50:37.256
um any organization can trim 5 to 10%

2765
01:50:37.280 --> 01:50:39.175
it's hard to get to 30%. That's when you

2766
01:50:39.199 --> 01:50:40.536
have to start to make some structural

2767
01:50:40.560 --> 01:50:41.816
changes.

2768
01:50:41.840 --> 01:50:44.840
So, um, wouldn't like to to knock out my

2769
01:50:45.280 --> 01:50:47.175
motion too early here, councelor Davis,

2770
01:50:47.199 --> 01:50:50.199
for about the the 5%. But look, I think

2771
01:50:51.119 --> 01:50:53.496
this may well be a communication issue,

2772
01:50:53.520 --> 01:50:55.095
but if we don't take this communication

2773
01:50:55.119 --> 01:50:57.016
issue seriously, we're going to fail as

2774
01:50:57.040 --> 01:50:59.016
council because

2775
01:50:59.040 --> 01:51:02.040
I suppose I've had secret information

2776
01:51:02.159 --> 01:51:05.095
over the past nine months that um that

2777
01:51:05.119 --> 01:51:07.655
helps me to understand the state of the

2778
01:51:07.679 --> 01:51:08.695
problems we have with our

2779
01:51:08.719 --> 01:51:11.095
infrastructure, particularly our roads.

2780
01:51:11.119 --> 01:51:13.336
And I think Mr. Rollins gave us a chart

2781
01:51:13.360 --> 01:51:15.416
here on this wall that showed that

2782
01:51:15.440 --> 01:51:17.496
basically we didn't have enough people.

2783
01:51:17.520 --> 01:51:19.736
Um the roads are going to deteriorate

2784
01:51:19.760 --> 01:51:22.615
and we're finished.  if we look at the

2785
01:51:22.639 --> 01:51:24.776
the whole story going ahead, I don't

2786
01:51:24.800 --> 01:51:26.776
believe we should be just going looking

2787
01:51:26.800 --> 01:51:29.800
for a handout  for state government to

2788
01:51:29.840 --> 01:51:31.175
have it and federal government as well.

2789
01:51:31.199 --> 01:51:32.695
But I think somehow we have to take

2790
01:51:32.719 --> 01:51:34.856
responsibility as a whole for our

2791
01:51:34.880 --> 01:51:36.856
region. If that means we have to

2792
01:51:36.880 --> 01:51:38.936
actually increase our rates, then so be

2793
01:51:38.960 --> 01:51:40.856
it. or we're going to have to reduce

2794
01:51:40.880 --> 01:51:42.215
services. But I think we have to have

2795
01:51:42.239 --> 01:51:44.695
the discussion because I think in this

2796
01:51:44.719 --> 01:51:47.256
situation, we've got a 12 to 18 months

2797
01:51:47.280 --> 01:51:49.976
to twoyear process to reach a point

2798
01:51:50.000 --> 01:51:51.736
where people really understand what's at

2799
01:51:51.760 --> 01:51:54.056
stake here. Unless we start this

2800
01:51:54.080 --> 01:51:56.695
discussion now, we're going to fail. And

2801
01:51:56.719 --> 01:51:59.175
the documents we've got, as voluminous

2802
01:51:59.199 --> 01:52:02.199
as they are, um are completely useless.

2803
01:52:02.800 --> 01:52:05.175
Um I've talked to people all over the

2804
01:52:05.199 --> 01:52:06.936
region about them. No one understands

2805
01:52:06.960 --> 01:52:09.016
them. No one knows what's in them. We

2806
01:52:09.040 --> 01:52:11.816
need a simple story here to put before

2807
01:52:11.840 --> 01:52:14.840
people take them on what was called

2808
01:52:15.199 --> 01:52:16.856
modern in modern parliament in the

2809
01:52:16.880 --> 01:52:19.655
health system a journey and um people

2810
01:52:19.679 --> 01:52:21.336
need to go onto a journey to understand

2811
01:52:21.360 --> 01:52:23.736
where we are and what's required and we

2812
01:52:23.760 --> 01:52:25.016
need to take responsibility for

2813
01:52:25.040 --> 01:52:27.816
ourselves not requiring some a handout

2814
01:52:27.840 --> 01:52:29.175
for a government that's already spending

2815
01:52:29.199 --> 01:52:32.199
too much money anyway. So I think we've

2816
01:52:32.239 --> 01:52:34.615
got a a real problem. This is just a

2817
01:52:34.639 --> 01:52:37.575
simple way of starting that process and

2818
01:52:37.599 --> 01:52:40.135
I think it's a a really helpful one. I

2819
01:52:40.159 --> 01:52:41.896
don't doubt any of the points that have

2820
01:52:41.920 --> 01:52:44.920
been made by councelor Davis  one of

2821
01:52:44.960 --> 01:52:46.936
our great people who have served the

2822
01:52:46.960 --> 01:52:49.960
community so aly over the years but my

2823
01:52:50.480 --> 01:52:53.480
point is still don't laugh counselor

2824
01:52:53.599 --> 01:52:55.976
summers I'm very serious about this

2825
01:52:56.000 --> 01:52:57.896
the internal optimist that we hit for

2826
01:52:57.920 --> 01:53:00.376
years

2827
01:53:00.400 --> 01:53:03.336
I'm not optimistic myself as well um but

2828
01:53:03.360 --> 01:53:06.135
I I suppose what I'm what I believe here

2829
01:53:06.159 --> 01:53:09.159
is that unless we grasp this issue

2830
01:53:09.520 --> 01:53:12.520
as a council and look at simplifying the

2831
01:53:13.520 --> 01:53:15.175
story here and putting it to the

2832
01:53:15.199 --> 01:53:18.199
community, we're going to be left with a

2833
01:53:18.400 --> 01:53:20.936
a ride in our hands in 18 months time.

2834
01:53:20.960 --> 01:53:23.416
But if we start this story and have this

2835
01:53:23.440 --> 01:53:25.095
a communication process once we've got

2836
01:53:25.119 --> 01:53:27.175
this information in a simplified format,

2837
01:53:27.199 --> 01:53:30.199
which I believe Mr. Renie could do um in

2838
01:53:30.800 --> 01:53:33.095
an hour or two, I think that would be a

2839
01:53:33.119 --> 01:53:34.936
great step in the right direction to

2840
01:53:34.960 --> 01:53:37.175
help us understand the story. We don't

2841
01:53:37.199 --> 01:53:39.575
know where we are. That's the problem.

2842
01:53:39.599 --> 01:53:41.976
Despite having huge amounts of of

2843
01:53:42.000 --> 01:53:44.695
volumes of material, I've been looking

2844
01:53:44.719 --> 01:53:46.056
through the three volumes of the

2845
01:53:46.080 --> 01:53:48.615
operational plan, the financial plan,

2846
01:53:48.639 --> 01:53:51.639
the the 4year um delivery program. We've

2847
01:53:52.800 --> 01:53:54.615
got we've got all these these things.

2848
01:53:54.639 --> 01:53:57.016
But while we're required to have those

2849
01:53:57.040 --> 01:53:58.695
for government, no one understands what

2850
01:53:58.719 --> 01:54:00.296
they are. We've got too we've got too

2851
01:54:00.320 --> 01:54:02.695
much complexity. We need to simplify to

2852
01:54:02.719 --> 01:54:04.856
a simple question here and simple

2853
01:54:04.880 --> 01:54:06.776
information. So I think there's no harm

2854
01:54:06.800 --> 01:54:08.856
to this and I think it will be a value

2855
01:54:08.880 --> 01:54:11.175
for us as a as a council and community.

2856
01:54:11.199 --> 01:54:12.376
Thank you councelor Rose. With that I

2857
01:54:12.400 --> 01:54:14.056
put the amendment and  just as a

2858
01:54:14.080 --> 01:54:16.215
reminder this is the amendment. If it 

2859
01:54:16.239 --> 01:54:18.056
gets up then that becomes part of the

2860
01:54:18.080 --> 01:54:19.336
original motion which we will continue

2861
01:54:19.360 --> 01:54:21.016
debate. If not we will go back to the

2862
01:54:21.040 --> 01:54:23.256
original motion. All those in favor of

2863
01:54:23.280 --> 01:54:25.175
the amendment.

2864
01:54:25.199 --> 01:54:27.175
Councelor Stewart, Councelor Williamson,

2865
01:54:27.199 --> 01:54:29.416
Councelor Rose, Councelor Hopkins,

2866
01:54:29.440 --> 01:54:32.440
Councelor Elliot C. All those against

2867
01:54:33.280 --> 01:54:35.736
councelor Summers, councelor Higgins,

2868
01:54:35.760 --> 01:54:38.456
Councelor Rooney, Councelor Davis, the

2869
01:54:38.480 --> 01:54:40.296
motion's carry, the amendment is

2870
01:54:40.320 --> 01:54:41.336
carried.

2871
01:54:41.360 --> 01:54:43.095
So that becomes part B of the original

2872
01:54:43.119 --> 01:54:45.575
motion.

2873
01:54:45.599 --> 01:54:48.599
Just one moment. We'll let Jim catch up.

2874
01:54:49.679 --> 01:54:51.416
So the motion that we're now debating is

2875
01:54:51.440 --> 01:54:54.056
that a the progress against the 

2876
01:54:54.080 --> 01:54:56.376
recommendations be noted and that b

2877
01:54:56.400 --> 01:54:58.695
council the CEO examin a process whereby

2878
01:54:58.719 --> 01:55:00.215
residents can be informed of the

2879
01:55:00.239 --> 01:55:02.215
challenge faced by the lack of funds to

2880
01:55:02.239 --> 01:55:04.615
sustainably renew infrastructure and the

2881
01:55:04.639 --> 01:55:06.376
deterioration in our road network and

2882
01:55:06.400 --> 01:55:08.376
suggest options for strategies to remedy

2883
01:55:08.400 --> 01:55:11.400
these challenges.  it might be a C to

2884
01:55:11.679 --> 01:55:14.456
request a plan including time frame to

2885
01:55:14.480 --> 01:55:16.376
reduce the high-risk items to a lower

2886
01:55:16.400 --> 01:55:19.400
level of concern. Um we are now up to so

2887
01:55:21.520 --> 01:55:22.615
speaker

2888
01:55:22.639 --> 01:55:24.536
I don't I don't think high risk is quite

2889
01:55:24.560 --> 01:55:25.575
the right

2890
01:55:25.599 --> 01:55:26.135
okay

2891
01:55:26.159 --> 01:55:29.016
terminology just in it conveys the right

2892
01:55:29.040 --> 01:55:30.135
issue

2893
01:55:30.159 --> 01:55:32.856
what say I'm just checking the words in

2894
01:55:32.880 --> 01:55:35.095
the document

2895
01:55:35.119 --> 01:55:38.119
so I think they were high concern items

2896
01:55:38.639 --> 01:55:40.776
not high risk items

2897
01:55:40.800 --> 01:55:41.496
high concern

2898
01:55:41.520 --> 01:55:44.135
high concern you're correct council see

2899
01:55:44.159 --> 01:55:46.215
is to reduce the high concern items to a

2900
01:55:46.239 --> 01:55:48.456
lower level of concern

2901
01:55:48.480 --> 01:55:50.856
Okay. So, we've had a speaker um against

2902
01:55:50.880 --> 01:55:52.695
of course we're up to speaker against

2903
01:55:52.719 --> 01:55:55.416
counc

2904
01:55:55.440 --> 01:55:58.440
um through you to the CEO. Is that not

2905
01:55:59.599 --> 01:56:02.599
the IPNR process?

2906
01:56:03.040 --> 01:56:06.040
 through you madam chair. Yes.

2907
01:56:06.639 --> 01:56:08.135
Okay. Any further questions or speaker

2908
01:56:08.159 --> 01:56:10.456
against?

2909
01:56:10.480 --> 01:56:11.896
a bigger board.

2910
01:56:11.920 --> 01:56:14.376
Yeah. Well, look, yeah, I don't think

2911
01:56:14.400 --> 01:56:17.400
this will hurt to um if we can if we can

2912
01:56:18.400 --> 01:56:21.400
get a simpler process

2913
01:56:21.520 --> 01:56:24.456
um which I don't know whether it can be

2914
01:56:24.480 --> 01:56:27.416
achieved, but it's worth investigating

2915
01:56:27.440 --> 01:56:30.440
to to get out there to the community.

2916
01:56:31.040 --> 01:56:33.736
It's not an over complicated process is

2917
01:56:33.760 --> 01:56:36.760
that that that we we can only deliver

2918
01:56:36.800 --> 01:56:38.936
services so

2919
01:56:38.960 --> 01:56:41.416
to a certain level.

2920
01:56:41.440 --> 01:56:43.416
The main thing for council is to have

2921
01:56:43.440 --> 01:56:46.440
the have the efficiencies where we got

2922
01:56:46.560 --> 01:56:49.256
to go in and pick up where we're where

2923
01:56:49.280 --> 01:56:52.280
that that level is not being achieved.

2924
01:56:52.320 --> 01:56:54.215
And there's a number of those things in

2925
01:56:54.239 --> 01:56:57.239
the area. And it it is worth an exercise

2926
01:56:57.360 --> 01:56:59.736
to go through to try to to cut a few of

2927
01:56:59.760 --> 01:57:01.575
those out. We'll never get to the

2928
01:57:01.599 --> 01:57:04.215
optimum. Um that's going to be an

2929
01:57:04.239 --> 01:57:07.239
impossibility by any community and and a

2930
01:57:07.440 --> 01:57:09.816
bigger challenge from from our area

2931
01:57:09.840 --> 01:57:12.695
because the situation that was forced

2932
01:57:12.719 --> 01:57:15.719
upon this area through the amalgamate

2933
01:57:16.560 --> 01:57:18.776
the forced amalgamation of the three

2934
01:57:18.800 --> 01:57:21.800
three areas before has made it so much

2935
01:57:22.000 --> 01:57:23.736
more difficult because we've got this

2936
01:57:23.760 --> 01:57:26.760
huge area with not many people in. It

2937
01:57:27.040 --> 01:57:28.695
started out very clearly at the time

2938
01:57:28.719 --> 01:57:30.135
when they were going through that

2939
01:57:30.159 --> 01:57:31.976
process, the government the day and to

2940
01:57:32.000 --> 01:57:35.000
put it on this on this area and it's it

2941
01:57:35.119 --> 01:57:37.736
it's proven the people that raised

2942
01:57:37.760 --> 01:57:39.736
concerns about that in those days have

2943
01:57:39.760 --> 01:57:42.760
been proven completely right and and but

2944
01:57:43.040 --> 01:57:45.575
the challenge is now is to try to to

2945
01:57:45.599 --> 01:57:48.599
reduce the the worst part of that and

2946
01:57:48.880 --> 01:57:51.016
try to deliver the best services we can.

2947
01:57:51.040 --> 01:57:53.496
You'll never get them to to an extremely

2948
01:57:53.520 --> 01:57:55.336
high level. I can assure you of that

2949
01:57:55.360 --> 01:57:58.135
because of the cir the circumstances

2950
01:57:58.159 --> 01:58:00.856
we're we're in. But we it is worth

2951
01:58:00.880 --> 01:58:03.880
having in my view  a review and trying

2952
01:58:04.239 --> 01:58:07.239
to come up with a better management if

2953
01:58:07.840 --> 01:58:10.840
we can improve it by 5% or 10%.

2954
01:58:12.080 --> 01:58:15.080
And see I I'm not going to to um

2955
01:58:15.440 --> 01:58:17.816
announce a few little things I think

2956
01:58:17.840 --> 01:58:19.896
that are only small but if you do those

2957
01:58:19.920 --> 01:58:22.215
things you're going to help out. But a

2958
01:58:22.239 --> 01:58:24.056
discussion with council won't hurt. So

2959
01:58:24.080 --> 01:58:27.080
that's why I'll support what I mean.

2960
01:58:27.280 --> 01:58:30.280
I speak against

2961
01:58:31.440 --> 01:58:33.816
 councelor Davis. This remains your

2962
01:58:33.840 --> 01:58:35.175
motion, I think. Would you like a right

2963
01:58:35.199 --> 01:58:36.215
of reply?

2964
01:58:36.239 --> 01:58:39.239
 yes. This is part of the IPR process.

2965
01:58:40.480 --> 01:58:42.536
It is cumbersome. It is difficult for

2966
01:58:42.560 --> 01:58:44.536
the community to understand. It's

2967
01:58:44.560 --> 01:58:46.215
difficult for counselors to understand.

2968
01:58:46.239 --> 01:58:48.135
It takes at least four years to even

2969
01:58:48.159 --> 01:58:50.776
begin to actually use the system to the

2970
01:58:50.800 --> 01:58:52.776
benefit of the community  for our

2971
01:58:52.800 --> 01:58:54.856
elected counselors.

2972
01:58:54.880 --> 01:58:57.655
One of the challenges we have as a New

2973
01:58:57.679 --> 01:59:00.679
South Wales council is that our hands

2974
01:59:00.719 --> 01:59:02.936
are tied in regard to our rate

2975
01:59:02.960 --> 01:59:05.960
structure. And if we had more freedom in

2976
01:59:06.400 --> 01:59:08.695
regard to that, we'd probably be in a

2977
01:59:08.719 --> 01:59:11.719
much better state.  however,

2978
01:59:12.080 --> 01:59:14.376
 we have our hands tied. The

2979
01:59:14.400 --> 01:59:15.816
government tells us what we can and

2980
01:59:15.840 --> 01:59:18.135
can't do. And we are so reliant on the

2981
01:59:18.159 --> 01:59:19.736
government in regard to subsidies and

2982
01:59:19.760 --> 01:59:21.336
grants so that we can actually do the

2983
01:59:21.360 --> 01:59:23.976
main and important things that to that

2984
01:59:24.000 --> 01:59:26.215
are that are required for our community

2985
01:59:26.239 --> 01:59:29.239
like roads, water, and waste. They're

2986
01:59:29.840 --> 01:59:32.840
just absolutely essential and we need

2987
01:59:34.000 --> 01:59:35.976
I'd love to be self- sustaining, but

2988
01:59:36.000 --> 01:59:37.976
under our current financial structure

2989
01:59:38.000 --> 01:59:39.736
and the New South Wales system, we're

2990
01:59:39.760 --> 01:59:41.575
not going to be there. That's why we're

2991
01:59:41.599 --> 01:59:44.599
so reliant on our  other government 

2992
01:59:46.239 --> 01:59:48.856
partners to actually assist us in that.

2993
01:59:48.880 --> 01:59:51.880
So yes, we could try and put that up. I

2994
01:59:52.000 --> 01:59:53.976
have no issues with trying to put a

2995
01:59:54.000 --> 01:59:56.376
simplified version out to the community,

2996
01:59:56.400 --> 01:59:58.056
but we'll only get to part of the

2997
01:59:58.080 --> 02:00:00.376
community. People really aren't that

2998
02:00:00.400 --> 02:00:01.816
interested unless it actually affects

2999
02:00:01.840 --> 02:00:04.776
them on the day. And that happens with

3000
02:00:04.800 --> 02:00:07.256
everything we do in society because

3001
02:00:07.280 --> 02:00:10.135
everybody's really really busy. But

3002
02:00:10.159 --> 02:00:12.296
let's give it a go.

3003
02:00:12.320 --> 02:00:14.456
I've put the motion. All those in favor?

3004
02:00:14.480 --> 02:00:17.336
Councelor Summers? It's unanimous. Thank

3005
02:00:17.360 --> 02:00:19.256
you. Councilors, you might take a 10

3006
02:00:19.280 --> 02:00:22.280
minute break. Um, let's Is sufficient

3007
02:00:23.040 --> 02:00:25.336
back at 10 1? Is this lunch or

3008
02:00:25.360 --> 02:00:25.736
Yeah.

3009
02:00:25.760 --> 02:00:26.056
Oh.

3010
02:00:26.080 --> 02:00:28.056
Oh, it's lunch break.

3011
02:00:28.080 --> 02:00:28.615
Yeah.

3012
02:00:28.639 --> 02:00:31.416
15. Can we 80 minutes?

3013
02:00:31.440 --> 02:00:32.936
10 minutes. Yeah. All right. So, we have

3014
02:00:32.960 --> 02:00:34.856
to answer.

3015
02:00:34.880 --> 02:00:36.135
Yeah. I know. That's the thing. I was

3016
02:00:36.159 --> 02:00:37.655
thinking 10, but obviously not. Let's do

3017
02:00:37.679 --> 02:00:40.679
15. Can we do at 15?

3018
02:00:40.880 --> 02:00:43.880
We resume at 1:15. Thank you.

3019
02:00:46.080 --> 02:00:47.816
Um, thank you. Welcome back, counselors

3020
02:00:47.840 --> 02:00:49.416
and members of the public. We resume the

3021
02:00:49.440 --> 02:00:51.736
meeting at 1:25

3022
02:00:51.760 --> 02:00:54.760
p.m. moving on to item 9.3.8 in the

3023
02:00:55.119 --> 02:00:56.376
business paper, the performance

3024
02:00:56.400 --> 02:00:58.215
improvement order for the 10th and 11th

3025
02:00:58.239 --> 02:01:00.776
report. Do I have a motion?

3026
02:01:00.800 --> 02:01:01.575
Councelor Davis,

3027
02:01:01.599 --> 02:01:03.575
I'll move.

3028
02:01:03.599 --> 02:01:04.936
, councelor Davis, officer's

3029
02:01:04.960 --> 02:01:06.376
recommendation seconded by councelor

3030
02:01:06.400 --> 02:01:07.976
Stewart. Councelor Davis, would you like

3031
02:01:08.000 --> 02:01:08.856
to speak to the motion?

3032
02:01:08.880 --> 02:01:10.936
, I think this report just speaks for

3033
02:01:10.960 --> 02:01:13.960
itself that um,

3034
02:01:14.159 --> 02:01:17.095
, a level of compliance was really

3035
02:01:17.119 --> 02:01:20.119
really coming into order up until

3036
02:01:20.239 --> 02:01:22.615
October and then we've had this massive

3037
02:01:22.639 --> 02:01:23.256
increase in

3038
02:01:23.280 --> 02:01:26.280
what was that cause right?

3039
02:01:26.560 --> 02:01:29.560
I want to get to the bottom of that.

3040
02:01:31.119 --> 02:01:32.936
I will remind council that respectful

3041
02:01:32.960 --> 02:01:34.376
debate is located.

3042
02:01:34.400 --> 02:01:35.655
Councelor Davis, would you like your

3043
02:01:35.679 --> 02:01:37.416
five minutes to support in speak in

3044
02:01:37.440 --> 02:01:38.936
support of your motion?

3045
02:01:38.960 --> 02:01:41.416
I think the report speaks for itself and

3046
02:01:41.440 --> 02:01:43.496
 people can read into whatever they

3047
02:01:43.520 --> 02:01:44.936
would like, but I think it's pretty

3048
02:01:44.960 --> 02:01:45.416
obvious.

3049
02:01:45.440 --> 02:01:47.256
Thank you very much.

3050
02:01:47.280 --> 02:01:49.016
 questions. Yes, councelor Elliot.

3051
02:01:49.040 --> 02:01:52.040
Um back in August, September, I asked

3052
02:01:52.159 --> 02:01:55.159
about could we be told individually if

3053
02:01:55.199 --> 02:01:57.336
we're going to learn from all this all

3054
02:01:57.360 --> 02:02:00.360
these complaints.  if we could be told

3055
02:02:00.400 --> 02:02:02.776
individually and the OOLG was supposed

3056
02:02:02.800 --> 02:02:04.695
to get back to us.

3057
02:02:04.719 --> 02:02:05.976
How did we get a response

3058
02:02:06.000 --> 02:02:07.896
 through you madam chair? Yes, they

3059
02:02:07.920 --> 02:02:10.135
have given a response back and said

3060
02:02:10.159 --> 02:02:13.095
individual reports can be tailored. The

3061
02:02:13.119 --> 02:02:15.256
issue they see is how do you provide the

3062
02:02:15.280 --> 02:02:16.296
report without breaching

3063
02:02:16.320 --> 02:02:18.056
confidentiality.

3064
02:02:18.080 --> 02:02:21.080
So, , it places it in a difficult

3065
02:02:21.119 --> 02:02:22.856
situation because if you are speaking to

3066
02:02:22.880 --> 02:02:25.575
a counselor about a specific incident,

3067
02:02:25.599 --> 02:02:28.056
it's going to identify the person who's

3068
02:02:28.080 --> 02:02:31.080
put in a complaint about it.

3069
02:02:31.199 --> 02:02:32.536
Thank you. That's

3070
02:02:32.560 --> 02:02:35.560
understand.

3071
02:02:35.920 --> 02:02:38.056
Can I make a comment that Yeah, we'll

3072
02:02:38.080 --> 02:02:40.695
never learn if we don't know

3073
02:02:40.719 --> 02:02:41.736
if it applies to

3074
02:02:41.760 --> 02:02:43.575
I'll give you some advice.

3075
02:02:43.599 --> 02:02:46.599
Thanks, Bob. No, don't take much

3076
02:02:47.040 --> 02:02:48.296
speaking again. Do you have a question?

3077
02:02:48.320 --> 02:02:50.056
No, I've got a series of questions. So,

3078
02:02:50.080 --> 02:02:52.856
the first I've got a question.

3079
02:02:52.880 --> 02:02:53.976
I have a very quick question. We'll do

3080
02:02:54.000 --> 02:02:55.655
the quick question first if you like.

3081
02:02:55.679 --> 02:02:57.736
Just the to clear up the issue in

3082
02:02:57.760 --> 02:03:00.056
relation to is there or is there not an

3083
02:03:00.080 --> 02:03:03.080
extent PIO? My understanding is that the

3084
02:03:03.679 --> 02:03:06.679
PIO reporting issue is over the PIO and

3085
02:03:07.360 --> 02:03:09.655
its substantive requirements on us to

3086
02:03:09.679 --> 02:03:12.296
follow those things is in place. Am I

3087
02:03:12.320 --> 02:03:14.135
correct in that perception? Do you madam

3088
02:03:14.159 --> 02:03:15.496
chair? Yes, that's correct.

3089
02:03:15.520 --> 02:03:18.215
Thank you, councelor Rose. Oh, sorry. I

3090
02:03:18.239 --> 02:03:21.239
suppose in terms of that um and I I

3091
02:03:21.679 --> 02:03:23.496
agree with the question that we just

3092
02:03:23.520 --> 02:03:24.856
that's information we need to know

3093
02:03:24.880 --> 02:03:27.816
because I was reading through the PIO

3094
02:03:27.840 --> 02:03:29.736
just for a light reading and discovered

3095
02:03:29.760 --> 02:03:32.760
that um that a report on compliance was

3096
02:03:34.960 --> 02:03:37.175
going to occur within one month of

3097
02:03:37.199 --> 02:03:39.575
commencement of the order and then it

3098
02:03:39.599 --> 02:03:42.456
says interesting enough a final report

3099
02:03:42.480 --> 02:03:44.215
on the implementation of the actions is

3100
02:03:44.239 --> 02:03:46.456
required to be provided by the final

3101
02:03:46.480 --> 02:03:48.695
compliance report due the end of

3102
02:03:48.719 --> 02:03:51.095
December. So, there was clearly a the

3103
02:03:51.119 --> 02:03:52.856
order itself indicated an end date of

3104
02:03:52.880 --> 02:03:54.296
December.

3105
02:03:54.320 --> 02:03:57.320
So, it's alarming to think that

3106
02:03:58.159 --> 02:04:00.376
that we're still required to comply

3107
02:04:00.400 --> 02:04:01.896
given the fact that there was a final

3108
02:04:01.920 --> 02:04:03.736
report due in December and it says a

3109
02:04:03.760 --> 02:04:06.760
final report at that date. Now,

3110
02:04:07.199 --> 02:04:10.199
not only that, I think we've got a

3111
02:04:10.400 --> 02:04:13.400
situation where we've had absolutely no

3112
02:04:14.560 --> 02:04:16.615
response from the minister's office as

3113
02:04:16.639 --> 02:04:18.856
far as we were informed.

3114
02:04:18.880 --> 02:04:19.976
You need to be questioned.

3115
02:04:20.000 --> 02:04:22.376
Yes. Has So, why haven't we had a

3116
02:04:22.400 --> 02:04:23.896
response and why haven't we sought a

3117
02:04:23.920 --> 02:04:26.135
response from the minister's office?

3118
02:04:26.159 --> 02:04:28.776
Because we've been sending reports in. I

3119
02:04:28.800 --> 02:04:31.175
suspect the reports of Mike being you

3120
02:04:31.199 --> 02:04:32.615
know taken from the minister and hidden

3121
02:04:32.639 --> 02:04:34.776
from him because otherwise he's a very

3122
02:04:34.800 --> 02:04:36.296
top minister and he give us a report

3123
02:04:36.320 --> 02:04:39.175
he'd give us feedback straight away

3124
02:04:39.199 --> 02:04:41.016
10 10 months have gone by and we don't

3125
02:04:41.040 --> 02:04:42.215
know anything

3126
02:04:42.239 --> 02:04:44.296
and we're sort of hinging reports into

3127
02:04:44.320 --> 02:04:44.936
the

3128
02:04:44.960 --> 02:04:46.695
we're we're hurting reports into the

3129
02:04:46.719 --> 02:04:49.719
ether um madam chair I'm just concerned

3130
02:04:50.320 --> 02:04:51.416
that

3131
02:04:51.440 --> 02:04:52.776
there's been a lot of time and effort

3132
02:04:52.800 --> 02:04:55.800
and and go into here and I just feel as

3133
02:04:55.920 --> 02:04:58.376
though we shouldn't do any further the

3134
02:04:58.400 --> 02:04:59.655
reporting until we actually have

3135
02:04:59.679 --> 02:05:02.056
feedback from the minister because I

3136
02:05:02.080 --> 02:05:04.376
think we're but it says the final report

3137
02:05:04.400 --> 02:05:05.896
was due in December. That's what it says

3138
02:05:05.920 --> 02:05:07.496
in in the order. We've had no other

3139
02:05:07.520 --> 02:05:10.520
order except that perhaps our CEO has

3140
02:05:11.280 --> 02:05:13.256
talked to someone about it and so

3141
02:05:13.280 --> 02:05:15.016
perhaps we can get some further

3142
02:05:15.040 --> 02:05:15.736
information.

3143
02:05:15.760 --> 02:05:17.896
Councelor, if I may I'll give everything

3144
02:05:17.920 --> 02:05:18.776
to the CEO then.

3145
02:05:18.800 --> 02:05:21.095
Oh, okay. Thank you, Madam May. , I

3146
02:05:21.119 --> 02:05:22.695
did communicate with councilors this

3147
02:05:22.719 --> 02:05:24.615
week that the Office of Local Government

3148
02:05:24.639 --> 02:05:26.056
will be providing us written

3149
02:05:26.080 --> 02:05:28.776
correspondence around our PIO. Um, I do

3150
02:05:28.800 --> 02:05:30.776
expect that to be happening shortly. I

3151
02:05:30.800 --> 02:05:32.296
can't confirm a date in terms of when

3152
02:05:32.320 --> 02:05:34.456
that's going to be coming to us, but

3153
02:05:34.480 --> 02:05:36.296
they have highlighted to me that council

3154
02:05:36.320 --> 02:05:38.695
will be getting detailed 

3155
02:05:38.719 --> 02:05:40.856
correspondence around the the status of

3156
02:05:40.880 --> 02:05:43.256
the PIO, whether or not there's going to

3157
02:05:43.280 --> 02:05:45.336
be further reporting requirements. But

3158
02:05:45.360 --> 02:05:47.256
in terms of  the reporting period of

3159
02:05:47.280 --> 02:05:50.215
the 12 months that has ended if council

3160
02:05:50.239 --> 02:05:52.376
choose to continue on with this type of

3161
02:05:52.400 --> 02:05:54.456
reporting that's outside of the PIO

3162
02:05:54.480 --> 02:05:56.056
that's also another option there in

3163
02:05:56.080 --> 02:05:58.456
terms of considering the trends but um

3164
02:05:58.480 --> 02:06:00.376
that's completely up to you.

3165
02:06:00.400 --> 02:06:01.816
Thank you councel.

3166
02:06:01.840 --> 02:06:03.655
So so I have a question a second

3167
02:06:03.679 --> 02:06:05.655
question relating to that vehicle issue.

3168
02:06:05.679 --> 02:06:08.679
So and I suppose it's a question to the

3169
02:06:08.960 --> 02:06:10.536
mayor

3170
02:06:10.560 --> 02:06:11.976
really who's not here. So it's a

3171
02:06:12.000 --> 02:06:15.000
question to you madame deputy mayor. Um

3172
02:06:16.239 --> 02:06:19.239
have you or the mayor sought a pathway a

3173
02:06:20.080 --> 02:06:23.080
defined pathway or criteria for lifting

3174
02:06:23.280 --> 02:06:25.416
the performance improvement order? I'll

3175
02:06:25.440 --> 02:06:28.440
just add to the question because the pio

3176
02:06:28.560 --> 02:06:30.615
itself says clearly it finishes in

3177
02:06:30.639 --> 02:06:32.296
December with there's no other

3178
02:06:32.320 --> 02:06:34.615
indication of anything. We've got

3179
02:06:34.639 --> 02:06:36.376
something supplementary when it's going

3180
02:06:36.400 --> 02:06:38.776
to happen and this is a very

3181
02:06:38.800 --> 02:06:40.536
disagreeable situation for us as a

3182
02:06:40.560 --> 02:06:42.695
council and I don't want us to continue

3183
02:06:42.719 --> 02:06:44.776
reporting into the ether for no reason.

3184
02:06:44.800 --> 02:06:46.135
You're absolutely right councelor Rose

3185
02:06:46.159 --> 02:06:47.496
the PIO is definitely a very

3186
02:06:47.520 --> 02:06:49.496
disagreeable situation. As as the CEO

3187
02:06:49.520 --> 02:06:51.976
said, the reporting has um is now

3188
02:06:52.000 --> 02:06:54.215
concluded, but the order improvement

3189
02:06:54.239 --> 02:06:56.615
order remains in force and as the CEO

3190
02:06:56.639 --> 02:06:58.615
pointed out, additional information will

3191
02:06:58.639 --> 02:07:01.639
be coming soon in terms of  pathways

3192
02:07:02.079 --> 02:07:04.536
for improving our situation. Absolutely.

3193
02:07:04.560 --> 02:07:07.256
It's as um there there are a number of

3194
02:07:07.280 --> 02:07:10.055
items in the order that we need to sort

3195
02:07:10.079 --> 02:07:12.215
of work on you know um and I don't need

3196
02:07:12.239 --> 02:07:13.575
to sort of go through what they are now

3197
02:07:13.599 --> 02:07:15.016
and I would imagine that's a lot of them

3198
02:07:15.040 --> 02:07:16.376
we have been working on which will

3199
02:07:16.400 --> 02:07:18.456
hopefully improve our situation but

3200
02:07:18.480 --> 02:07:20.856
until we can um sort of demonstrate

3201
02:07:20.880 --> 02:07:22.376
improvement

3202
02:07:22.400 --> 02:07:24.456
um it's it's a difficult battle to

3203
02:07:24.480 --> 02:07:26.776
fight. So councelor Williamson

3204
02:07:26.800 --> 02:07:28.215
sorry madame may there was also a

3205
02:07:28.239 --> 02:07:29.896
council resolution that the mayor was to

3206
02:07:29.920 --> 02:07:31.575
write to the minister which he has

3207
02:07:31.599 --> 02:07:33.575
undertaken. Um obviously he's not here

3208
02:07:33.599 --> 02:07:35.976
today to report on it and we have just

3209
02:07:36.000 --> 02:07:37.416
recently reached out to the minister's

3210
02:07:37.440 --> 02:07:39.736
office just to try and arrange a meeting

3211
02:07:39.760 --> 02:07:41.496
um for when we're up in Sydney next just

3212
02:07:41.520 --> 02:07:44.135
to go through the PIO as well.

3213
02:07:44.159 --> 02:07:47.159
Winning um thank you um madam deputy

3214
02:07:48.960 --> 02:07:51.960
mayor. Um I I'd just like to make sure

3215
02:07:52.960 --> 02:07:55.496
all the details right. So as I

3216
02:07:55.520 --> 02:07:57.095
understood it, the performance

3217
02:07:57.119 --> 02:08:00.119
improvement order  has to be issued by

3218
02:08:00.400 --> 02:08:03.400
the minister and it must be  issued in

3219
02:08:04.560 --> 02:08:07.496
accordance with the procedures that are

3220
02:08:07.520 --> 02:08:10.520
defined.  and that ends in a written

3221
02:08:11.040 --> 02:08:13.736
instrument coming to us saying tada

3222
02:08:13.760 --> 02:08:15.256
you're under performance of written

3223
02:08:15.280 --> 02:08:18.280
order.  understand the order that was

3224
02:08:18.320 --> 02:08:20.856
given to us has expired and therefore

3225
02:08:20.880 --> 02:08:23.880
has ended.  have we been issued an

3226
02:08:25.040 --> 02:08:28.040
additional order?

3227
02:08:28.639 --> 02:08:30.536
Sorry.

3228
02:08:30.560 --> 02:08:32.135
Yeah. Through you, Madame May. The order

3229
02:08:32.159 --> 02:08:34.215
has not finished. The reporting

3230
02:08:34.239 --> 02:08:36.296
requirement for the 12 months was under

3231
02:08:36.320 --> 02:08:39.320
section 48 438F

3232
02:08:39.840 --> 02:08:41.655
which is around compliance reported the

3233
02:08:41.679 --> 02:08:43.256
local government act. That's where the

3234
02:08:43.280 --> 02:08:46.055
12 month time frame comes in to the

3235
02:08:46.079 --> 02:08:48.456
order.

3236
02:08:48.480 --> 02:08:50.215
So just to clarify, the order remains in

3237
02:08:50.239 --> 02:08:53.095
place until it is lifted. Yeah,

3238
02:08:53.119 --> 02:08:55.575
it's an unlimited order in terms of its

3239
02:08:55.599 --> 02:08:56.376
time frame.

3240
02:08:56.400 --> 02:08:59.175
Yes. Do you madame mayor?  yes. In

3241
02:08:59.199 --> 02:09:01.496
terms of  the legislation, there is no

3242
02:09:01.520 --> 02:09:03.816
section in the act in itself that says

3243
02:09:03.840 --> 02:09:06.840
once a PIO is issued that it it ceases

3244
02:09:06.960 --> 02:09:09.575
at within 12 months or 24 months.

3245
02:09:09.599 --> 02:09:11.816
There's no date to it. So we are waiting

3246
02:09:11.840 --> 02:09:14.055
for that correspondence from um the

3247
02:09:14.079 --> 02:09:15.175
minister's office.

3248
02:09:15.199 --> 02:09:18.199
I understood sorry I think I could ask a

3249
02:09:18.400 --> 02:09:21.016
question. Um, I understood

3250
02:09:21.040 --> 02:09:22.536
from my recollection of the

3251
02:09:22.560 --> 02:09:24.856
correspondence and indeed from my

3252
02:09:24.880 --> 02:09:27.736
googling just now that the original

3253
02:09:27.760 --> 02:09:30.536
order stated it was for 12 months. That

3254
02:09:30.560 --> 02:09:33.175
12 month period is expired.

3255
02:09:33.199 --> 02:09:36.199
So if it's expired, so is the order.

3256
02:09:36.239 --> 02:09:38.296
Do you madame mayor the reference to the

3257
02:09:38.320 --> 02:09:41.320
12 months highlights section 483

3258
02:09:42.000 --> 02:09:45.000
438F compliance report. A council must

3259
02:09:45.599 --> 02:09:47.016
provide the minister with written

3260
02:09:47.040 --> 02:09:48.695
reports on its compliance with the

3261
02:09:48.719 --> 02:09:50.456
performance improvement order as

3262
02:09:50.480 --> 02:09:52.055
required by the order. So that was the

3263
02:09:52.079 --> 02:09:54.856
12-month period. So the 12 months that's

3264
02:09:54.880 --> 02:09:57.880
referenced in the order links it to 438F

3265
02:09:58.639 --> 02:10:01.095
compliance report.

3266
02:10:01.119 --> 02:10:01.655
Thank you.

3267
02:10:01.679 --> 02:10:03.575
Thank you Cartw. No

3268
02:10:03.599 --> 02:10:06.055
just we just go in order. Cu I think was

3269
02:10:06.079 --> 02:10:07.896
Yeah, you better let me have a say

3270
02:10:07.920 --> 02:10:08.776
counselor.

3271
02:10:08.800 --> 02:10:10.615
Look, I'm happy to have you have a say.

3272
02:10:10.639 --> 02:10:13.639
I just was just apolog

3273
02:10:29.599 --> 02:10:31.575
as as the CEO has pointed out they have

3274
02:10:31.599 --> 02:10:34.135
now that's now been completed and has

3275
02:10:34.159 --> 02:10:35.816
concluded. The performance improvement

3276
02:10:35.840 --> 02:10:37.896
order, however, remains in place until

3277
02:10:37.920 --> 02:10:39.736
it is lifted and we are awaiting further

3278
02:10:39.760 --> 02:10:41.416
correspondence. So, we're all on the

3279
02:10:41.440 --> 02:10:41.896
same page.

3280
02:10:41.920 --> 02:10:43.336
Did we do a compliance report for

3281
02:10:43.360 --> 02:10:44.376
January then?

3282
02:10:44.400 --> 02:10:46.296
But no, the one that we've got was until

3283
02:10:46.320 --> 02:10:48.055
well went into the 6th of January. So,

3284
02:10:48.079 --> 02:10:49.896
ever so teeny tiny bit of January. So we

3285
02:10:49.920 --> 02:10:51.736
haven't done eight months. So no, I just

3286
02:10:51.760 --> 02:10:54.760
wanted to know where we thanks for your

3287
02:10:54.880 --> 02:10:57.496
account there. No, no. My my my question

3288
02:10:57.520 --> 02:11:00.520
is I asked a while ago could we get a

3289
02:11:00.560 --> 02:11:03.175
financial cost of the PIO

3290
02:11:03.199 --> 02:11:06.199
for for for the the 12 months that I

3291
02:11:06.719 --> 02:11:09.336
haven't seen any of those figures and I

3292
02:11:09.360 --> 02:11:10.856
think

3293
02:11:10.880 --> 02:11:13.416
we should although I know councelor Rose

3294
02:11:13.440 --> 02:11:15.416
has got a very high opinion of the

3295
02:11:15.440 --> 02:11:16.936
minister and probably I have I've never

3296
02:11:16.960 --> 02:11:19.960
met the guy but it is a burden on on on

3297
02:11:20.480 --> 02:11:22.936
us count if we've met our obligations we

3298
02:11:22.960 --> 02:11:25.496
want to get out of this  and how we

3299
02:11:25.520 --> 02:11:27.816
can save the community money and get on

3300
02:11:27.840 --> 02:11:30.296
get on with the job. So, I think it's

3301
02:11:30.320 --> 02:11:32.936
it's just I think it's very important

3302
02:11:32.960 --> 02:11:35.736
that we find out and I think you'll find

3303
02:11:35.760 --> 02:11:38.376
the cost of this process has been

3304
02:11:38.400 --> 02:11:40.615
quite substantial and I want all the

3305
02:11:40.639 --> 02:11:43.639
costing not I don't want to sugarcoat it

3306
02:11:44.719 --> 02:11:47.496
when I get it of of what it has cost the

3307
02:11:47.520 --> 02:11:50.520
the council for going into this process.

3308
02:11:50.560 --> 02:11:53.095
It will be substantial but I can't get

3309
02:11:53.119 --> 02:11:55.575
it. I've asked for it. So I would like a

3310
02:11:55.599 --> 02:11:57.496
table for the next meeting that we get a

3311
02:11:57.520 --> 02:12:00.520
full cost for the what it costs the PIO

3312
02:12:01.119 --> 02:12:04.119
and then we should be approaching the

3313
02:12:04.800 --> 02:12:07.800
minister to say look if you got no no

3314
02:12:07.920 --> 02:12:09.416
issues with us. We're getting on with

3315
02:12:09.440 --> 02:12:12.055
the job. Why are we still under this and

3316
02:12:12.079 --> 02:12:13.816
costing our community money? We we're

3317
02:12:13.840 --> 02:12:16.615
struggling to give our community the

3318
02:12:16.639 --> 02:12:19.639
services that it is. So, so we've got to

3319
02:12:19.760 --> 02:12:21.896
throw the ball back onto the onto the 

3320
02:12:21.920 --> 02:12:24.920
minister if we're doing the job. So, I

3321
02:12:25.040 --> 02:12:27.496
think we sooner we get that and I

3322
02:12:27.520 --> 02:12:28.776
thought we'd had it how we could have

3323
02:12:28.800 --> 02:12:31.416
gone in now with it and to to to address

3324
02:12:31.440 --> 02:12:34.296
the minister's concerns if if he wants

3325
02:12:34.320 --> 02:12:35.896
let him come down and tell the community

3326
02:12:35.920 --> 02:12:37.496
he's put us on again. It's going to cost

3327
02:12:37.520 --> 02:12:39.736
us x amount of dollars to run this

3328
02:12:39.760 --> 02:12:42.760
process again for another 12 months.

3329
02:12:42.960 --> 02:12:44.695
I think it's very important that we find

3330
02:12:44.719 --> 02:12:47.175
out the exact cost and the exact cost.

3331
02:12:47.199 --> 02:12:48.296
Thank you. We'll take that as a question

3332
02:12:48.320 --> 02:12:51.095
on notice. CEO would like to that

3333
02:12:51.119 --> 02:12:53.095
question's already been asked. So,

3334
02:12:53.119 --> 02:12:55.575
sorry through you, Madam Chair. That

3335
02:12:55.599 --> 02:12:58.296
question in terms of the cost has been

3336
02:12:58.320 --> 02:12:59.976
discussed and it was explained

3337
02:13:00.000 --> 02:13:02.296
previously in a council meeting that we

3338
02:13:02.320 --> 02:13:04.135
can only cost the cost at the cost of

3339
02:13:04.159 --> 02:13:05.816
the consultant who's been providing

3340
02:13:05.840 --> 02:13:08.376
advice to council. The staff cost has

3341
02:13:08.400 --> 02:13:10.215
not been costed in this process.

3342
02:13:10.239 --> 02:13:12.536
Well, I haven't seen it. No, as in that

3343
02:13:12.560 --> 02:13:14.215
was explained in terms of um I think

3344
02:13:14.239 --> 02:13:16.215
when it was raised around understanding

3345
02:13:16.239 --> 02:13:18.376
the the cost of the PIO, we can only

3346
02:13:18.400 --> 02:13:20.695
provide one component of the cost, the

3347
02:13:20.719 --> 02:13:23.256
staff time in terms of when they're um

3348
02:13:23.280 --> 02:13:26.135
monitoring  and reporting that's not

3349
02:13:26.159 --> 02:13:27.496
being um time shaded at all.

3350
02:13:27.520 --> 02:13:29.256
With due respect, CEO the consultancy

3351
02:13:29.280 --> 02:13:30.695
costs in terms of the training and the

3352
02:13:30.719 --> 02:13:32.376
reporting and that possibly could be

3353
02:13:32.400 --> 02:13:35.016
provided then that that's the question

3354
02:13:35.040 --> 02:13:37.496
that we need to have answered. Councelor

3355
02:13:37.520 --> 02:13:39.655
Summers, you had a question or delay? 

3356
02:13:39.679 --> 02:13:41.655
question possibly a little

3357
02:13:41.679 --> 02:13:44.679
controversial. Um the the um PI items

3358
02:13:47.119 --> 02:13:49.976
that we do report and I think it would

3359
02:13:50.000 --> 02:13:52.615
be useful given our discussion about our

3360
02:13:52.639 --> 02:13:55.095
own performance is is it worthwhile

3361
02:13:55.119 --> 02:13:58.119
continuing on with the graphing of the

3362
02:13:58.880 --> 02:14:01.575
incidents that occur just to get the

3363
02:14:01.599 --> 02:14:03.256
trend and see whether the trend becomes

3364
02:14:03.280 --> 02:14:06.215
our friend.  I will answer that

3365
02:14:06.239 --> 02:14:08.055
quickly for you councelor Summons. Given

3366
02:14:08.079 --> 02:14:09.976
the  financial burden and burden on

3367
02:14:10.000 --> 02:14:13.000
resources  you may not  the benefit

3368
02:14:13.360 --> 02:14:14.936
the sorry the cost may outweigh the

3369
02:14:14.960 --> 02:14:16.456
benefits on that one.

3370
02:14:16.480 --> 02:14:19.480
Is that through CO is the cost of such

3371
02:14:20.159 --> 02:14:22.376
outweigh the benefit?

3372
02:14:22.400 --> 02:14:22.856
Um

3373
02:14:22.880 --> 02:14:23.655
sorry I

3374
02:14:23.679 --> 02:14:25.655
yeah through Madam Chair. , I feel a

3375
02:14:25.679 --> 02:14:27.256
little bit put on the spot, but it it is

3376
02:14:27.280 --> 02:14:29.416
labor, we won't lie, like it is labor

3377
02:14:29.440 --> 02:14:31.336
intensive in terms of staff time

3378
02:14:31.360 --> 02:14:33.575
monitoring this, but I'm also very

3379
02:14:33.599 --> 02:14:35.175
mindful that I have been told by the

3380
02:14:35.199 --> 02:14:37.175
Office of Local Government to expect

3381
02:14:37.199 --> 02:14:39.416
something to come out to us. So, that

3382
02:14:39.440 --> 02:14:41.896
might specify no more reporting from

3383
02:14:41.920 --> 02:14:44.856
from the state um perspective or it

3384
02:14:44.880 --> 02:14:46.135
might state to us that we need to

3385
02:14:46.159 --> 02:14:47.575
continue to report. So I don't want to

3386
02:14:47.599 --> 02:14:49.816
preempt a process, but in terms of what

3387
02:14:49.840 --> 02:14:51.575
you're asking about doing it locally,

3388
02:14:51.599 --> 02:14:54.376
it's just being mindful that  it is

3389
02:14:54.400 --> 02:14:56.215
labor intensive on staff time.

3390
02:14:56.239 --> 02:14:58.055
In all due respect, if the office of

3391
02:14:58.079 --> 02:14:59.736
local government want us and then we've

3392
02:14:59.760 --> 02:15:01.976
met our obligation and continue on, I

3393
02:15:02.000 --> 02:15:03.416
think we ought to ask the office of

3394
02:15:03.440 --> 02:15:05.175
local government to cover the cost for

3395
02:15:05.199 --> 02:15:08.199
us to save our community paying for it.

3396
02:15:08.239 --> 02:15:10.615
Do not council Williamson question or

3397
02:15:10.639 --> 02:15:13.496
we can't be run by the office of a

3398
02:15:13.520 --> 02:15:13.896
question.

3399
02:15:13.920 --> 02:15:16.376
Thank you. Um, given my the answer to my

3400
02:15:16.400 --> 02:15:19.256
previous question, in order

3401
02:15:19.280 --> 02:15:21.416
 for us for the Office of Local

3402
02:15:21.440 --> 02:15:24.215
Government to require us to continue to

3403
02:15:24.239 --> 02:15:26.856
do reporting, would that require the

3404
02:15:26.880 --> 02:15:29.736
minister to update the order?

3405
02:15:29.760 --> 02:15:30.135
Yes.

3406
02:15:30.159 --> 02:15:30.536
Yes.

3407
02:15:30.560 --> 02:15:30.936
Yes.

3408
02:15:30.960 --> 02:15:33.960
Right. um in the absence of an updated

3409
02:15:34.000 --> 02:15:35.496
order

3410
02:15:35.520 --> 02:15:38.520
um for us to continue to incur expense

3411
02:15:39.599 --> 02:15:41.575
 under our own rules, wouldn't we have

3412
02:15:41.599 --> 02:15:43.816
to specify where that was being funded

3413
02:15:43.840 --> 02:15:44.536
out of?

3414
02:15:44.560 --> 02:15:47.416
Just to clarify, the reporting now is

3415
02:15:47.440 --> 02:15:49.095
ceased. That was required up until

3416
02:15:49.119 --> 02:15:50.695
December. So that stops. There's no more

3417
02:15:50.719 --> 02:15:52.856
reporting. So no more reporting. So no

3418
02:15:52.880 --> 02:15:55.880
more expenditure on um required. The

3419
02:15:57.040 --> 02:15:59.816
order and the compliance stands, but the

3420
02:15:59.840 --> 02:16:02.296
reporting if it has finished.

3421
02:16:02.320 --> 02:16:04.055
All right. So, so in the absence of

3422
02:16:04.079 --> 02:16:07.079
being ordered to continue to report to

3423
02:16:08.239 --> 02:16:11.239
if we wanted to continue to report, we

3424
02:16:11.360 --> 02:16:12.936
would have to have a motion and that

3425
02:16:12.960 --> 02:16:15.960
motion would have to specify where the

3426
02:16:16.000 --> 02:16:17.655
funding was going to come from.

3427
02:16:17.679 --> 02:16:19.816
 in short, yes. Yes.

3428
02:16:19.840 --> 02:16:20.695
Thank you,

3429
02:16:20.719 --> 02:16:21.976
councelor Rose.

3430
02:16:22.000 --> 02:16:24.376
I want to make amendment to the motion.

3431
02:16:24.400 --> 02:16:26.215
Sure.

3432
02:16:26.239 --> 02:16:28.135
The amendment is first council note to

3433
02:16:28.159 --> 02:16:30.536
details the report. Secondly, that

3434
02:16:30.560 --> 02:16:32.375
council requests that the mayor meet

3435
02:16:32.399 --> 02:16:35.399
personally with the minister to discuss

3436
02:16:35.519 --> 02:16:38.375
the performance improvement order and

3437
02:16:38.399 --> 02:16:41.399
next steps.

3438
02:16:42.160 --> 02:16:44.375
Um

3439
02:16:44.399 --> 02:16:47.016
the mayor probably the mayor to request

3440
02:16:47.040 --> 02:16:48.936
to meet. No.

3441
02:16:48.960 --> 02:16:49.335
Yeah.

3442
02:16:49.359 --> 02:16:51.096
If if minister does not want to speak to

3443
02:16:51.120 --> 02:16:53.016
the mayor, then we won't be able to um

3444
02:16:53.040 --> 02:16:56.040
complete that action. So um that  that

3445
02:16:56.399 --> 02:16:58.216
the mayor requests

3446
02:16:58.240 --> 02:16:58.695
meeting

3447
02:16:58.719 --> 02:17:00.776
to meeting personally with the minister.

3448
02:17:00.800 --> 02:17:03.256
Yeah.

3449
02:17:03.280 --> 02:17:04.776
Yes.

3450
02:17:04.800 --> 02:17:06.056
Davis, are you happy for that to be

3451
02:17:06.080 --> 02:17:06.615
included?

3452
02:17:06.639 --> 02:17:08.295
Who is that?

3453
02:17:08.319 --> 02:17:10.535
Okay. Thank you. Easy.

3454
02:17:10.559 --> 02:17:11.575
Thanks.

3455
02:17:11.599 --> 02:17:14.599
 do we have

3456
02:17:15.599 --> 02:17:18.056
 do we have somebody speaking against

3457
02:17:18.080 --> 02:17:21.080
the motion?

3458
02:17:22.080 --> 02:17:23.896
Oh.

3459
02:17:23.920 --> 02:17:25.256
Councor Davis, do you need a right of

3460
02:17:25.280 --> 02:17:27.016
reply?

3461
02:17:27.040 --> 02:17:27.256
Oh,

3462
02:17:27.280 --> 02:17:28.295
sorry.

3463
02:17:28.319 --> 02:17:30.615
Sorry, just perhaps a suggested

3464
02:17:30.639 --> 02:17:33.096
amendment. I don't recall seeing the

3465
02:17:33.120 --> 02:17:34.695
correspondence

3466
02:17:34.719 --> 02:17:37.016
that the mayor sent to the

3467
02:17:37.040 --> 02:17:39.736
Oh, back a year ago.

3468
02:17:39.760 --> 02:17:41.816
Could that be shared with counselors?

3469
02:17:41.840 --> 02:17:42.535
Yes.

3470
02:17:42.559 --> 02:17:44.535
So, we can do that as a question on

3471
02:17:44.559 --> 02:17:46.936
notice. Is that is that how that order?

3472
02:17:46.960 --> 02:17:48.615
I'm sort of bit reluctant to speak for

3473
02:17:48.639 --> 02:17:50.375
them there but

3474
02:17:50.399 --> 02:17:51.816
yeah we we can take that as a question

3475
02:17:51.840 --> 02:17:53.896
on notice and um that can just be shared

3476
02:17:53.920 --> 02:17:55.176
through the hub there.

3477
02:17:55.200 --> 02:17:55.655
Thank you.

3478
02:17:55.679 --> 02:17:57.896
Yeah.

3479
02:17:57.920 --> 02:17:59.816
 so then councelor Davis right of

3480
02:17:59.840 --> 02:18:00.695
reply.

3481
02:18:00.719 --> 02:18:03.176
 the only right of reply I have is the

3482
02:18:03.200 --> 02:18:05.256
only reason we have a pio is because of

3483
02:18:05.280 --> 02:18:08.280
the sins of some and not of all. So I'll

3484
02:18:08.960 --> 02:18:09.976
leave it at that.

3485
02:18:10.000 --> 02:18:11.736
With that I put the motion before you.

3486
02:18:11.760 --> 02:18:14.760
All those in favor, councelor

3487
02:18:15.200 --> 02:18:17.896
Summers, Councelor Stewart, Councelor

3488
02:18:17.920 --> 02:18:20.216
Williamson, Councelor Rose, Councelor

3489
02:18:20.240 --> 02:18:21.655
Renie, Councelor Davis, Councelor

3490
02:18:21.679 --> 02:18:23.575
Elliot, Councelor Hopkins, Councelor

3491
02:18:23.599 --> 02:18:26.599
Higgins was not in the room.

3492
02:18:28.080 --> 02:18:31.080
Moving on to where should we go? 9.4.1

3493
02:18:32.240 --> 02:18:34.295
 waste management options for CFKA. Do

3494
02:18:34.319 --> 02:18:37.319
we have a motion from the floor?

3495
02:18:38.479 --> 02:18:40.455
Yeah. Um

3496
02:18:40.479 --> 02:18:43.479
I I'll support the um I'll move the

3497
02:18:43.519 --> 02:18:45.655
recommendation with probably an

3498
02:18:45.679 --> 02:18:46.056
amendment.

3499
02:18:46.080 --> 02:18:47.256
You want to put that up now?

3500
02:18:47.280 --> 02:18:48.136
With an amendment.

3501
02:18:48.160 --> 02:18:49.976
Yep. What What would you like changed?

3502
02:18:50.000 --> 02:18:53.000
I the thing that I I support going out

3503
02:18:53.200 --> 02:18:56.200
to the CFKA with a banker bin proposal

3504
02:18:57.120 --> 02:19:00.120
 to replace the bin enclosure.

3505
02:19:00.880 --> 02:19:03.880
But I support that if  that after it's

3506
02:19:06.240 --> 02:19:08.295
been implemented for a while that if

3507
02:19:08.319 --> 02:19:10.936
there's any changes from the  maker

3508
02:19:10.960 --> 02:19:13.176
bins that it comes back to council to

3509
02:19:13.200 --> 02:19:14.936
make a determination on where you

3510
02:19:14.960 --> 02:19:17.960
proceed for the waste by waste um

3511
02:19:19.040 --> 02:19:21.816
service to the cathcart community.

3512
02:19:21.840 --> 02:19:24.840
So part C  would be continue  to

3513
02:19:25.200 --> 02:19:27.575
continue consultation with the Kathkart

3514
02:19:27.599 --> 02:19:29.575
community

3515
02:19:29.599 --> 02:19:32.599
 in relation to

3516
02:19:32.800 --> 02:19:33.176
the

3517
02:19:33.200 --> 02:19:36.200
the bank

3518
02:19:36.240 --> 02:19:37.335
the bank of

3519
02:19:37.359 --> 02:19:37.896
Yep.

3520
02:19:37.920 --> 02:19:39.495
Yep.

3521
02:19:39.519 --> 02:19:42.455
And in this report it was said that if

3522
02:19:42.479 --> 02:19:44.776
it didn't work out that we do back and

3523
02:19:44.800 --> 02:19:46.776
close it all down and that that's what I

3524
02:19:46.800 --> 02:19:47.176
don't want.

3525
02:19:47.200 --> 02:19:49.016
Well part B. So I'll just get you to

3526
02:19:49.040 --> 02:19:50.375
check because part B is still in the

3527
02:19:50.399 --> 02:19:51.976
motion. Is that what you wanted removed

3528
02:19:52.000 --> 02:19:53.656
then?

3529
02:19:53.680 --> 02:19:55.576
That's per resolution. Yeah. Continue

3530
02:19:55.600 --> 02:19:58.375
conserv

3531
02:19:58.399 --> 02:20:00.856
and if there's any changes to the to to

3532
02:20:00.880 --> 02:20:03.816
that process, it comes back to council

3533
02:20:03.840 --> 02:20:04.856
for determination.

3534
02:20:04.880 --> 02:20:05.976
Okay.

3535
02:20:06.000 --> 02:20:07.335
Mhm.

3536
02:20:07.359 --> 02:20:08.856
I'll second.

3537
02:20:08.880 --> 02:20:10.936
Okay. We just wait for Jenny to catch

3538
02:20:10.960 --> 02:20:12.696
up.

3539
02:20:12.720 --> 02:20:13.576
Can I speak on that?

3540
02:20:13.600 --> 02:20:14.696
Just give me one second while Jenny

3541
02:20:14.720 --> 02:20:16.056
catches up.

3542
02:20:16.080 --> 02:20:17.415
Otherwise, we're all over the place. So,

3543
02:20:17.439 --> 02:20:18.856
moved by Councelor Stewart, seconded

3544
02:20:18.880 --> 02:20:21.496
councelor Elliot.

3545
02:20:21.520 --> 02:20:22.455
No puppies.

3546
02:20:22.479 --> 02:20:24.455
They'll stay AB and D. They will stay.

3547
02:20:24.479 --> 02:20:26.216
Yeah.

3548
02:20:26.240 --> 02:20:27.816
The main thing is that if there's any

3549
02:20:27.840 --> 02:20:30.455
changes from the Bank of Bins

3550
02:20:30.479 --> 02:20:33.096
process that it comes back into council.

3551
02:20:33.120 --> 02:20:33.736
Mhm.

3552
02:20:33.760 --> 02:20:35.816
Okay. Council Elliot, you've got five

3553
02:20:35.840 --> 02:20:37.176
minutes.

3554
02:20:37.200 --> 02:20:39.496
Let's do it.

3555
02:20:39.520 --> 02:20:41.816
Yeah. Yeah. No. Um,

3556
02:20:41.840 --> 02:20:44.696
unfortunately, this this process was

3557
02:20:44.720 --> 02:20:47.720
done very poorly by the  waste

3558
02:20:47.760 --> 02:20:50.760
department. Um they organized a meeting

3559
02:20:51.840 --> 02:20:53.896
down with the Cathkar community. There

3560
02:20:53.920 --> 02:20:56.920
was not one senior many le person there

3561
02:20:58.319 --> 02:21:01.319
for this meeting. I went out to it. Um

3562
02:21:02.560 --> 02:21:05.176
there was 20 odd community people out

3563
02:21:05.200 --> 02:21:07.736
there. They had serious questions to

3564
02:21:07.760 --> 02:21:09.415
ask. They were concerned. They were

3565
02:21:09.439 --> 02:21:11.016
ready to compromise. And we didn't have

3566
02:21:11.040 --> 02:21:12.936
the right people on on board at the

3567
02:21:12.960 --> 02:21:15.096
meeting. And I I rang the general

3568
02:21:15.120 --> 02:21:17.016
manager up the next day and and

3569
02:21:17.040 --> 02:21:20.040
expressed my disappointment over it. Um

3570
02:21:20.720 --> 02:21:23.176
and if we had handled it right, it would

3571
02:21:23.200 --> 02:21:25.096
be like the transition from the delicate

3572
02:21:25.120 --> 02:21:28.120
waste proposal that we done. It it went

3573
02:21:28.640 --> 02:21:31.640
right. It went well. But

3574
02:21:31.840 --> 02:21:33.896
we've got to treat these communities,

3575
02:21:33.920 --> 02:21:36.696
these smaller communities with respect

3576
02:21:36.720 --> 02:21:39.720
and we didn't do that unfortunately.

3577
02:21:39.920 --> 02:21:42.920
And um they got pretty upset. It could

3578
02:21:43.040 --> 02:21:46.040
have been a very easy transition this

3579
02:21:46.720 --> 02:21:49.256
had it been managed properly and 

3580
02:21:49.280 --> 02:21:50.856
unfortunately we've gone down we've got

3581
02:21:50.880 --> 02:21:53.880
the community was upset they they knew

3582
02:21:54.080 --> 02:21:55.896
that there's probably changes coming but

3583
02:21:55.920 --> 02:21:57.816
they wanted clarification and we didn't

3584
02:21:57.840 --> 02:22:00.056
have the people there to do it and I'll

3585
02:22:00.080 --> 02:22:02.455
have to be very critical so we owe that

3586
02:22:02.479 --> 02:22:04.216
community they've had 40 odd years of

3587
02:22:04.240 --> 02:22:06.536
service of of of that out there and we

3588
02:22:06.560 --> 02:22:08.455
were just going to close it down had a

3589
02:22:08.479 --> 02:22:09.976
contractor come out there to put a gate

3590
02:22:10.000 --> 02:22:11.656
across the thing without even telling

3591
02:22:11.680 --> 02:22:14.616
the community that they closing it down.

3592
02:22:14.640 --> 02:22:17.640
So if you wanted to do a job a bad way,

3593
02:22:18.560 --> 02:22:20.455
that was it. You want to highlight that

3594
02:22:20.479 --> 02:22:22.295
down when you when you're going through

3595
02:22:22.319 --> 02:22:24.295
being looking what we got to deliver out

3596
02:22:24.319 --> 02:22:26.936
to the community. So although I'm

3597
02:22:26.960 --> 02:22:28.536
disappointed, I think we can get there.

3598
02:22:28.560 --> 02:22:30.295
But we've got to keep in contact with

3599
02:22:30.319 --> 02:22:32.696
that community and be respectful to them

3600
02:22:32.720 --> 02:22:35.096
and and try to deliver them the service

3601
02:22:35.120 --> 02:22:36.696
that they've been used to and they

3602
02:22:36.720 --> 02:22:37.496
deserve.

3603
02:22:37.520 --> 02:22:38.936
Thank you. Um I have a question, but

3604
02:22:38.960 --> 02:22:40.216
I'll see if any counselors have

3605
02:22:40.240 --> 02:22:42.536
questions. this week question.

3606
02:22:42.560 --> 02:22:45.496
Um, yes, I do have a question because I

3607
02:22:45.520 --> 02:22:47.896
care a lot about the cat community which

3608
02:22:47.920 --> 02:22:50.696
I go past a lot of times and and um I

3609
02:22:50.720 --> 02:22:52.536
was horrified to see the pictures but my

3610
02:22:52.560 --> 02:22:55.256
question relates to I always get worried

3611
02:22:55.280 --> 02:22:56.856
madam deputy when I see the term

3612
02:22:56.880 --> 02:22:59.736
expression of interest that that denotes

3613
02:22:59.760 --> 02:23:02.760
a a laborious process um that involves

3614
02:23:04.399 --> 02:23:06.455
you know something being put out in the

3615
02:23:06.479 --> 02:23:09.096
general public blah blah blah. Is that

3616
02:23:09.120 --> 02:23:10.776
what can we just know what that

3617
02:23:10.800 --> 02:23:12.936
expression of interest process is

3618
02:23:12.960 --> 02:23:14.616
because this doesn't look like a very

3619
02:23:14.640 --> 02:23:17.016
complicated sorry but we could as as

3620
02:23:17.040 --> 02:23:19.016
councelor Stewart's often say to me we

3621
02:23:19.040 --> 02:23:22.040
could overcook it so can yes we yes have

3622
02:23:22.560 --> 02:23:25.560
the next EIO process explained

3623
02:23:25.840 --> 02:23:27.736
yeah  through your madame it is

3624
02:23:27.760 --> 02:23:29.335
explained in the implementation plan

3625
02:23:29.359 --> 02:23:32.295
that there's 24 rural households and it

3626
02:23:32.319 --> 02:23:35.016
is around going to them directly to ex

3627
02:23:35.040 --> 02:23:37.656
um to seek their interest into  our

3628
02:23:37.680 --> 02:23:38.856
bank of bins

3629
02:23:38.880 --> 02:23:40.776
process rather than the current bin

3630
02:23:40.800 --> 02:23:42.856
enclosure. So it is targeted and it

3631
02:23:42.880 --> 02:23:44.936
gives the opportunity as well um for

3632
02:23:44.960 --> 02:23:46.536
other people within the community to

3633
02:23:46.560 --> 02:23:47.976
make comment too.

3634
02:23:48.000 --> 02:23:50.216
Is there is there not any possibility as

3635
02:23:50.240 --> 02:23:52.616
councelor Stewart was already outlining

3636
02:23:52.640 --> 02:23:54.295
just to simply convene a community

3637
02:23:54.319 --> 02:23:55.576
beating this has got a lot of

3638
02:23:55.600 --> 02:23:57.096
self-interest and just make a decision

3639
02:23:57.120 --> 02:23:57.576
rather than

3640
02:23:57.600 --> 02:23:59.176
well they had a community meeting

3641
02:23:59.200 --> 02:24:01.335
organized but we didn't have the people

3642
02:24:01.359 --> 02:24:03.656
there and they had a very strong turnup

3643
02:24:03.680 --> 02:24:05.976
turnout for a small community. It would

3644
02:24:06.000 --> 02:24:08.936
be over 50% or near 50% of the community

3645
02:24:08.960 --> 02:24:09.816
at that meeting.

3646
02:24:09.840 --> 02:24:12.696
Right. And unfortunately,

3647
02:24:12.720 --> 02:24:15.256
we didn't have the the the the people

3648
02:24:15.280 --> 02:24:16.856
there to be able to answer their

3649
02:24:16.880 --> 02:24:18.776
question. We had a person involved in

3650
02:24:18.800 --> 02:24:20.375
the waste management, but couldn't give

3651
02:24:20.399 --> 02:24:22.136
I'll have to go back to the ELT. I

3652
02:24:22.160 --> 02:24:25.096
couldn't do that. And and that's when

3653
02:24:25.120 --> 02:24:26.696
you go to those meetings, you got to

3654
02:24:26.720 --> 02:24:29.016
have the person there that they could

3655
02:24:29.040 --> 02:24:31.016
explain. And they were explaining why

3656
02:24:31.040 --> 02:24:34.040
some of those photos that the mess was

3657
02:24:34.080 --> 02:24:37.016
there because the the waste bloke never

3658
02:24:37.040 --> 02:24:39.736
turned up for missed a week or two and

3659
02:24:39.760 --> 02:24:42.136
and so that was some of their thing and

3660
02:24:42.160 --> 02:24:43.496
you could have there could have been a

3661
02:24:43.520 --> 02:24:45.816
discussion. They're there prepared to

3662
02:24:45.840 --> 02:24:47.736
discuss the issues to try to get the

3663
02:24:47.760 --> 02:24:50.760
right situation and council didn't have

3664
02:24:51.359 --> 02:24:53.335
the right people there to handle the

3665
02:24:53.359 --> 02:24:53.656
job.

3666
02:24:53.680 --> 02:24:55.415
But this are you happy with this process

3667
02:24:55.439 --> 02:24:57.896
cuz it's a long process. We go to visit

3668
02:24:57.920 --> 02:24:59.256
24 households individually.

3669
02:24:59.280 --> 02:25:00.856
Well, I don't think you know. I think if

3670
02:25:00.880 --> 02:25:02.856
if you can organize a community meeting

3671
02:25:02.880 --> 02:25:05.816
and and get the the head of the waste

3672
02:25:05.840 --> 02:25:08.295
department down there and talk to them

3673
02:25:08.319 --> 02:25:09.976
would probably be just as good. I think

3674
02:25:10.000 --> 02:25:11.976
if you can get them out there again, but

3675
02:25:12.000 --> 02:25:13.656
they were out there in force that that

3676
02:25:13.680 --> 02:25:15.335
last time I can tell you because I was

3677
02:25:15.359 --> 02:25:16.696
out there and they were

3678
02:25:16.720 --> 02:25:18.776
they had concerns but they were ready to

3679
02:25:18.800 --> 02:25:21.656
to um listen to offers but we couldn't

3680
02:25:21.680 --> 02:25:23.176
put anything on the table.

3681
02:25:23.200 --> 02:25:25.576
I have a quick question if I may. CEO.

3682
02:25:25.600 --> 02:25:27.335
My understanding is there are cameras

3683
02:25:27.359 --> 02:25:29.496
already in place of that enclosure.

3684
02:25:29.520 --> 02:25:32.520
 yes sir you madam chair there is um

3685
02:25:33.040 --> 02:25:35.736
 is illegal dumping um being managed

3686
02:25:35.760 --> 02:25:37.335
through footage and people being issued

3687
02:25:37.359 --> 02:25:38.455
fines.

3688
02:25:38.479 --> 02:25:40.375
 we are we are going through that

3689
02:25:40.399 --> 02:25:43.176
process. Sometimes  we can capture the

3690
02:25:43.200 --> 02:25:45.415
license plate of people coming through

3691
02:25:45.439 --> 02:25:48.439
but it does take some some timing to

3692
02:25:48.880 --> 02:25:50.295
actually get there. I guess the issue

3693
02:25:50.319 --> 02:25:52.295
with the legal dumping is it's done.

3694
02:25:52.319 --> 02:25:52.696
Yes.

3695
02:25:52.720 --> 02:25:54.455
Yeah. It's after the fact when

3696
02:25:54.479 --> 02:25:55.896
compliance comes into place.

3697
02:25:55.920 --> 02:25:57.816
Have any fines been issued?

3698
02:25:57.840 --> 02:26:00.216
 I will have to

3699
02:26:00.240 --> 02:26:03.240
um through you chair. Um we're

3700
02:26:03.280 --> 02:26:04.616
progressing. So there's some that are

3701
02:26:04.640 --> 02:26:07.096
involving the police  naturally, but

3702
02:26:07.120 --> 02:26:09.576
we are um we are progressing and look

3703
02:26:09.600 --> 02:26:11.576
the point I make  councelor Stewart

3704
02:26:11.600 --> 02:26:14.600
about the EOI is with a letter with an

3705
02:26:15.040 --> 02:26:17.016
EOI drop into a letter box. We know that

3706
02:26:17.040 --> 02:26:19.896
we've got each individ

3707
02:26:19.920 --> 02:26:22.616
but I don't see any problems at all with

3708
02:26:22.640 --> 02:26:25.415
then post that EOI having a community

3709
02:26:25.439 --> 02:26:28.216
meeting. So I I definitely go the head

3710
02:26:28.240 --> 02:26:29.656
of resource and waste will come with me

3711
02:26:29.680 --> 02:26:32.136
too. the community will accept the

3712
02:26:32.160 --> 02:26:34.375
change if it's reasonable, but they will

3713
02:26:34.399 --> 02:26:36.455
need to be brought along. And as I said,

3714
02:26:36.479 --> 02:26:38.616
we proved that down at Delegate when we

3715
02:26:38.640 --> 02:26:40.936
went down there. We had John Garget was

3716
02:26:40.960 --> 02:26:42.856
the head of the way there at the time he

3717
02:26:42.880 --> 02:26:45.880
come. We met with the community. We came

3718
02:26:45.920 --> 02:26:48.920
up with it. We transitioned that that um

3719
02:26:48.960 --> 02:26:51.496
process very well down there. Hardly a

3720
02:26:51.520 --> 02:26:54.295
murmur. There a couple, but the majority

3721
02:26:54.319 --> 02:26:56.696
because we knew we those people. We

3722
02:26:56.720 --> 02:26:58.536
turned up that night and it was

3723
02:26:58.560 --> 02:27:01.560
unfortunately poorly set up and um we

3724
02:27:02.479 --> 02:27:04.856
and and I don't blame them from being

3725
02:27:04.880 --> 02:27:07.880
well the first instance was having and I

3726
02:27:08.000 --> 02:27:10.536
think the waste team realized that they

3727
02:27:10.560 --> 02:27:13.415
overreacted to a situation and but they

3728
02:27:13.439 --> 02:27:16.439
would have accepted that but um they

3729
02:27:16.560 --> 02:27:18.936
wanted they had questions there and and

3730
02:27:18.960 --> 02:27:20.375
although the little girl that was down

3731
02:27:20.399 --> 02:27:22.776
there done a very good job on the night

3732
02:27:22.800 --> 02:27:24.776
she did she wasn't in the position to

3733
02:27:24.800 --> 02:27:27.736
give affirmative answers and it made it

3734
02:27:27.760 --> 02:27:30.696
very gray area for them and that that's

3735
02:27:30.720 --> 02:27:32.856
where I've got to be very critical of

3736
02:27:32.880 --> 02:27:34.936
that process.

3737
02:27:34.960 --> 02:27:37.176
That community deserve better than that

3738
02:27:37.200 --> 02:27:39.176
because you're taking something away

3739
02:27:39.200 --> 02:27:42.200
that they've had for 40 years.

3740
02:27:42.720 --> 02:27:44.856
Two speakers for the motion. Shall we

3741
02:27:44.880 --> 02:27:46.856
have anybody wanting to speak against?

3742
02:27:46.880 --> 02:27:49.256
Well, yes, because I think we haven't we

3743
02:27:49.280 --> 02:27:51.816
haven't clarified. What I've heard is

3744
02:27:51.840 --> 02:27:54.056
concerning because

3745
02:27:54.080 --> 02:27:56.696
you know visiting 24 households could be

3746
02:27:56.720 --> 02:27:59.720
a um a 30 minutes a household 12 hours

3747
02:28:02.720 --> 02:28:03.656
we do need to be careful not to get

3748
02:28:03.680 --> 02:28:06.056
involved in the operation and

3749
02:28:06.080 --> 02:28:07.656
we need to be strategic and provide

3750
02:28:07.680 --> 02:28:08.056
governance.

3751
02:28:08.080 --> 02:28:09.415
Hope you're being strategic because what

3752
02:28:09.439 --> 02:28:11.576
the issue here is councelor Stewart has

3753
02:28:11.600 --> 02:28:14.600
said that he believes that a another a

3754
02:28:16.160 --> 02:28:17.656
community consultation meeting where

3755
02:28:17.680 --> 02:28:19.256
everyone was there might be sufficient

3756
02:28:19.280 --> 02:28:22.280
to do this. is concerned that we made by

3757
02:28:22.880 --> 02:28:24.616
seeing people individually we may get a

3758
02:28:24.640 --> 02:28:26.616
bad outcome and so it's a process that

3759
02:28:26.640 --> 02:28:28.616
I'm questioning and I just want the team

3760
02:28:28.640 --> 02:28:31.640
to reconsider the process.

3761
02:28:34.000 --> 02:28:36.776
Yeah. So um as has just been um

3762
02:28:36.800 --> 02:28:39.016
clarified once again this will be a

3763
02:28:39.040 --> 02:28:40.856
letter box drop which will ask people's

3764
02:28:40.880 --> 02:28:42.536
opinion and also advise of the meeting.

3765
02:28:42.560 --> 02:28:44.136
So it's two birds with the one bone as

3766
02:28:44.160 --> 02:28:46.616
opposed to door knocking 24 houses. So

3767
02:28:46.640 --> 02:28:48.536
um we we could in support a

3768
02:28:48.560 --> 02:28:49.976
cost-effective expression of interest

3769
02:28:50.000 --> 02:28:51.656
but I believe all our staff are

3770
02:28:51.680 --> 02:28:53.736
responsible to agree with management of

3771
02:28:53.760 --> 02:28:56.760
funds. So  anybody would like so that

3772
02:28:57.200 --> 02:29:00.200
clarifies that any further questions or

3773
02:29:00.880 --> 02:29:02.375
anybody wanting to speak against the

3774
02:29:02.399 --> 02:29:04.856
motion

3775
02:29:04.880 --> 02:29:07.880
 counc

3776
02:29:10.640 --> 02:29:13.640
unanimous.  moving on to 9.4.2 two

3777
02:29:15.439 --> 02:29:18.439
ginder bone pool elgus use 202425

3778
02:29:20.479 --> 02:29:21.496
move to note

3779
02:29:21.520 --> 02:29:23.256
moved by councelor summers do we have a

3780
02:29:23.280 --> 02:29:24.455
second council

3781
02:29:24.479 --> 02:29:27.479
sorry um I I'd like to put an amendment

3782
02:29:27.760 --> 02:29:29.656


3783
02:29:29.680 --> 02:29:30.696
do I do that

3784
02:29:30.720 --> 02:29:32.375
 you can do it now and suggest your

3785
02:29:32.399 --> 02:29:34.375
amendment and we'll see how so if you

3786
02:29:34.399 --> 02:29:36.856
like to second amendment

3787
02:29:36.880 --> 02:29:38.216
and what's your amendment councelor

3788
02:29:38.240 --> 02:29:39.096
Elliot

3789
02:29:39.120 --> 02:29:42.120
um when this was looked at

3790
02:29:42.319 --> 02:29:45.319
there that was a big 

3791
02:29:45.439 --> 02:29:48.439
um overspend and the CFO was going to

3792
02:29:49.920 --> 02:29:52.920
examine how that money

3793
02:29:53.600 --> 02:29:56.295
would be replaced within the budget. I

3794
02:29:56.319 --> 02:29:58.136
think that's how he put it.

3795
02:29:58.160 --> 02:29:59.656
Now, we haven't heard anything about

3796
02:29:59.680 --> 02:30:02.616
that. Also,

3797
02:30:02.640 --> 02:30:05.640
the problems at Ginderbine Pool have

3798
02:30:06.560 --> 02:30:08.936
been well

3799
02:30:08.960 --> 02:30:10.856
I think 3 million was spent out there

3800
02:30:10.880 --> 02:30:13.880
what two or three years ago and it looks

3801
02:30:13.920 --> 02:30:16.856
like they have major problems out there

3802
02:30:16.880 --> 02:30:19.415
too not to the extent obviously of Kuma

3803
02:30:19.439 --> 02:30:21.096
and Bombala

3804
02:30:21.120 --> 02:30:23.096
and I don't want to make too big an

3805
02:30:23.120 --> 02:30:26.120
issue because at least we've got a pool

3806
02:30:26.640 --> 02:30:29.640
um but it looks like the work done out

3807
02:30:31.040 --> 02:30:33.256
there

3808
02:30:33.280 --> 02:30:36.280
was

3809
02:30:36.399 --> 02:30:39.399
um not completed well, not

3810
02:30:40.720 --> 02:30:43.720
 the planning for it was was not good

3811
02:30:44.080 --> 02:30:45.335
either when you talk to some of the

3812
02:30:45.359 --> 02:30:48.359
maintenance people out there. And um so

3813
02:30:49.680 --> 02:30:52.295
my amendment would be

3814
02:30:52.319 --> 02:30:55.319
 to that the CEO prepare a report for

3815
02:30:55.920 --> 02:30:58.295
the March council meeting on the

3816
02:30:58.319 --> 02:31:01.016
problems at Ginderbine Pool and how

3817
02:31:01.040 --> 02:31:03.976
they'll be rectified

3818
02:31:04.000 --> 02:31:06.295
because it is an ongoing one out there

3819
02:31:06.319 --> 02:31:07.976
and I've got many members of the

3820
02:31:08.000 --> 02:31:10.616
community telling me of the problems in

3821
02:31:10.640 --> 02:31:13.640
the pool including the people who teach

3822
02:31:13.760 --> 02:31:16.760
swimming there. Just lately I've been a

3823
02:31:17.040 --> 02:31:20.040
observer at watching my grandson try to

3824
02:31:20.160 --> 02:31:23.160
get into the Olympic trials and 

3825
02:31:23.439 --> 02:31:25.496
so are you happy if we'll just see if

3826
02:31:25.520 --> 02:31:27.176
councelor summons is happy otherwise we

3827
02:31:27.200 --> 02:31:28.856
need to um have it as a separate

3828
02:31:28.880 --> 02:31:30.455
amendment so the resolution would be

3829
02:31:30.479 --> 02:31:32.936
that council a note ginderbine pool elg

3830
02:31:32.960 --> 02:31:35.176
gas use 20242

3831
02:31:35.200 --> 02:31:37.656
and b request the CEO to prepare a

3832
02:31:37.680 --> 02:31:39.816
report for the March council meeting dot

3833
02:31:39.840 --> 02:31:40.455
dot dot

3834
02:31:40.479 --> 02:31:43.256
and I'm not sure whether I'd have to put

3835
02:31:43.280 --> 02:31:46.280
an CEO report back on his original

3836
02:31:46.319 --> 02:31:48.776
intention when it came up that

3837
02:31:48.800 --> 02:31:50.375
just a question as to whether that time

3838
02:31:50.399 --> 02:31:52.056
frame is going to be met. Like I say,

3839
02:31:52.080 --> 02:31:53.335
two weeks or two.

3840
02:31:53.359 --> 02:31:55.415
No. Yes.

3841
02:31:55.439 --> 02:31:57.176
Council meeting

3842
02:31:57.200 --> 02:31:58.936
except April.

3843
02:31:58.960 --> 02:32:01.496
You got to get funding.

3844
02:32:01.520 --> 02:32:02.776
There's no funding for it.

3845
02:32:02.800 --> 02:32:05.096
It's just a report council. And really

3846
02:32:05.120 --> 02:32:08.120
is because community out there keep

3847
02:32:08.160 --> 02:32:10.295
reporting

3848
02:32:10.319 --> 02:32:12.856
all these problems and they keep saying

3849
02:32:12.880 --> 02:32:15.880
that nobody is listening to them.

3850
02:32:16.479 --> 02:32:18.936
Options.

3851
02:32:18.960 --> 02:32:21.415
We've got a the council spent the $2

3852
02:32:21.439 --> 02:32:23.656
million to bring that pool up to an

3853
02:32:23.680 --> 02:32:25.335
emergency serve and brought it out of

3854
02:32:25.359 --> 02:32:27.576
writing road fun something.

3855
02:32:27.600 --> 02:32:29.976
just

3856
02:32:30.000 --> 02:32:33.000
that we just leave resolution as is very

3857
02:32:33.439 --> 02:32:33.816
different.

3858
02:32:33.840 --> 02:32:35.976
There's got to be funding. We just can't

3859
02:32:36.000 --> 02:32:37.736
one conversation at a time. We either

3860
02:32:37.760 --> 02:32:39.335
can debate this amendment as a separate

3861
02:32:39.359 --> 02:32:41.096
issue or we can accept it into the

3862
02:32:41.120 --> 02:32:43.016
original motion.

3863
02:32:43.040 --> 02:32:45.335
Suggest that it's so different from the

3864
02:32:45.359 --> 02:32:47.816
issue we're examining that it be raised

3865
02:32:47.840 --> 02:32:49.976
perhaps as a separate motion down the

3866
02:32:50.000 --> 02:32:50.616
track or

3867
02:32:50.640 --> 02:32:51.976
this could be a notice of motion at the

3868
02:32:52.000 --> 02:32:55.000
March meeting or meeting after it. give

3869
02:32:56.160 --> 02:32:58.616
the staff some time to tackle it.

3870
02:32:58.640 --> 02:32:59.656
Sorry.

3871
02:32:59.680 --> 02:33:01.096
Happy for it to come to the April

3872
02:33:01.120 --> 02:33:04.120
meeting, but it it is a big concern. It

3873
02:33:04.479 --> 02:33:06.776
seems to be an ongoing

3874
02:33:06.800 --> 02:33:09.800
concern by the people who use the pool

3875
02:33:10.000 --> 02:33:11.976
and by the operators.

3876
02:33:12.000 --> 02:33:12.936
Unfortunately,

3877
02:33:12.960 --> 02:33:14.375
sorry to you, Madam Chair. Can I just

3878
02:33:14.399 --> 02:33:16.936
make a comment  in terms of our IPNR

3879
02:33:16.960 --> 02:33:18.295
workshop, it was highlighted to

3880
02:33:18.319 --> 02:33:19.816
councilors that we are working on an

3881
02:33:19.840 --> 02:33:22.536
aquatic strategy at the moment. So I do

3882
02:33:22.560 --> 02:33:24.375
think that this forms a larger piece of

3883
02:33:24.399 --> 02:33:27.399
work because we we as staff could

3884
02:33:27.680 --> 02:33:30.056
provide some level of reporting but it

3885
02:33:30.080 --> 02:33:33.080
would still require engagement of like

3886
02:33:33.120 --> 02:33:34.696
structural engineer of some sorts to

3887
02:33:34.720 --> 02:33:36.455
actually come in and actually

3888
02:33:36.479 --> 02:33:38.616
um make an assessment of the building in

3889
02:33:38.640 --> 02:33:40.136
terms of what's actually wrong with it.

3890
02:33:40.160 --> 02:33:42.056
I think I appreciate that members of the

3891
02:33:42.080 --> 02:33:44.136
community, squad teachers, all of that

3892
02:33:44.160 --> 02:33:46.455
sort of stuff have raised issues but we

3893
02:33:46.479 --> 02:33:48.776
do need expert advice on it.

3894
02:33:48.800 --> 02:33:51.576
So the aquatic strategy is

3895
02:33:51.600 --> 02:33:54.600
has been um deliberated on in the IPR.

3896
02:33:55.760 --> 02:33:57.816
I Yeah, I know. Next week,

3897
02:33:57.840 --> 02:34:00.840
I guess and I did note that. But the

3898
02:34:01.439 --> 02:34:04.439
fact that you know 50,000 overspending

3899
02:34:04.720 --> 02:34:07.496
gas and it looks like that'll be an

3900
02:34:07.520 --> 02:34:10.520
ongoing problem.

3901
02:34:10.640 --> 02:34:11.176
Well,

3902
02:34:11.200 --> 02:34:13.415
at the moment that seems to be this huge

3903
02:34:13.439 --> 02:34:16.056
expenditure on gas is the only way to

3904
02:34:16.080 --> 02:34:18.375
overcome the problem there. So that

3905
02:34:18.399 --> 02:34:21.399
might I don't know whether it will be or

3906
02:34:21.680 --> 02:34:24.680
not, but to be honest, I've had the

3907
02:34:24.960 --> 02:34:27.656
might been council 18 months and I've

3908
02:34:27.680 --> 02:34:30.216
had the people who use the pool and the

3909
02:34:30.240 --> 02:34:33.240
operators continually bringing this up

3910
02:34:33.680 --> 02:34:36.375
and and a lot of frustration that they

3911
02:34:36.399 --> 02:34:39.016
don't seem to be hurt. Now, why or

3912
02:34:39.040 --> 02:34:42.040
whatever, I don't know. But, um, now I

3913
02:34:42.640 --> 02:34:44.216
know we're going to have a strategy for

3914
02:34:44.240 --> 02:34:47.176
all three pools,

3915
02:34:47.200 --> 02:34:50.200
but because of that frustration

3916
02:34:50.319 --> 02:34:52.616
that they want to be heard, I would like

3917
02:34:52.640 --> 02:34:53.496
something to come back.

3918
02:34:53.520 --> 02:34:55.096
Okay, councelor, that's fine. We can put

3919
02:34:55.120 --> 02:34:56.375
that up as an amendment. It will need to

3920
02:34:56.399 --> 02:34:57.896
be debated separately. We'll just put

3921
02:34:57.920 --> 02:35:00.056
that wording back again. My apologies.

3922
02:35:00.080 --> 02:35:01.415
And we'll get a second for your

3923
02:35:01.439 --> 02:35:02.295
amendment.

3924
02:35:02.319 --> 02:35:04.295
And happy to make it the April meeting

3925
02:35:04.319 --> 02:35:07.319
to give staff time to to do so.

3926
02:35:09.840 --> 02:35:12.136
might ask a related question.

3927
02:35:12.160 --> 02:35:14.216
Yes. Then we'll hopefully go second.

3928
02:35:14.240 --> 02:35:17.240
I thought when we um when we do major

3929
02:35:17.280 --> 02:35:20.280
constructions like pools, we engage

3930
02:35:20.479 --> 02:35:23.479
 an appropriate person to design the

3931
02:35:23.600 --> 02:35:26.600
pools and that those designs would

3932
02:35:26.960 --> 02:35:29.960
normally come with warranties.

3933
02:35:30.880 --> 02:35:33.880
that perhaps if it wasn't built

3934
02:35:34.000 --> 02:35:35.736
designed appropriately, there might be

3935
02:35:35.760 --> 02:35:38.056
something to look at there.

3936
02:35:38.080 --> 02:35:39.896
Part of the problem, Council Williamson

3937
02:35:39.920 --> 02:35:42.920
seems to be it was under a previous

3938
02:35:43.040 --> 02:35:46.040
council employee who's now left. Um but

3939
02:35:47.359 --> 02:35:48.696
we have followup.

3940
02:35:48.720 --> 02:35:49.176
Yeah.

3941
02:35:49.200 --> 02:35:52.136
Um so working with the projects team and

3942
02:35:52.160 --> 02:35:54.216
obviously Greg is new and I am

3943
02:35:54.240 --> 02:35:57.096
relatively we can't find documentation

3944
02:35:57.120 --> 02:36:00.120
that relates to the the what was

3945
02:36:00.479 --> 02:36:02.295
designed and what was delivered.

3946
02:36:02.319 --> 02:36:04.375
Do we have a second for the amendment?

3947
02:36:04.399 --> 02:36:06.056
No we we really need a second for the

3948
02:36:06.080 --> 02:36:06.696
amendment to

3949
02:36:06.720 --> 02:36:08.616
Yes. I I'll second the amendment with

3950
02:36:08.640 --> 02:36:09.976
some change because I think it's a

3951
02:36:10.000 --> 02:36:10.776
wording issue,

3952
02:36:10.800 --> 02:36:11.096
right?

3953
02:36:11.120 --> 02:36:13.896
Um on the on the problems agenda by Paul

3954
02:36:13.920 --> 02:36:15.976
and options for rectification.

3955
02:36:16.000 --> 02:36:19.000
Great. Okay. Um so the amendment that

3956
02:36:19.439 --> 02:36:20.776
we're discussing moved by councelor

3957
02:36:20.800 --> 02:36:23.096
Elliot, seconded by councelor Rose is

3958
02:36:23.120 --> 02:36:24.856
that we add the blowpoint be added to

3959
02:36:24.880 --> 02:36:27.496
the resolution that council request the

3960
02:36:27.520 --> 02:36:29.896
CEO to prepare a report for the April

3961
02:36:29.920 --> 02:36:31.576
council meeting on the problems at

3962
02:36:31.600 --> 02:36:34.136
genderine pool and options for rect with

3963
02:36:34.160 --> 02:36:35.736
options for rectification.

3964
02:36:35.760 --> 02:36:38.760
Yes.

3965
02:36:40.720 --> 02:36:42.136
Um, council lady, you've already kind of

3966
02:36:42.160 --> 02:36:43.896
spoken to your amendment. Would you like

3967
02:36:43.920 --> 02:36:44.696
any further?

3968
02:36:44.720 --> 02:36:45.656
No, I don't need to.

3969
02:36:45.680 --> 02:36:47.016
Thank you. Do we have somebody speaking

3970
02:36:47.040 --> 02:36:50.040
against the amendment? Councelor Davis,

3971
02:36:50.399 --> 02:36:52.295
that whilst I fully acknowledge the

3972
02:36:52.319 --> 02:36:55.096
issues with the gender bind pool and I'm

3973
02:36:55.120 --> 02:36:56.696
going to bring up what councelor

3974
02:36:56.720 --> 02:36:59.256
Stewart's probably going to bring up in

3975
02:36:59.280 --> 02:37:01.896
the same mind.

3976
02:37:01.920 --> 02:37:04.216
This council spent $3 million on the

3977
02:37:04.240 --> 02:37:07.016
gingerbine pool in 2022. It came out of

3978
02:37:07.040 --> 02:37:10.040
the roads budget at a time when we

3979
02:37:10.479 --> 02:37:12.056
really couldn't afford to take money out

3980
02:37:12.080 --> 02:37:14.136
of the roads budget.

3981
02:37:14.160 --> 02:37:17.016
My understanding around the the work

3982
02:37:17.040 --> 02:37:19.656
that was done on the gender bind pool

3983
02:37:19.680 --> 02:37:22.680
was around the structural enclosure.

3984
02:37:23.680 --> 02:37:26.680
It did not include the the key

3985
02:37:26.800 --> 02:37:28.616
infrastructure

3986
02:37:28.640 --> 02:37:31.640
 and machinery that actually um run

3987
02:37:32.800 --> 02:37:34.455
the pool. So it didn't include the

3988
02:37:34.479 --> 02:37:37.479
filters, the treatment plant or or any

3989
02:37:39.120 --> 02:37:42.120
 heat pumps or any of the um  

3990
02:37:44.720 --> 02:37:47.335
issues around the humidity which causing

3991
02:37:47.359 --> 02:37:49.496
all the issues. It was a it was a

3992
02:37:49.520 --> 02:37:50.936
structural

3993
02:37:50.960 --> 02:37:53.656
 repair.  that took a lot longer

3994
02:37:53.680 --> 02:37:56.680
than we actually present  actually um

3995
02:37:57.600 --> 02:37:59.736
 forecast and it's a little bit like

3996
02:37:59.760 --> 02:38:01.256
the curve and bomba pools. It was going

3997
02:38:01.280 --> 02:38:02.776
to be 6 months and then it went to 12

3998
02:38:02.800 --> 02:38:05.335
months. So it was a a long a long

3999
02:38:05.359 --> 02:38:07.096
project cause a lot of concerns in the

4000
02:38:07.120 --> 02:38:09.415
gender community.

4001
02:38:09.439 --> 02:38:12.439
We need an aquatic strategy because we

4002
02:38:12.720 --> 02:38:15.496
have four pools. They all have problems.

4003
02:38:15.520 --> 02:38:18.520
They're all all about the same age. Five

4004
02:38:19.040 --> 02:38:22.040
pools.  all about the same age and we

4005
02:38:22.880 --> 02:38:24.455
need to have a strategy about how we're

4006
02:38:24.479 --> 02:38:27.096
going to manage them. Now schools are a

4007
02:38:27.120 --> 02:38:30.056
community service. They never pay for

4008
02:38:30.080 --> 02:38:32.936
themselves. Genderbind's very fortunate

4009
02:38:32.960 --> 02:38:35.960
that they have a 365 day 20  open

4010
02:38:39.040 --> 02:38:41.896
day arrangement with the pool whereas

4011
02:38:41.920 --> 02:38:43.896
the other pools are open at best

4012
02:38:43.920 --> 02:38:45.496
performance.

4013
02:38:45.520 --> 02:38:47.736
So we also need to look at equity and

4014
02:38:47.760 --> 02:38:49.976
access. We spent a lot of money on a

4015
02:38:50.000 --> 02:38:53.000
gender bind pool. It obviously needed a

4016
02:38:53.200 --> 02:38:55.016
proper assessment before that money was

4017
02:38:55.040 --> 02:38:57.496
spent, but at that time we were told it

4018
02:38:57.520 --> 02:38:59.415
was urgent work that needed to happen

4019
02:38:59.439 --> 02:39:01.736
because the

4020
02:39:01.760 --> 02:39:04.760
structure was going to fail.

4021
02:39:04.960 --> 02:39:06.455
So

4022
02:39:06.479 --> 02:39:09.479
as much as  this report would be

4023
02:39:10.479 --> 02:39:12.696
great, it's going to be totally

4024
02:39:12.720 --> 02:39:15.016
deficient because we need to have a

4025
02:39:15.040 --> 02:39:18.040
whole  lot of information that is not

4026
02:39:18.080 --> 02:39:21.080
available at this time and  we it went

4027
02:39:23.120 --> 02:39:26.120
in the gigabyte pool um was repaired and

4028
02:39:27.200 --> 02:39:30.200
it was a repair it was not a structural

4029
02:39:30.640 --> 02:39:32.936
change which is what we're dealing with

4030
02:39:32.960 --> 02:39:35.496
Kuma and Barbara. A and the difference

4031
02:39:35.520 --> 02:39:38.375
there is of course Kuma and Bala was an

4032
02:39:38.399 --> 02:39:41.256
a absolute renovation we had to bring it

4033
02:39:41.280 --> 02:39:43.096
up to building standards and that was

4034
02:39:43.120 --> 02:39:44.616
not the case with the genderine pool

4035
02:39:44.640 --> 02:39:45.816
which is why we're in the situation

4036
02:39:45.840 --> 02:39:48.696
we're in. So we need a we need a

4037
02:39:48.720 --> 02:39:50.856
strategy we need to understand what is

4038
02:39:50.880 --> 02:39:53.096
the state of all of our pool

4039
02:39:53.120 --> 02:39:54.856
infrastructure and it's going to be a

4040
02:39:54.880 --> 02:39:56.455
scary report.

4041
02:39:56.479 --> 02:39:59.479
Thank you. Speak for the motion.

4042
02:40:00.080 --> 02:40:02.936
Councelor Willson

4043
02:40:02.960 --> 02:40:05.960
 Thank you, Miss Mrs. Deputy Net. Um,

4044
02:40:07.920 --> 02:40:10.375
I I think we absolutely need to do this.

4045
02:40:10.399 --> 02:40:13.256
, I'm going to do it now. , the pool

4046
02:40:13.280 --> 02:40:16.280
is incredibly noisy. , there are

4047
02:40:16.399 --> 02:40:18.295
rumors circulating in the community.

4048
02:40:18.319 --> 02:40:19.816
That's because there's no insulation

4049
02:40:19.840 --> 02:40:21.976
between the ceiling and the roof and

4050
02:40:22.000 --> 02:40:24.455
that it acts like a drum. , it is

4051
02:40:24.479 --> 02:40:27.096
incredibly expensive to heat and it's

4052
02:40:27.120 --> 02:40:30.120
moldy and mold is dangerous to people.

4053
02:40:30.960 --> 02:40:33.960
we need to get  an urgent report into

4054
02:40:34.080 --> 02:40:36.856
this situation and brought back to us. I

4055
02:40:36.880 --> 02:40:39.176
think that report would be useful for

4056
02:40:39.200 --> 02:40:41.736
feeding into a broader strategy, but we

4057
02:40:41.760 --> 02:40:44.295
have a problem right now. Um let's get

4058
02:40:44.319 --> 02:40:46.136
the information we need to consider the

4059
02:40:46.160 --> 02:40:47.976
options. Thank you.

4060
02:40:48.000 --> 02:40:49.976
Let's speak before the  sorry against

4061
02:40:50.000 --> 02:40:52.536
the amendment.

4062
02:40:52.560 --> 02:40:54.295
May I just ask a couple of questions I

4063
02:40:54.319 --> 02:40:57.319
think that that flow from the report. So

4064
02:40:58.399 --> 02:41:00.216
the report

4065
02:41:00.240 --> 02:41:02.295
identifies there was a condensation and

4066
02:41:02.319 --> 02:41:05.319
mole problem I think. Um but has that

4067
02:41:06.399 --> 02:41:08.295
problem been resolved or is still is it

4068
02:41:08.319 --> 02:41:10.616
still present? So firstly has it been

4069
02:41:10.640 --> 02:41:12.616
resolved and secondly did the treatment

4070
02:41:12.640 --> 02:41:15.640
cure the disease that is did the 58,000

4071
02:41:15.680 --> 02:41:17.656
in heating cost cure the problem?

4072
02:41:17.680 --> 02:41:18.776
Yeah.

4073
02:41:18.800 --> 02:41:21.800
Um do you madame um chair? No. um

4074
02:41:22.720 --> 02:41:25.720
essentially in terms of increasing the

4075
02:41:26.080 --> 02:41:27.896
um heating arrangements in there, the

4076
02:41:27.920 --> 02:41:30.136
the roof's just not appropriate for it.

4077
02:41:30.160 --> 02:41:31.976
Um and that's detailed in the report

4078
02:41:32.000 --> 02:41:35.000
there. And I just wanted to um clarify

4079
02:41:35.600 --> 02:41:37.335
in terms of councelor Elliot's earlier

4080
02:41:37.359 --> 02:41:39.736
comment, this is not an approach that is

4081
02:41:39.760 --> 02:41:41.415
going forward. We have stopped this

4082
02:41:41.439 --> 02:41:43.415
approach. So the gas bill shouldn't be

4083
02:41:43.439 --> 02:41:46.439
at this level um moving forward. And you

4084
02:41:46.560 --> 02:41:47.976
know staff are getting reminded there

4085
02:41:48.000 --> 02:41:50.455
also um in terms of opening up the

4086
02:41:50.479 --> 02:41:52.696
windows around the facility there helps

4087
02:41:52.720 --> 02:41:54.536
to reduce the level of condensation

4088
02:41:54.560 --> 02:41:56.216
there. But you know we acknowledge that

4089
02:41:56.240 --> 02:41:59.016
the whole facility in itself needs to

4090
02:41:59.040 --> 02:42:00.776
have um a look through and that's the

4091
02:42:00.800 --> 02:42:02.776
reason why the aquatic strategy will be

4092
02:42:02.800 --> 02:42:04.455
a really really good outcome for council

4093
02:42:04.479 --> 02:42:05.976
I believe in terms of making those

4094
02:42:06.000 --> 02:42:07.736
recommendations.

4095
02:42:07.760 --> 02:42:10.696
Can I ask a father question which is h

4096
02:42:10.720 --> 02:42:13.720
how was it then that a $58,000 solution

4097
02:42:14.160 --> 02:42:17.160
was used without any evidence that it

4098
02:42:17.600 --> 02:42:19.096
was going to be effective? How did that

4099
02:42:19.120 --> 02:42:21.256
happen?

4100
02:42:21.280 --> 02:42:24.280
Yeah. Um you madam chair the it was a um

4101
02:42:26.000 --> 02:42:28.295
it was a discussion that was had around

4102
02:42:28.319 --> 02:42:29.896
what has been observed at other

4103
02:42:29.920 --> 02:42:32.056
facilities without the appreciation of

4104
02:42:32.080 --> 02:42:35.080
what the design of our facility is. 

4105
02:42:35.439 --> 02:42:37.096
increasing the heating and I've been to

4106
02:42:37.120 --> 02:42:40.120
other um indoor swim places where um it

4107
02:42:40.240 --> 02:42:41.896
is quite warm on the inside but they're

4108
02:42:41.920 --> 02:42:43.576
much newer facilities so it does

4109
02:42:43.600 --> 02:42:46.375
actually suit that facility to have um a

4110
02:42:46.399 --> 02:42:48.136
higher heating option. It doesn't suit

4111
02:42:48.160 --> 02:42:49.896
the Ginderbine one. So there was

4112
02:42:49.920 --> 02:42:52.056
probably a but I don't want to say

4113
02:42:52.080 --> 02:42:53.656
confusion but it was probably a it was

4114
02:42:53.680 --> 02:42:55.656
an idea that was put forward that just

4115
02:42:55.680 --> 02:42:58.455
didn't suit our facility. So just

4116
02:42:58.479 --> 02:43:01.256
finally so is as far as the chain of

4117
02:43:01.280 --> 02:43:04.216
command is concerned was there a process

4118
02:43:04.240 --> 02:43:07.240
where um a cost was identified it was

4119
02:43:07.920 --> 02:43:10.920
signed off by the re I imagine it may

4120
02:43:11.359 --> 02:43:13.335
have been perhaps before your time Mr.

4121
02:43:13.359 --> 02:43:15.976
mar or not, but just was there a process

4122
02:43:16.000 --> 02:43:17.335
that that for us to be able to

4123
02:43:17.359 --> 02:43:18.776
be more likely that a switch was just

4124
02:43:18.800 --> 02:43:21.496
turned on

4125
02:43:21.520 --> 02:43:23.976
through you chair. Um, so we took some

4126
02:43:24.000 --> 02:43:25.576
advice from somebody that has managed

4127
02:43:25.600 --> 02:43:28.600
swimming pools  and that was their 

4128
02:43:29.439 --> 02:43:31.736
learned recommendation um and we took

4129
02:43:31.760 --> 02:43:33.496
that on board and we said we would 

4130
02:43:33.520 --> 02:43:35.656
trial it to see what happened. was in

4131
02:43:35.680 --> 02:43:38.680
winter. So, um, heating up in winter

4132
02:43:40.319 --> 02:43:43.319
definitely reduced the conversation for

4133
02:43:43.520 --> 02:43:46.520
that time, but we we then stopped it

4134
02:43:47.359 --> 02:43:49.016
because we realized we're incurring an

4135
02:43:49.040 --> 02:43:51.656
incredible bill. Um, and we wouldn't

4136
02:43:51.680 --> 02:43:53.736
repeat it again. But that does have

4137
02:43:53.760 --> 02:43:56.760
structural implications for the pool and

4138
02:43:57.439 --> 02:43:58.536
also mold growth.

4139
02:43:58.560 --> 02:44:00.776
Yes. So in relation just where we sat at

4140
02:44:00.800 --> 02:44:02.455
the moment, there are no immediate risks

4141
02:44:02.479 --> 02:44:04.295
with mold at the moment, but there could

4142
02:44:04.319 --> 02:44:06.216
there could be future risks coming next

4143
02:44:06.240 --> 02:44:07.736
winter.

4144
02:44:07.760 --> 02:44:09.335
Quite possibly. Yeah.

4145
02:44:09.359 --> 02:44:11.096
Thank you. Do we have a speaker against

4146
02:44:11.120 --> 02:44:14.120
the amendment?

4147
02:44:14.800 --> 02:44:16.856
Um councelor Ellie, would you like a

4148
02:44:16.880 --> 02:44:17.816
ride of reply?

4149
02:44:17.840 --> 02:44:20.776
Um yes, just briefly. Thank you, Council

4150
02:44:20.800 --> 02:44:22.776
Williamson, for bringing up even the

4151
02:44:22.800 --> 02:44:25.255
acoustic problem because it only last

4152
02:44:25.279 --> 02:44:28.279
Saturday somebody who worked in radio

4153
02:44:28.479 --> 02:44:31.479
and acoustics or solving those problems

4154
02:44:31.600 --> 02:44:34.295
was in the pool and said to me how easy

4155
02:44:34.319 --> 02:44:37.319
that would be to dampen  the hearing

4156
02:44:37.600 --> 02:44:40.600
noise. But it's more I don't expect the

4157
02:44:42.479 --> 02:44:45.479
report from the CEO to be

4158
02:44:45.760 --> 02:44:48.760


4159
02:44:49.439 --> 02:44:52.439
too comprehensive as far as you know um

4160
02:44:53.359 --> 02:44:56.359
qualifications but it's more that people

4161
02:44:57.200 --> 02:44:59.656
like council staff who worked there in

4162
02:44:59.680 --> 02:45:01.496
maintenance and that and who worked

4163
02:45:01.520 --> 02:45:03.816
there for many years and said even the

4164
02:45:03.840 --> 02:45:06.776
planning of the pool was badly done.

4165
02:45:06.800 --> 02:45:08.856
they knew these problems were going to

4166
02:45:08.880 --> 02:45:11.880
occur. those sort of people  are asked

4167
02:45:13.600 --> 02:45:16.056
their opinions and people who work in

4168
02:45:16.080 --> 02:45:19.080
the pool um because the people who have

4169
02:45:19.120 --> 02:45:21.415
been with the operators in the pool that

4170
02:45:21.439 --> 02:45:24.439
instructors etc have been there for

4171
02:45:24.880 --> 02:45:27.880
quite a lot of years and have a enormous

4172
02:45:28.160 --> 02:45:30.856
amount of experience

4173
02:45:30.880 --> 02:45:32.696
and so

4174
02:45:32.720 --> 02:45:35.720
to satisfy the community and I'm aware

4175
02:45:36.319 --> 02:45:38.616
that you know the funds aren't available

4176
02:45:38.640 --> 02:45:41.640
in that now, but um to satisfy the

4177
02:45:42.240 --> 02:45:44.776
community that they've been heard and

4178
02:45:44.800 --> 02:45:47.800
these problems which will be long-term

4179
02:45:48.319 --> 02:45:51.096
um are being noticed and and possibly

4180
02:45:51.120 --> 02:45:54.120
taken care of then we do we do a report

4181
02:45:55.439 --> 02:45:57.016
for the April meeting.

4182
02:45:57.040 --> 02:45:57.415
Thank you.

4183
02:45:57.439 --> 02:45:58.536
Um thank you. With that I put the

4184
02:45:58.560 --> 02:46:00.776
amendment and if this is carried it

4185
02:46:00.800 --> 02:46:02.616
becomes part of the original motion. All

4186
02:46:02.640 --> 02:46:05.016
those in favor of the amendment,

4187
02:46:05.040 --> 02:46:08.040
councelor Williamson, Rose,

4188
02:46:08.960 --> 02:46:11.896
councelor Elliot, councelor Hopkins, and

4189
02:46:11.920 --> 02:46:14.920
councelor Stewart.

4190
02:46:15.920 --> 02:46:17.335
I have nothing there.

4191
02:46:17.359 --> 02:46:20.056
Those against the amendment.

4192
02:46:20.080 --> 02:46:22.856
Councelor Summers, Councelor Higgins,

4193
02:46:22.880 --> 02:46:25.576
Councelor Davis. The amendment is

4194
02:46:25.600 --> 02:46:27.736
carried.

4195
02:46:27.760 --> 02:46:30.760
We now go back to the original motion.

4196
02:46:31.920 --> 02:46:34.136
Well, the amended motion. Sorry,

4197
02:46:34.160 --> 02:46:35.335
the motion.

4198
02:46:35.359 --> 02:46:37.656
Yeah.

4199
02:46:37.680 --> 02:46:40.680
, so so

4200
02:46:40.960 --> 02:46:42.295
what we're debating now is that council

4201
02:46:42.319 --> 02:46:45.319
note the ginder pool elgar is 202425 and

4202
02:46:45.680 --> 02:46:47.816
request the CEO to prepare a report for

4203
02:46:47.840 --> 02:46:49.255
the April council meeting on the

4204
02:46:49.279 --> 02:46:51.176
problems at Ginderbine Pool with options

4205
02:46:51.200 --> 02:46:53.016
for rectification.

4206
02:46:53.040 --> 02:46:55.976
Um, do we have a speaker against?

4207
02:46:56.000 --> 02:46:57.415
Move the move.

4208
02:46:57.439 --> 02:46:59.335
No. Moved and seconded.

4209
02:46:59.359 --> 02:47:02.359
Your motion. Yeah.

4210
02:47:02.800 --> 02:47:05.576
Nobody's speaking against.  we might

4211
02:47:05.600 --> 02:47:06.696
councelor Summers, would you like a

4212
02:47:06.720 --> 02:47:07.415
right of reply?

4213
02:47:07.439 --> 02:47:09.176
No, I think everything that's been said

4214
02:47:09.200 --> 02:47:11.335
that needs to be said has been said.

4215
02:47:11.359 --> 02:47:13.255
Yes, I'll put the motion.  all those

4216
02:47:13.279 --> 02:47:15.576
in favor?

4217
02:47:15.600 --> 02:47:17.176
Unanimous.

4218
02:47:17.200 --> 02:47:20.200
Moving on to item 9.4.3.

4219
02:47:20.319 --> 02:47:21.736
To move with an amendment, please.

4220
02:47:21.760 --> 02:47:23.816
Right. Councelor Summers, what would you

4221
02:47:23.840 --> 02:47:26.295
like to move?  so a part two to the

4222
02:47:26.319 --> 02:47:28.696
officer's recommendation

4223
02:47:28.720 --> 02:47:31.720
is that  council make representations

4224
02:47:32.640 --> 02:47:35.640
to the relevant ministers

4225
02:47:36.560 --> 02:47:39.560
about the cost and shortfall

4226
02:47:39.680 --> 02:47:42.680
in transport options

4227
02:47:43.520 --> 02:47:46.520
or snow monero local communities.

4228
02:47:49.359 --> 02:47:50.295
Shortfalls

4229
02:47:50.319 --> 02:47:53.319
shortfalls in transport options

4230
02:47:55.200 --> 02:47:58.200
or snow Monero local communities

4231
02:48:01.040 --> 02:48:04.040
and seek equitable solutions

4232
02:48:06.399 --> 02:48:08.616
second.

4233
02:48:08.640 --> 02:48:10.856
I'll second

4234
02:48:10.880 --> 02:48:12.536
make representations to relevant

4235
02:48:12.560 --> 02:48:13.255
ministers.

4236
02:48:13.279 --> 02:48:14.455
Except we just said the word make

4237
02:48:14.479 --> 02:48:17.479
instead of the letter L. We good.

4238
02:48:17.680 --> 02:48:19.496
So it's now we're looking at council a

4239
02:48:19.520 --> 02:48:21.016
adopt the proposed support at home fees

4240
02:48:21.040 --> 02:48:23.096
and charges and b make representations

4241
02:48:23.120 --> 02:48:25.335
to the mad miners.  that motion has

4242
02:48:25.359 --> 02:48:27.736
been seconded by councelor Stewart

4243
02:48:27.760 --> 02:48:29.335
removed councelor summers second to

4244
02:48:29.359 --> 02:48:31.576
councelor Stewart.

4245
02:48:31.600 --> 02:48:33.576
 so we just let councelor summers

4246
02:48:33.600 --> 02:48:35.496
speak. He may answer some of your

4247
02:48:35.520 --> 02:48:36.216
questions.

4248
02:48:36.240 --> 02:48:38.056
Okay. So we had a very good presentation

4249
02:48:38.080 --> 02:48:41.080
earlier this week as part of the um IPNR

4250
02:48:41.279 --> 02:48:44.279
process and it's clear that the um the

4251
02:48:44.399 --> 02:48:47.399
 rises here are required as  to be

4252
02:48:47.840 --> 02:48:50.616
compliant with the um legislative model

4253
02:48:50.640 --> 02:48:53.016
has just come in. But what also became

4254
02:48:53.040 --> 02:48:56.040
clear in that is how disadvantaged some

4255
02:48:56.160 --> 02:48:58.455
members of our community are in the

4256
02:48:58.479 --> 02:49:01.176
packages that they are able to access by

4257
02:49:01.200 --> 02:49:03.576
the distance they live away from the

4258
02:49:03.600 --> 02:49:05.255
areas where these services are

4259
02:49:05.279 --> 02:49:06.616
delivered.

4260
02:49:06.640 --> 02:49:09.255
to the extent that um their package can

4261
02:49:09.279 --> 02:49:12.279
be quite eaten up by um transport

4262
02:49:14.399 --> 02:49:16.616
 it's a really difficult one to climb

4263
02:49:16.640 --> 02:49:19.640
over doing it all um locally um people

4264
02:49:20.080 --> 02:49:22.856
just have to sort of accept it and it's

4265
02:49:22.880 --> 02:49:24.696
quite some of the mo some of the models

4266
02:49:24.720 --> 02:49:26.856
are quite inflexible so you can't even

4267
02:49:26.880 --> 02:49:28.856
sort of drive halfway and get picked up

4268
02:49:28.880 --> 02:49:31.880
it's  it's it's modeled um obviously

4269
02:49:32.399 --> 02:49:34.936
modeled in Sydney I would suggest when

4270
02:49:34.960 --> 02:49:37.496
there's lots of um transport available.

4271
02:49:37.520 --> 02:49:40.520
But I do happen to know that um there is

4272
02:49:40.560 --> 02:49:43.560
currently um um opportunity for

4273
02:49:44.000 --> 02:49:47.000
consultation to Minister Herson who is

4274
02:49:47.279 --> 02:49:50.279
actually looking at regional and rural

4275
02:49:50.399 --> 02:49:52.776
transport options and u I think the

4276
02:49:52.800 --> 02:49:54.536
windows open to do that and I'd like to

4277
02:49:54.560 --> 02:49:56.936
see us actually put in a a very strong

4278
02:49:56.960 --> 02:49:59.255
representation about the inequity that

4279
02:49:59.279 --> 02:50:01.736
this represents and if we do want to

4280
02:50:01.760 --> 02:50:04.760
people keep people older people at home

4281
02:50:05.040 --> 02:50:08.040
in their homes then that we need to not

4282
02:50:09.279 --> 02:50:11.576
penalize them as much as they are

4283
02:50:11.600 --> 02:50:14.295
because of the distance they are from um

4284
02:50:14.319 --> 02:50:16.295
from where the services are provided or

4285
02:50:16.319 --> 02:50:18.216
or or a bigger center. Now I know people

4286
02:50:18.240 --> 02:50:20.136
say well you choose to live there this

4287
02:50:20.160 --> 02:50:22.936
is the distance tax that you end up with

4288
02:50:22.960 --> 02:50:24.936
but then you're just creating another

4289
02:50:24.960 --> 02:50:27.096
trench for people who want to try and

4290
02:50:27.120 --> 02:50:29.335
move into locations where housing's

4291
02:50:29.359 --> 02:50:32.216
still not available. So um I I think if

4292
02:50:32.240 --> 02:50:34.136
we can get some of this sorted out I

4293
02:50:34.160 --> 02:50:35.816
think the example that was given of the

4294
02:50:35.840 --> 02:50:38.840
bus that we run for the library from um

4295
02:50:40.399 --> 02:50:41.576
Delgetti to

4296
02:50:41.600 --> 02:50:44.600
delegate sorry delegate to Bombana

4297
02:50:45.120 --> 02:50:46.856
 was quite an exceptional and

4298
02:50:46.880 --> 02:50:48.696
innovative way of addressing that and

4299
02:50:48.720 --> 02:50:51.016
although it's a small number of people

4300
02:50:51.040 --> 02:50:53.576
it makes a big difference at a small

4301
02:50:53.600 --> 02:50:56.216
cost to those folk and it could mean the

4302
02:50:56.240 --> 02:50:57.576
difference of be able to stay in their

4303
02:50:57.600 --> 02:50:58.696
own home. So

4304
02:50:58.720 --> 02:51:01.255
I couldn't agree more. I um commend the

4305
02:51:01.279 --> 02:51:02.295
recommendation.

4306
02:51:02.319 --> 02:51:03.656
Thank you, councelor Sus. Do we have

4307
02:51:03.680 --> 02:51:05.896
somebody speaking against

4308
02:51:05.920 --> 02:51:07.976
questions? What were we questions?

4309
02:51:08.000 --> 02:51:09.176
Councelor Elliot.

4310
02:51:09.200 --> 02:51:11.016
Um

4311
02:51:11.040 --> 02:51:12.856
that that was an excellent presentation

4312
02:51:12.880 --> 02:51:15.496
and the lady from council is very very

4313
02:51:15.520 --> 02:51:17.415
knowledgeable. But she did bring up

4314
02:51:17.439 --> 02:51:19.415
something and I I wondered whether you'd

4315
02:51:19.439 --> 02:51:22.439
mind adding to it about um the Snowy

4316
02:51:22.800 --> 02:51:25.415
Monero region was one of the few that

4317
02:51:25.439 --> 02:51:28.439
didn't have an education officer to tell

4318
02:51:29.279 --> 02:51:31.255
our elderly people to

4319
02:51:31.279 --> 02:51:34.279
include that. Um and I'm happy if you

4320
02:51:34.319 --> 02:51:35.096
would that

4321
02:51:35.120 --> 02:51:38.120
and so I often see make representations

4322
02:51:38.800 --> 02:51:40.375
to the relevant department for

4323
02:51:40.399 --> 02:51:43.399
allocation of a education officer for

4324
02:51:44.319 --> 02:51:47.319
well they call it aged care and

4325
02:51:48.080 --> 02:51:49.255
something

4326
02:51:49.279 --> 02:51:50.295
age care support

4327
02:51:50.319 --> 02:51:53.096
age care support yes so this is about

4328
02:51:53.120 --> 02:51:55.016
getting into the age care computer and

4329
02:51:55.040 --> 02:51:56.216
doing all of this and if you're not

4330
02:51:56.240 --> 02:51:57.976
registered you can't get there and you

4331
02:51:58.000 --> 02:51:59.736
know need a degree to fly airplanes to

4332
02:51:59.760 --> 02:52:01.335
actually work it out.

4333
02:52:01.359 --> 02:52:02.776
Okay. Great. Thank you. I

4334
02:52:02.800 --> 02:52:04.455
think it's for my age,

4335
02:52:04.479 --> 02:52:06.696
my age care access.

4336
02:52:06.720 --> 02:52:09.176
Yeah. To get you started and that's

4337
02:52:09.200 --> 02:52:10.776
where a lot of our people falling

4338
02:52:10.800 --> 02:52:13.496
through the cracks including the self

4339
02:52:13.520 --> 02:52:15.896
and council rose.

4340
02:52:15.920 --> 02:52:16.216
Um

4341
02:52:16.240 --> 02:52:18.936
I I just when I was reading through the

4342
02:52:18.960 --> 02:52:20.856
document I suppose

4343
02:52:20.880 --> 02:52:23.335
there was a significant issue around

4344
02:52:23.359 --> 02:52:25.656
non-compliance and so I just through you

4345
02:52:25.680 --> 02:52:28.680
asked Mr. Murray about it says um

4346
02:52:28.720 --> 02:52:30.295
basically non non-compliance could

4347
02:52:30.319 --> 02:52:32.056
result in regulatory action from age

4348
02:52:32.080 --> 02:52:33.816
care quality and support commission loss

4349
02:52:33.840 --> 02:52:36.056
of commonwealth funding in disruption

4350
02:52:36.080 --> 02:52:39.080
for services in effect. So what are what

4351
02:52:40.479 --> 02:52:41.896
are the risks associated with

4352
02:52:41.920 --> 02:52:44.776
non-compliance and what are our

4353
02:52:44.800 --> 02:52:47.656
strategies for avoiding non-compliance

4354
02:52:47.680 --> 02:52:50.216
um through you chair. So the fees and

4355
02:52:50.240 --> 02:52:53.240
charges are legislated by the act we

4356
02:52:53.600 --> 02:52:55.736
have.  so we we have to comply with

4357
02:52:55.760 --> 02:52:58.696
that. If we don't  and given that

4358
02:52:58.720 --> 02:53:01.096
almost 100% of what we do in this area

4359
02:53:01.120 --> 02:53:03.736
is grant funded there's a danger that if

4360
02:53:03.760 --> 02:53:06.375
we don't comply the government will say

4361
02:53:06.399 --> 02:53:08.136
you're not complying therefore we want

4362
02:53:08.160 --> 02:53:10.776
to fund your service which would mean

4363
02:53:10.800 --> 02:53:13.016
the collapse of that service. So the

4364
02:53:13.040 --> 02:53:15.896
compliance only relates to not pricing

4365
02:53:15.920 --> 02:53:18.136
it accordingly what the coal has set out

4366
02:53:18.160 --> 02:53:20.216
in fees. Is that is that the situation?

4367
02:53:20.240 --> 02:53:23.096
Yes. So there is a this fee range

4368
02:53:23.120 --> 02:53:25.816
council rose and we we have to put our

4369
02:53:25.840 --> 02:53:28.616
fees somewhere in that range.

4370
02:53:28.640 --> 02:53:31.640
Thank you. Any further questions will

4371
02:53:34.160 --> 02:53:36.216
a number of questions but to follow on

4372
02:53:36.240 --> 02:53:38.616
are our current fees within the range or

4373
02:53:38.640 --> 02:53:41.496
below or above the range?

4374
02:53:41.520 --> 02:53:44.520
current through each um current fees are

4375
02:53:44.560 --> 02:53:47.560
below um and we're now midway between

4376
02:53:50.000 --> 02:53:53.000
the the bottom of and the top.

4377
02:53:53.359 --> 02:53:55.976
So if I understand your concern you're

4378
02:53:56.000 --> 02:53:58.616
concerned if we don't charge more the

4379
02:53:58.640 --> 02:54:01.016
green might take our grants away.

4380
02:54:01.040 --> 02:54:03.576
I'm I'm concerned that if we if we don't

4381
02:54:03.600 --> 02:54:05.576
charge or be asked to charge the

4382
02:54:05.600 --> 02:54:07.816
government will withdraw it support in

4383
02:54:07.840 --> 02:54:10.840
terms of grants. Yeah. Okay. Um,

4384
02:54:12.240 --> 02:54:14.375
what you did at the risk table in the

4385
02:54:14.399 --> 02:54:17.016
document, you're stating that we're

4386
02:54:17.040 --> 02:54:20.040
currently at a medium risk of

4387
02:54:20.080 --> 02:54:23.080
reputational and image damage,

4388
02:54:23.520 --> 02:54:25.496
yet as I understand it, we're putting

4389
02:54:25.520 --> 02:54:27.736
our

4390
02:54:27.760 --> 02:54:30.760
up. Um,

4391
02:54:31.200 --> 02:54:33.656
what why am I why are we medium

4392
02:54:33.680 --> 02:54:36.680
currently and why is it becoming low for

4393
02:54:37.279 --> 02:54:39.415
reputational image?

4394
02:54:39.439 --> 02:54:42.056
Um this lack of lack of supporting this

4395
02:54:42.080 --> 02:54:45.080
motion is is the risk.

4396
02:54:46.319 --> 02:54:47.415
Sorry the

4397
02:54:47.439 --> 02:54:48.056
it

4398
02:54:48.080 --> 02:54:50.455
sorry the risk

4399
02:54:50.479 --> 02:54:53.479
I don't so our current risk is medium.

4400
02:54:54.000 --> 02:54:55.576
What what does that mean?

4401
02:54:55.600 --> 02:54:56.056
Sorry

4402
02:54:56.080 --> 02:54:56.936
why is it med?

4403
02:54:56.960 --> 02:54:59.096
Yeah um through madam chair it is

4404
02:54:59.120 --> 02:55:00.856
actually already um in that fourth dot

4405
02:55:00.880 --> 02:55:02.696
point. It's around the inability to

4406
02:55:02.720 --> 02:55:04.455
demonstrate alignment with national age

4407
02:55:04.479 --> 02:55:05.896
care standards. So that's the reason why

4408
02:55:05.920 --> 02:55:07.335
it's a medium risk.

4409
02:55:07.359 --> 02:55:09.176
Sorry. So that would be the risk if we

4410
02:55:09.200 --> 02:55:10.136
don't

4411
02:55:10.160 --> 02:55:11.896
it's a it's actually the current risk

4412
02:55:11.920 --> 02:55:14.295
because we don't we don't have um the

4413
02:55:14.319 --> 02:55:17.319
legislative framework adopted what came

4414
02:55:17.359 --> 02:55:18.856
into place I think it was November of

4415
02:55:18.880 --> 02:55:19.736
last year.

4416
02:55:19.760 --> 02:55:21.656
So that is actually the current risk and

4417
02:55:21.680 --> 02:55:23.176
it will be the future risk if we don't

4418
02:55:23.200 --> 02:55:26.200
decide to adopt it today

4419
02:55:26.479 --> 02:55:28.455
and if Yeah. And um the other thing

4420
02:55:28.479 --> 02:55:30.136
sorry to go back to councelor Rose's

4421
02:55:30.160 --> 02:55:32.776
question around um compliance there's

4422
02:55:32.800 --> 02:55:35.496
enforcable undertaking um and that the

4423
02:55:35.520 --> 02:55:37.496
age care commissioner can also come in

4424
02:55:37.520 --> 02:55:40.136
and um have banning orders as well. So

4425
02:55:40.160 --> 02:55:42.616
it is quite serious. Yeah.

4426
02:55:42.640 --> 02:55:44.136
Do we have anybody speaking against the

4427
02:55:44.160 --> 02:55:45.096
motion?

4428
02:55:45.120 --> 02:55:48.120
I I just want to um put some changes to

4429
02:55:49.439 --> 02:55:52.439
the amendments in council and it's it's

4430
02:55:53.040 --> 02:55:56.040
in support of it councelor son. So I

4431
02:55:56.560 --> 02:55:59.176
actually seek that we need to be very

4432
02:55:59.200 --> 02:56:01.656
clear about the transport options

4433
02:56:01.680 --> 02:56:04.680
because the cost the the renumeration or

4434
02:56:05.600 --> 02:56:08.600
the cost to the  client at the moment

4435
02:56:08.880 --> 02:56:11.880
is related to our zoning status. So, we

4436
02:56:13.200 --> 02:56:15.896
should actually be in a zone that is

4437
02:56:15.920 --> 02:56:18.920
remote and they are the the clients that

4438
02:56:20.000 --> 02:56:22.216
are most affected. But our current

4439
02:56:22.240 --> 02:56:25.240
zoning does not allow that or take into

4440
02:56:25.600 --> 02:56:28.600
account the isolation of these clients,

4441
02:56:30.319 --> 02:56:31.816
especially if we're talking about anglas

4442
02:56:31.840 --> 02:56:34.056
reach and we're talking about delegate.

4443
02:56:34.080 --> 02:56:35.896
Council, before we debate, what changes

4444
02:56:35.920 --> 02:56:37.415
would you like to make? I just want to

4445
02:56:37.439 --> 02:56:39.576
say that

4446
02:56:39.600 --> 02:56:42.600
 to about transport options

4447
02:56:43.040 --> 02:56:44.375
um

4448
02:56:44.399 --> 02:56:47.255
change options to for um

4449
02:56:47.279 --> 02:56:49.576
zoning for transport options

4450
02:56:49.600 --> 02:56:51.496
 transport

4451
02:56:51.520 --> 02:56:54.375
inclusive inclusive of our zoning

4452
02:56:54.399 --> 02:56:55.016
status.

4453
02:56:55.040 --> 02:56:56.616
Yeah

4454
02:56:56.640 --> 02:56:59.255
state

4455
02:56:59.279 --> 02:57:01.736
and that also takes into account the

4456
02:57:01.760 --> 02:57:04.375
transport costs for actual home care

4457
02:57:04.399 --> 02:57:06.696
services. So they're two different

4458
02:57:06.720 --> 02:57:08.536
issues. We've got transport, community

4459
02:57:08.560 --> 02:57:11.560
transport and home care transport that's

4460
02:57:11.600 --> 02:57:14.600
eaten up by u by  into the package.

4461
02:57:16.080 --> 02:57:17.976
Instead of the person getting services,

4462
02:57:18.000 --> 02:57:20.216
they're putting a lot of  money into

4463
02:57:20.240 --> 02:57:21.656
the transport for the service.

4464
02:57:21.680 --> 02:57:23.335
So do we need to put age care before

4465
02:57:23.359 --> 02:57:26.359
zoning?

4466
02:57:32.319 --> 02:57:33.816
What zoning are we talking about?

4467
02:57:33.840 --> 02:57:35.656
Yeah. Okay.

4468
02:57:35.680 --> 02:57:37.096
What zoning are we talking about? It's

4469
02:57:37.120 --> 02:57:38.536
aged care zoning services.

4470
02:57:38.560 --> 02:57:41.560
Okay. So, so, so age care services.

4471
02:57:41.680 --> 02:57:43.016
Just to get the phrasing right. That's

4472
02:57:43.040 --> 02:57:44.455
all.

4473
02:57:44.479 --> 02:57:46.216
Yes. Um,

4474
02:57:46.240 --> 02:57:47.976
is it called supported home zoning or

4475
02:57:48.000 --> 02:57:50.295
age care zoning? What's that? What's the

4476
02:57:50.319 --> 02:57:50.936
zoning?

4477
02:57:50.960 --> 02:57:53.496
It's gets the age care

4478
02:57:53.520 --> 02:57:56.520
 act. I think it's the age care act.

4479
02:57:56.800 --> 02:57:58.056
It's the age care act.

4480
02:57:58.080 --> 02:57:58.536
Yes.

4481
02:57:58.560 --> 02:58:01.016
Yes. So, it's zoning within the age care

4482
02:58:01.040 --> 02:58:04.040
act for this area.

4483
02:58:04.479 --> 02:58:06.616
It's 2024.

4484
02:58:06.640 --> 02:58:07.976
Okay.

4485
02:58:08.000 --> 02:58:11.000
, anybody making

4486
02:58:11.760 --> 02:58:14.760
some rewarding slight wording still

4487
02:58:14.880 --> 02:58:17.880
I think inclusive inclusive of our res

4488
02:58:18.880 --> 02:58:21.880
including reconsidering

4489
02:58:22.160 --> 02:58:25.160
a change in zoning to remote status or

4490
02:58:28.160 --> 02:58:29.576
because I think that's the that's the

4491
02:58:29.600 --> 02:58:32.600
issue. So include instead of J inclusive

4492
02:58:33.279 --> 02:58:36.216
of zoning status but including

4493
02:58:36.240 --> 02:58:38.216
inclusive of updating our zoning status

4494
02:58:38.240 --> 02:58:38.856
to remote

4495
02:58:38.880 --> 02:58:40.856
including yes including updating our

4496
02:58:40.880 --> 02:58:43.496
zoning status to a remote

4497
02:58:43.520 --> 02:58:44.295
classification

4498
02:58:44.319 --> 02:58:47.319
classification

4499
02:58:47.600 --> 02:58:49.816
a couple's

4500
02:58:49.840 --> 02:58:51.656
paper

4501
02:58:51.680 --> 02:58:53.816
right had a comment chair just I've been

4502
02:58:53.840 --> 02:58:56.455
updated um the zoning model is called

4503
02:58:56.479 --> 02:58:58.536
the me modified model

4504
02:58:58.560 --> 02:59:00.936
goodness gracious

4505
02:59:00.960 --> 02:59:02.696
very familiar with.

4506
02:59:02.720 --> 02:59:03.976
It's probably going

4507
02:59:04.000 --> 02:59:04.616
Yeah.

4508
02:59:04.640 --> 02:59:07.576
Every day working

4509
02:59:07.600 --> 02:59:08.536
it right if we're going to have it

4510
02:59:08.560 --> 02:59:10.136
modified.

4511
02:59:10.160 --> 02:59:13.096
It's design modified modified.

4512
02:59:13.120 --> 02:59:15.976
I've got here modified by my in-house

4513
02:59:16.000 --> 02:59:16.536
expert.

4514
02:59:16.560 --> 02:59:17.736
All right, we'll go with that. MES

4515
02:59:17.760 --> 02:59:18.776
modified model.

4516
02:59:18.800 --> 02:59:20.936
We know what it is.

4517
02:59:20.960 --> 02:59:23.960
Okay. Anybody can't speak, but I have

4518
02:59:24.080 --> 02:59:25.816
one more question if that's okay.

4519
02:59:25.840 --> 02:59:28.840
Sure. Um  do we know how many of our

4520
02:59:29.200 --> 02:59:32.200
customers elected to not come under the

4521
02:59:32.960 --> 02:59:35.576
new scheme and to be grandfathered under

4522
02:59:35.600 --> 02:59:37.736
the existing arrangements? Right.

4523
02:59:37.760 --> 02:59:39.976
I have to take that on notice.

4524
02:59:40.000 --> 02:59:40.375
Notice the

4525
02:59:40.399 --> 02:59:41.976
answer is at least one.

4526
02:59:42.000 --> 02:59:44.056
So,

4527
02:59:44.080 --> 02:59:45.496
excuse me. I think that the

4528
02:59:45.520 --> 02:59:47.576
grandfathering you had to actually been

4529
02:59:47.600 --> 02:59:49.976
receiving services before a certain date

4530
02:59:50.000 --> 02:59:52.056
to be grandfathered. Anybody who

4531
02:59:52.080 --> 02:59:53.656
receives services after that date

4532
02:59:53.680 --> 02:59:55.176
automatically went into

4533
02:59:55.200 --> 02:59:56.455
I think councelor Williamson's question

4534
02:59:56.479 --> 02:59:59.016
still stands in that what is the actual

4535
02:59:59.040 --> 03:00:00.856
number? So that's a question we can take

4536
03:00:00.880 --> 03:00:03.880
on. Thank you. Um I can speak against

4537
03:00:04.880 --> 03:00:05.816
the motion. Thank you.

4538
03:00:05.840 --> 03:00:06.936
You get five minutes.

4539
03:00:06.960 --> 03:00:08.295
I won't take that one.

4540
03:00:08.319 --> 03:00:10.776
We won't clock on there.

4541
03:00:10.800 --> 03:00:12.856
 so I've had a good look at the the

4542
03:00:12.880 --> 03:00:15.335
prices involved here and and I've had

4543
03:00:15.359 --> 03:00:18.359
some  questions back and forth with

4544
03:00:18.720 --> 03:00:21.255
Mr. marriage which has been helpful. 

4545
03:00:21.279 --> 03:00:24.136
I've also met with a number of existing

4546
03:00:24.160 --> 03:00:27.160
customers of the service  and  some

4547
03:00:27.439 --> 03:00:30.439
very soon to be customers I believe. Um

4548
03:00:32.080 --> 03:00:34.856
 we the the conversation around the

4549
03:00:34.880 --> 03:00:37.880
the issue for those who are very remote

4550
03:00:37.920 --> 03:00:40.920
is absolutely a real problem. Um and 

4551
03:00:43.439 --> 03:00:46.136
and the quantum of the prices that we've

4552
03:00:46.160 --> 03:00:48.216
considered particularly for weekend

4553
03:00:48.240 --> 03:00:51.240
travel  are frankly um unaffordable.

4554
03:00:53.520 --> 03:00:56.520
 you know we we've all all been around

4555
03:00:57.040 --> 03:00:58.616
for a while. We've all worked for

4556
03:00:58.640 --> 03:01:01.096
government.  I can't think of a single

4557
03:01:01.120 --> 03:01:03.255
time government's put their prices down

4558
03:01:03.279 --> 03:01:06.136
after they put them up.  if we put

4559
03:01:06.160 --> 03:01:07.896
these prices up today, we're going to be

4560
03:01:07.920 --> 03:01:10.920
stuck with them and our our most

4561
03:01:10.960 --> 03:01:13.736
vulnerable people are going to suffer. I

4562
03:01:13.760 --> 03:01:15.656
can't support the pricing that we put

4563
03:01:15.680 --> 03:01:17.736
forward and I won't fight through. Thank

4564
03:01:17.760 --> 03:01:18.216
you.

4565
03:01:18.240 --> 03:01:19.576
Thank you, councelor Williams. We have

4566
03:01:19.600 --> 03:01:22.295
someone speaking for the motion

4567
03:01:22.319 --> 03:01:24.375
just change just a slight change in

4568
03:01:24.399 --> 03:01:25.096
wording. So

4569
03:01:25.120 --> 03:01:26.295
we'll see what the move in a second to

4570
03:01:26.319 --> 03:01:28.616
think. What's your suggestion? So rather

4571
03:01:28.640 --> 03:01:31.640
inclusive of our update including we'll

4572
03:01:32.160 --> 03:01:35.016
say including requests including a

4573
03:01:35.040 --> 03:01:37.576
request to update that exits.

4574
03:01:37.600 --> 03:01:40.600
Yes that's fine.

4575
03:01:40.880 --> 03:01:43.880
I agree Nancy.

4576
03:01:45.439 --> 03:01:48.439
Thank you. So  we speaking for the

4577
03:01:48.640 --> 03:01:50.696
motion counc

4578
03:01:50.720 --> 03:01:53.096
Davis

4579
03:01:53.120 --> 03:01:56.120
I'll speak for this motion. Um we are in

4580
03:01:56.800 --> 03:01:59.335
a really difficult position here. We run

4581
03:01:59.359 --> 03:02:02.216
community age care services and we are

4582
03:02:02.240 --> 03:02:04.216
required under the age care act to

4583
03:02:04.240 --> 03:02:06.696
comply within the act and the changes

4584
03:02:06.720 --> 03:02:08.455
that were actually put in place from

4585
03:02:08.479 --> 03:02:11.415
November 1.

4586
03:02:11.439 --> 03:02:14.439
I it puts council in a really difficult

4587
03:02:14.800 --> 03:02:17.800
position. We are responsible for this

4588
03:02:18.720 --> 03:02:21.255
service, but the community do not see

4589
03:02:21.279 --> 03:02:23.415
the difference between what the federal

4590
03:02:23.439 --> 03:02:25.496
government have actually imposed on us

4591
03:02:25.520 --> 03:02:28.056
as to what we're actually imposing on

4592
03:02:28.080 --> 03:02:30.936
this community. And unfortunately, in

4593
03:02:30.960 --> 03:02:33.736
the changes to the age care act uses

4594
03:02:33.760 --> 03:02:36.760
pain and that is the change that was put

4595
03:02:37.200 --> 03:02:39.736
in place, legislated and passed in

4596
03:02:39.760 --> 03:02:42.536
parliament last year.

4597
03:02:42.560 --> 03:02:44.295
We are feeling the pain of that

4598
03:02:44.319 --> 03:02:47.016
especially in a rural area and more

4599
03:02:47.040 --> 03:02:50.040
importantly because of our zoning. Our

4600
03:02:50.160 --> 03:02:53.096
zoning puts us to a total disadvantage

4601
03:02:53.120 --> 03:02:54.616
especially those people who live in

4602
03:02:54.640 --> 03:02:57.096
isolated areas and they should not be

4603
03:02:57.120 --> 03:02:58.776
discriminated against because they

4604
03:02:58.800 --> 03:03:01.800
choose to live where they love to live.

4605
03:03:02.560 --> 03:03:05.560
However, we are a a service that we as a

4606
03:03:09.760 --> 03:03:12.375
council has chosen to continue to

4607
03:03:12.399 --> 03:03:14.696
provide and whilst we continue to

4608
03:03:14.720 --> 03:03:16.696
provide this service, we must comply

4609
03:03:16.720 --> 03:03:19.720
with the act and the act is giving us

4610
03:03:19.840 --> 03:03:22.136
very little wiggle room. Now, we can

4611
03:03:22.160 --> 03:03:24.455
choose not to put the fees up and we can

4612
03:03:24.479 --> 03:03:27.335
wear the cost of that. We can put that

4613
03:03:27.359 --> 03:03:29.176
on the rate payers. we need to choose

4614
03:03:29.200 --> 03:03:31.816
what we're not going to do and that's

4615
03:03:31.840 --> 03:03:34.840
going to be a very hard decision. So my

4616
03:03:35.680 --> 03:03:38.680
view is we need to  support the um

4617
03:03:40.479 --> 03:03:43.479
motion on the board. We need to lobby

4618
03:03:43.600 --> 03:03:46.600
really hard in regard to how this is

4619
03:03:47.279 --> 03:03:49.736
affecting our people on the ground. And

4620
03:03:49.760 --> 03:03:52.455
whilst there's a big story around and a

4621
03:03:52.479 --> 03:03:54.295
lot of discussion about all of the home

4622
03:03:54.319 --> 03:03:56.776
care packages have been released since

4623
03:03:56.800 --> 03:03:59.800
November 1, there is not the staffing

4624
03:04:00.399 --> 03:04:02.455
all the human resources to support the

4625
03:04:02.479 --> 03:04:04.696
number of packages. So we will continue

4626
03:04:04.720 --> 03:04:06.375
to have people in our community who will

4627
03:04:06.399 --> 03:04:09.399
wait a long period of time for a package

4628
03:04:10.720 --> 03:04:13.016
and will continue to be disadvantaged

4629
03:04:13.040 --> 03:04:15.335
because of where they live. So, we need

4630
03:04:15.359 --> 03:04:18.216
to support the council this this current

4631
03:04:18.240 --> 03:04:20.856
motion. We need to lobby really hard to

4632
03:04:20.880 --> 03:04:23.096
our political partners in regard to

4633
03:04:23.120 --> 03:04:26.056
that. It isn't fair. However, like

4634
03:04:26.080 --> 03:04:27.736
everybody, the feds are saying they've

4635
03:04:27.760 --> 03:04:29.096
got no money. The states are saying

4636
03:04:29.120 --> 03:04:31.896
they've got no money and we are we have

4637
03:04:31.920 --> 03:04:34.136
a service that is totally dictated by

4638
03:04:34.160 --> 03:04:36.375
both of those entities and we are going

4639
03:04:36.399 --> 03:04:37.976
to be wearing the coffin if we don't

4640
03:04:38.000 --> 03:04:39.576
agree to this. Thank you.

4641
03:04:39.600 --> 03:04:42.600
Thank you. speak against

4642
03:04:42.640 --> 03:04:44.136
councelor Summers. Would you like a

4643
03:04:44.160 --> 03:04:44.856
right of reply?

4644
03:04:44.880 --> 03:04:46.455
Briefly. Yes, thank you councelors for

4645
03:04:46.479 --> 03:04:48.136
your for your input. I think it's really

4646
03:04:48.160 --> 03:04:50.056
important that we do make those strong

4647
03:04:50.080 --> 03:04:52.776
representations. It's going to be a sad

4648
03:04:52.800 --> 03:04:55.096
fact that some people may have to move

4649
03:04:55.120 --> 03:04:56.936
close to where the services are and we

4650
03:04:56.960 --> 03:04:58.536
see that happening when people retire

4651
03:04:58.560 --> 03:05:00.056
and go to the coast. It's just a

4652
03:05:00.080 --> 03:05:02.295
different manifestation of people going

4653
03:05:02.319 --> 03:05:04.455
somewhere where they need to meet, you

4654
03:05:04.479 --> 03:05:06.455
know, conditions they might have as a a

4655
03:05:06.479 --> 03:05:08.616
result of, you know, outrageous slings

4656
03:05:08.640 --> 03:05:10.295
and arrows of for of fortune or whatever

4657
03:05:10.319 --> 03:05:12.936
that quote is. Um, but I really think

4658
03:05:12.960 --> 03:05:15.960
that we must stay in this space at the

4659
03:05:16.160 --> 03:05:18.375
moment. Um, the market here is not

4660
03:05:18.399 --> 03:05:20.696
mature enough to um provide these

4661
03:05:20.720 --> 03:05:22.375
services without council's

4662
03:05:22.399 --> 03:05:24.856
participation. there are only two and

4663
03:05:24.880 --> 03:05:27.736
the presentation that um councelor

4664
03:05:27.760 --> 03:05:30.536
Elliot referred to was was very cogent

4665
03:05:30.560 --> 03:05:32.536
along that point and very thorough in

4666
03:05:32.560 --> 03:05:35.560
the u the analysis that was provided. So

4667
03:05:35.920 --> 03:05:38.056
I think we need to stick with it.

4668
03:05:38.080 --> 03:05:39.656
Unfortunately, we do have to put the

4669
03:05:39.680 --> 03:05:42.375
prices up. Some people will fall by the

4670
03:05:42.399 --> 03:05:44.216
wayside and find that very difficult to

4671
03:05:44.240 --> 03:05:46.455
accommodate. But I also think that

4672
03:05:46.479 --> 03:05:49.415
there's room to um lobby and room to be

4673
03:05:49.439 --> 03:05:51.176
innovative in the way that the um

4674
03:05:51.200 --> 03:05:53.176
services are provided. So I recommend

4675
03:05:53.200 --> 03:05:56.200
this resolution to um council and offer

4676
03:05:57.279 --> 03:06:00.279
my colleagues services as best we can to

4677
03:06:00.319 --> 03:06:03.176
um open doors to receptive you know to

4678
03:06:03.200 --> 03:06:06.200
receptive um receipt of these please.

4679
03:06:06.960 --> 03:06:08.295
Thank you. With that I put the motion.

4680
03:06:08.319 --> 03:06:11.176
All those in favor councelor Summers,

4681
03:06:11.200 --> 03:06:13.335
Councelor Higgins, Councelor Stewart,

4682
03:06:13.359 --> 03:06:14.936
Councelor Rose, Councelor Rooney,

4683
03:06:14.960 --> 03:06:16.936
Councelor Davis, Councelor Elliot,

4684
03:06:16.960 --> 03:06:19.496
Councelor Hopkins. Those against

4685
03:06:19.520 --> 03:06:21.255
Councelor Williamson. The motion is

4686
03:06:21.279 --> 03:06:24.279
carried. Moving on to 9.5.1, the

4687
03:06:24.880 --> 03:06:27.656
resolution sheet updates. Do we have a

4688
03:06:27.680 --> 03:06:30.680
motion, a move of a motion?

4689
03:06:31.279 --> 03:06:33.896
Deputy may I'll move that we note these.

4690
03:06:33.920 --> 03:06:36.455
Um, and I have some questions on record

4691
03:06:36.479 --> 03:06:38.136
that councelor Elliot and I have been

4692
03:06:38.160 --> 03:06:39.096
working on.

4693
03:06:39.120 --> 03:06:41.736
Right. So, so the um I just need a

4694
03:06:41.760 --> 03:06:43.816
second first. So, the um your motion is

4695
03:06:43.840 --> 03:06:45.976
that council note the resolution sheet

4696
03:06:46.000 --> 03:06:48.295
action sheet updates. We have a second

4697
03:06:48.319 --> 03:06:51.319
for this. Councelor Elliot. ,

4698
03:06:52.560 --> 03:06:53.816
sure. Councelor Rose.

4699
03:06:53.840 --> 03:06:56.295
So, if we'll try and go through these

4700
03:06:56.319 --> 03:06:57.576
briefly, but they're all important

4701
03:06:57.600 --> 03:06:59.335
issues that have been raised to us. And

4702
03:06:59.359 --> 03:07:01.335
councelor Elliot and I have been working

4703
03:07:01.359 --> 03:07:04.359
on this as recently as um 11 10:30  to

4704
03:07:06.240 --> 03:07:09.240
try and just get the the key points to

4705
03:07:10.000 --> 03:07:13.000
address. Um, if we could go to 442

4706
03:07:13.520 --> 03:07:14.936
stroke 25.

4707
03:07:14.960 --> 03:07:16.295
We can have the page number.

4708
03:07:16.319 --> 03:07:17.016
Council

4709
03:07:17.040 --> 03:07:19.415
897.

4710
03:07:19.439 --> 03:07:20.455
Oh.

4711
03:07:20.479 --> 03:07:23.479
Oh, look at you.

4712
03:07:23.680 --> 03:07:26.680
We've practiced.

4713
03:07:29.760 --> 03:07:32.696
He's very big on with that particular

4714
03:07:32.720 --> 03:07:35.576
item. Um, refurbishment of water supply.

4715
03:07:35.600 --> 03:07:38.056
There are no notes. the renewal of water

4716
03:07:38.080 --> 03:07:39.736
supply and critical infrastruct

4717
03:07:39.760 --> 03:07:42.760
infrastructure. The we were we'd like to

4718
03:07:44.080 --> 03:07:45.335
know whether and the committee would

4719
03:07:45.359 --> 03:07:47.976
like to know whether um there's been the

4720
03:07:48.000 --> 03:07:49.415
federal members have been written to

4721
03:07:49.439 --> 03:07:51.736
about this refurbishment of water supply

4722
03:07:51.760 --> 03:07:53.896
and there was a completion date of the

4723
03:07:53.920 --> 03:07:56.920
19th of January. um through you madam

4724
03:07:57.920 --> 03:08:00.136
chair.  the issue is around when the

4725
03:08:00.160 --> 03:08:02.136
minutes were completed and put into the

4726
03:08:02.160 --> 03:08:04.136
system and acknowledging that  we

4727
03:08:04.160 --> 03:08:05.576
haven't had a chance to move the

4728
03:08:05.600 --> 03:08:07.816
completion date. So I think this came up

4729
03:08:07.840 --> 03:08:10.616
at the December meeting if I'm correct.

4730
03:08:10.640 --> 03:08:13.096
 we haven't my understanding is that

4731
03:08:13.120 --> 03:08:14.536
we haven't written to the federal and

4732
03:08:14.560 --> 03:08:16.375
state members but we have met with our

4733
03:08:16.399 --> 03:08:17.816
local member just to start the

4734
03:08:17.840 --> 03:08:20.295
discussion there around um specific

4735
03:08:20.319 --> 03:08:21.816
grants that we could apply for. So

4736
03:08:21.840 --> 03:08:23.816
there's been correspondence between

4737
03:08:23.840 --> 03:08:25.816
Steve Bond's office and myself in terms

4738
03:08:25.840 --> 03:08:27.496
of what grants might be appropriate and

4739
03:08:27.520 --> 03:08:29.656
I do understand it's um our local

4740
03:08:29.680 --> 03:08:31.176
members even gone and spoken to the

4741
03:08:31.200 --> 03:08:32.936
Minister for Water in New South Wales as

4742
03:08:32.960 --> 03:08:33.255
well.

4743
03:08:33.279 --> 03:08:34.696
Thank you. Um

4744
03:08:34.720 --> 03:08:36.455
um councelor if I may just um sort of

4745
03:08:36.479 --> 03:08:38.136
hopefully help. I think it's been well

4746
03:08:38.160 --> 03:08:39.496
established that the estimated

4747
03:08:39.520 --> 03:08:41.176
completion dates may be inaccurate in

4748
03:08:41.200 --> 03:08:42.536
this report. I think we're all clear

4749
03:08:42.560 --> 03:08:44.295
that there are some difficulties this

4750
03:08:44.319 --> 03:08:46.216
report and we all acknowledge that the

4751
03:08:46.240 --> 03:08:47.816
estimated completion dates may not be

4752
03:08:47.840 --> 03:08:49.096
correct and we're asked to overlook that

4753
03:08:49.120 --> 03:08:51.335
because we understand that staff are

4754
03:08:51.359 --> 03:08:53.096
working through this

4755
03:08:53.120 --> 03:08:55.736
number 441 stroke 25 which is the

4756
03:08:55.760 --> 03:08:57.976
fluoride survey.

4757
03:08:58.000 --> 03:09:00.536
 we're uncertain that this was still

4758
03:09:00.560 --> 03:09:02.856
outstanding because as far as we know

4759
03:09:02.880 --> 03:09:05.096
this survey is on the website but is

4760
03:09:05.120 --> 03:09:06.616
there anything further that needs to be

4761
03:09:06.640 --> 03:09:09.640
done by staff with this item?

4762
03:09:11.200 --> 03:09:13.896
 yes through through you madam chair.

4763
03:09:13.920 --> 03:09:16.920
I think sorry um I have to apologize to

4764
03:09:16.960 --> 03:09:19.096
councilors because over the  new

4765
03:09:19.120 --> 03:09:21.496
year's break in terms of um having staff

4766
03:09:21.520 --> 03:09:23.576
in the executive office um we didn't

4767
03:09:23.600 --> 03:09:25.096
have staff in the executive office as

4768
03:09:25.120 --> 03:09:27.496
you are aware. So this one has been

4769
03:09:27.520 --> 03:09:29.976
completed and will be noted for the next

4770
03:09:30.000 --> 03:09:32.056
um meeting.

4771
03:09:32.080 --> 03:09:34.216
There's a a formatting issue with the

4772
03:09:34.240 --> 03:09:35.736
pages as well which has made it a bit

4773
03:09:35.760 --> 03:09:38.760
challenging. um 440 stroke 25.

4774
03:09:41.200 --> 03:09:43.976
There's no updated um updated notes

4775
03:09:44.000 --> 03:09:46.295
here, but we have been informed I think

4776
03:09:46.319 --> 03:09:48.295
by Mr. Lickers about the blue green

4777
03:09:48.319 --> 03:09:50.696
algae problem.

4778
03:09:50.720 --> 03:09:53.576
Does that change the approach here in

4779
03:09:53.600 --> 03:09:56.600
relation to this particular item

4780
03:10:00.720 --> 03:10:03.415
page number council Elliot? Um because

4781
03:10:03.439 --> 03:10:06.375
they're not in order is the problem that

4782
03:10:06.399 --> 03:10:07.976
numerical order is

4783
03:10:08.000 --> 03:10:09.896
this is in so in terms of what you just

4784
03:10:09.920 --> 03:10:11.896
said council rose that's in relation to

4785
03:10:11.920 --> 03:10:13.016
Lake Wallace.

4786
03:10:13.040 --> 03:10:15.096
Yeah. Um no it won't have an impact but

4787
03:10:15.120 --> 03:10:17.736
it will be a um issue that will need to

4788
03:10:17.760 --> 03:10:19.496
be considered in that management plan

4789
03:10:19.520 --> 03:10:21.496
that we've put we're proposing to

4790
03:10:21.520 --> 03:10:22.136
create.

4791
03:10:22.160 --> 03:10:25.160
Thank you. 437 stroke 25 which is

4792
03:10:27.439 --> 03:10:29.896
council can give us the page number. 

4793
03:10:29.920 --> 03:10:30.696
I'm trying

4794
03:10:30.720 --> 03:10:33.720
out of a V and Baral pool entry fees.

4795
03:10:34.000 --> 03:10:36.696
Um action must be taken on the 29th of

4796
03:10:36.720 --> 03:10:39.176
the of January if needed. It must have

4797
03:10:39.200 --> 03:10:41.656
been needed. Um how much of the buses

4798
03:10:41.680 --> 03:10:44.295
cost to date that have been put in

4799
03:10:44.319 --> 03:10:45.096
place?

4800
03:10:45.120 --> 03:10:46.455
 the madam chair I'll have to take

4801
03:10:46.479 --> 03:10:48.136
that one on notice to provide at the

4802
03:10:48.160 --> 03:10:48.856
next meeting.

4803
03:10:48.880 --> 03:10:51.880
Thank you. Um 468 stroke 25 settlement

4804
03:10:54.720 --> 03:10:56.536
of property claimed. There was a

4805
03:10:56.560 --> 03:10:58.136
directions hearing on the 30th of

4806
03:10:58.160 --> 03:11:00.696
January, 13th of February as noted in

4807
03:11:00.720 --> 03:11:03.096
the notes.

4808
03:11:03.120 --> 03:11:05.176
Perhaps advice of any update relating to

4809
03:11:05.200 --> 03:11:07.816
that directions here.

4810
03:11:07.840 --> 03:11:09.255
H903.

4811
03:11:09.279 --> 03:11:12.279
903. Thank you very much.

4812
03:11:13.200 --> 03:11:16.200
903.

4813
03:11:25.600 --> 03:11:28.600
 through you madame chair there is no

4814
03:11:29.040 --> 03:11:31.415
update that I will be providing the

4815
03:11:31.439 --> 03:11:34.439
update sorry in the legal claims

4816
03:11:35.040 --> 03:11:37.976
um

4817
03:11:38.000 --> 03:11:41.000
social media policy 361 stroke 25 I

4818
03:11:41.359 --> 03:11:44.359
think in another meeting

4819
03:11:44.640 --> 03:11:47.640
um madam deputy chair I think the CEO

4820
03:11:48.399 --> 03:11:50.856
told us this has been chilled for a

4821
03:11:50.880 --> 03:11:53.880
while but I noticed that The

4822
03:11:55.120 --> 03:11:57.656
motion had a workshop with counselors

4823
03:11:57.680 --> 03:12:00.295
and so it was meant to be brought to the

4824
03:12:00.319 --> 03:12:02.216
November meeting. So it was just just a

4825
03:12:02.240 --> 03:12:05.240
timetable for what that process is.

4826
03:12:05.840 --> 03:12:07.816
Yep. Through you madam chair. So there

4827
03:12:07.840 --> 03:12:09.496
was a workshop that was carried out with

4828
03:12:09.520 --> 03:12:10.936
counselors. There was a number of

4829
03:12:10.960 --> 03:12:12.696
questions raised and the staff are

4830
03:12:12.720 --> 03:12:14.856
working through it. At the moment I

4831
03:12:14.880 --> 03:12:16.936
think in terms of what we had discussed

4832
03:12:16.960 --> 03:12:19.656
in our IPNR workshop, the focus is on

4833
03:12:19.680 --> 03:12:21.896
the overall communications plan and

4834
03:12:21.920 --> 03:12:24.455
strategy cuz social media is one element

4835
03:12:24.479 --> 03:12:26.536
that comes into it.

4836
03:12:26.560 --> 03:12:28.455
So there's no particular plan for the

4837
03:12:28.479 --> 03:12:30.216
social media strategy to come back to

4838
03:12:30.240 --> 03:12:32.136
council in the near future.

4839
03:12:32.160 --> 03:12:32.536
No.

4840
03:12:32.560 --> 03:12:35.560
No. Thank you. Um 374 stroke 25. Um

4841
03:12:38.240 --> 03:12:39.816
councelor Elliot, if you can find the

4842
03:12:39.840 --> 03:12:40.776
page number.

4843
03:12:40.800 --> 03:12:41.176
Um

4844
03:12:41.200 --> 03:12:42.136
it's the insurance.

4845
03:12:42.160 --> 03:12:45.160
Yeah.  924

4846
03:12:45.200 --> 03:12:47.335
insurance policy excess. Um there was a

4847
03:12:47.359 --> 03:12:48.936
report to be provided to the December

4848
03:12:48.960 --> 03:12:50.936
meeting. I don't think we I haven't seen

4849
03:12:50.960 --> 03:12:52.455
the report. I don't think it may have

4850
03:12:52.479 --> 03:12:54.536
been provided but just was going to

4851
03:12:54.560 --> 03:12:57.560
check what's happening to that report.

4852
03:12:58.479 --> 03:13:01.016
Well you madame mayor that will come to

4853
03:13:01.040 --> 03:13:02.696
through to the March meeting. Our

4854
03:13:02.720 --> 03:13:04.455
apologies.

4855
03:13:04.479 --> 03:13:07.479
191 strike 25 about this is about

4856
03:13:07.840 --> 03:13:10.840
detached studios and farm buildings. Um,

4857
03:13:11.840 --> 03:13:14.295
this has got a completion on it, but I

4858
03:13:14.319 --> 03:13:15.656
don't think we've had a workshop that

4859
03:13:15.680 --> 03:13:17.255
was going to be held in relation to

4860
03:13:17.279 --> 03:13:20.279
this. So, just an update about that.

4861
03:13:20.640 --> 03:13:23.096
Sorry, can I get a page number?

4862
03:13:23.120 --> 03:13:26.120
So, 191 free stroke 35 ci.

4863
03:13:27.279 --> 03:13:27.816
Sorry,

4864
03:13:27.840 --> 03:13:30.295
this is the detached studios 191 stroke

4865
03:13:30.319 --> 03:13:30.856
25.

4866
03:13:30.880 --> 03:13:32.536
Yeah, we had trouble finding that one

4867
03:13:32.560 --> 03:13:35.560
today.

4868
03:13:37.200 --> 03:13:38.375
Just so you're aware.

4869
03:13:38.399 --> 03:13:41.399
Yes. page 941.

4870
03:13:56.800 --> 03:13:58.215
Um, Council Rose, I'm going to assume

4871
03:13:58.239 --> 03:13:59.976
that it's just been accidentally

4872
03:14:00.000 --> 03:14:02.536
completed there.

4873
03:14:02.560 --> 03:14:05.096
Yes. So, that that workshop's still to

4874
03:14:05.120 --> 03:14:06.536
happen. Um

4875
03:14:06.560 --> 03:14:09.560
sorry the workshop issue is obviously um

4876
03:14:09.840 --> 03:14:11.496
for council's awareness with the new

4877
03:14:11.520 --> 03:14:13.415
code of meeting practice rules make

4878
03:14:13.439 --> 03:14:16.295
makes it difficult about when we can and

4879
03:14:16.319 --> 03:14:17.335
can't workshop.

4880
03:14:17.359 --> 03:14:17.736
Okay.

4881
03:14:17.760 --> 03:14:19.255
Yeah.

4882
03:14:19.279 --> 03:14:20.696
So we just need to be careful in terms

4883
03:14:20.720 --> 03:14:21.816
of how we frame that because that's

4884
03:14:21.840 --> 03:14:23.736
about a workshop about a policy that

4885
03:14:23.760 --> 03:14:25.576
would then come before council which

4886
03:14:25.600 --> 03:14:27.255
technically speaking under the new code

4887
03:14:27.279 --> 03:14:29.335
is prohibited.

4888
03:14:29.359 --> 03:14:31.976
Okay. What is it prohibited if we open

4889
03:14:32.000 --> 03:14:34.696
the doors so the public can come in? 

4890
03:14:34.720 --> 03:14:36.936
yes, because it's considered a

4891
03:14:36.960 --> 03:14:39.960
premeating briefing.

4892
03:14:40.640 --> 03:14:42.776
Um

4893
03:14:42.800 --> 03:14:45.800
I'm 235 stroke 25 down if you can find

4894
03:14:47.359 --> 03:14:50.359
that in this labyrinth of paper pages.

4895
03:14:50.479 --> 03:14:53.255
9:43

4896
03:14:53.279 --> 03:14:55.896
9:33 this is the complian systems and

4897
03:14:55.920 --> 03:14:58.856
reporting a report was due in December

4898
03:14:58.880 --> 03:15:01.880
and but um this hasn't been provided at

4899
03:15:03.439 --> 03:15:05.656
this stage I suppose it's significant

4900
03:15:05.680 --> 03:15:08.680
madame deputy mayor because we're

4901
03:15:08.880 --> 03:15:10.856
looking at budgets and the issue about

4902
03:15:10.880 --> 03:15:13.880
compliance is one of the key issues so

4903
03:15:13.920 --> 03:15:15.415
um I just was going to check on what

4904
03:15:15.439 --> 03:15:17.496
will happen in relation to that

4905
03:15:17.520 --> 03:15:19.016
page 943

4906
03:15:19.040 --> 03:15:21.656
I just sorry I I felt like councilors

4907
03:15:21.680 --> 03:15:23.576
did. Sorry, I'm just going to I'll have

4908
03:15:23.600 --> 03:15:24.776
to take this one on notice. I thought

4909
03:15:24.800 --> 03:15:27.176
there was a report that reported back on

4910
03:15:27.200 --> 03:15:30.200
compliance um issues and we had numbers

4911
03:15:30.640 --> 03:15:32.696
on it. I just can't recall the format

4912
03:15:32.720 --> 03:15:35.415
that it was in. So, I'll have to take

4913
03:15:35.439 --> 03:15:36.936
that one on notice cuz I thought there

4914
03:15:36.960 --> 03:15:38.455
was something that was table, but I

4915
03:15:38.479 --> 03:15:41.479
could be wrong. Um next next one is item

4916
03:15:43.279 --> 03:15:46.279
234 stroke 25

4917
03:15:46.720 --> 03:15:49.720
library outreach 944. Um this is due for

4918
03:15:51.200 --> 03:15:53.896
completed completion in March but I

4919
03:15:53.920 --> 03:15:55.896
think councelor Elliot pointed out Mr.

4920
03:15:55.920 --> 03:15:57.976
We gave a presentation said that we make

4921
03:15:58.000 --> 03:16:01.000
a lot of money. Um I don't think that he

4922
03:16:01.760 --> 03:16:04.696
has come back with any defined project

4923
03:16:04.720 --> 03:16:06.776
but it might be just helpful to

4924
03:16:06.800 --> 03:16:08.455
understand if this is going to be

4925
03:16:08.479 --> 03:16:10.536
progressed. Does the council have any

4926
03:16:10.560 --> 03:16:13.176
role or is it all relying on external

4927
03:16:13.200 --> 03:16:14.056
input?

4928
03:16:14.080 --> 03:16:15.736
With all due respect councelor Rose the

4929
03:16:15.760 --> 03:16:18.375
staff will need to  take action

4930
03:16:18.399 --> 03:16:20.696
according to resolutions of council. So

4931
03:16:20.720 --> 03:16:23.096
if that's the direction we would like um

4932
03:16:23.120 --> 03:16:24.616
staff to take then that needs to be a

4933
03:16:24.640 --> 03:16:25.656
notice of motion.

4934
03:16:25.680 --> 03:16:28.680
Right. Thank you. Um number 57 stroke 25

4935
03:16:30.479 --> 03:16:33.479
the Gindervine landfill operation.

4936
03:16:35.439 --> 03:16:36.616
What page council?

4937
03:16:36.640 --> 03:16:37.656
Sorry, which one was that?

4938
03:16:37.680 --> 03:16:40.680
Gindervine landfill.

4939
03:16:41.680 --> 03:16:43.415
So the notes there say that a 5th of

4940
03:16:43.439 --> 03:16:46.295
January report was issued to council. I

4941
03:16:46.319 --> 03:16:47.656
couldn't find that report. It may have

4942
03:16:47.680 --> 03:16:50.680
been may just slip my um attention. But

4943
03:16:51.600 --> 03:16:54.375
um the project requires funding to

4944
03:16:54.399 --> 03:16:57.096
commence and there's also going to be

4945
03:16:57.120 --> 03:16:59.816
some meetings meeting with the mayor and

4946
03:16:59.840 --> 03:17:02.840
the local member um

4947
03:17:03.840 --> 03:17:06.696
because regard through through you to

4948
03:17:06.720 --> 03:17:08.856
the project officer you'll be on top of

4949
03:17:08.880 --> 03:17:10.295
this about what's happening with that

4950
03:17:10.319 --> 03:17:12.295
particular issue.

4951
03:17:12.319 --> 03:17:14.375
Yeah. Sorry. Can I make a comment? There

4952
03:17:14.399 --> 03:17:15.976
was a report to council but I'll throw

4953
03:17:16.000 --> 03:17:17.576
it over to our manager of corporate

4954
03:17:17.600 --> 03:17:20.136
projects. So  future chair yet there

4955
03:17:20.160 --> 03:17:23.016
was a report and we recommended the $2.7

4956
03:17:23.040 --> 03:17:25.096
million solution to move forward for the

4957
03:17:25.120 --> 03:17:28.120
ginder landfill.  we have written to

4958
03:17:28.560 --> 03:17:29.976
both state and federal members and we're

4959
03:17:30.000 --> 03:17:31.255
yet to hear back from them.

4960
03:17:31.279 --> 03:17:31.896
Right.

4961
03:17:31.920 --> 03:17:34.920
Um I can't comment on the members

4962
03:17:35.600 --> 03:17:37.976
meeting with members.

4963
03:17:38.000 --> 03:17:41.000
Right. So there's a solution solution.

4964
03:17:41.279 --> 03:17:44.279
There's a money members know and we just

4965
03:17:44.640 --> 03:17:46.136
went in to see what happens next.

4966
03:17:46.160 --> 03:17:46.856
Yes.

4967
03:17:46.880 --> 03:17:48.856
Thank you. I think that just needed to

4968
03:17:48.880 --> 03:17:51.176
be put in the notes. I'll make sure it's

4969
03:17:51.200 --> 03:17:51.896
in there.

4970
03:17:51.920 --> 03:17:54.920
Um 261 stroke 24.

4971
03:17:56.080 --> 03:17:57.976
Um

4972
03:17:58.000 --> 03:17:59.496
this is about council committees. What

4973
03:17:59.520 --> 03:18:01.096
page is that? Councelor Elliot.

4974
03:18:01.120 --> 03:18:03.816
 961.

4975
03:18:03.840 --> 03:18:05.816
Councelor Elliot um picked this up with

4976
03:18:05.840 --> 03:18:08.840
his eagle eyes because the  there's no

4977
03:18:09.200 --> 03:18:12.200
counselor appointed to the Kuma liquor

4978
03:18:12.479 --> 03:18:15.176
accord. Those are all the people that

4979
03:18:15.200 --> 03:18:17.176
have been appointed. So no one's been

4980
03:18:17.200 --> 03:18:18.696
appointed to that role.

4981
03:18:18.720 --> 03:18:20.136
That was something that was brought up

4982
03:18:20.160 --> 03:18:23.160
at the Ginderbine liquor record in May

4983
03:18:23.359 --> 03:18:25.016
and they said they had approached

4984
03:18:25.040 --> 03:18:27.816
council and hadn't heard anything but

4985
03:18:27.840 --> 03:18:29.976
apparently Kuma have their own liquor

4986
03:18:30.000 --> 03:18:33.000
accord separate from the genderine one.

4987
03:18:33.120 --> 03:18:35.016
So I was just going to propose that we

4988
03:18:35.040 --> 03:18:37.415
we nominate councelor Elliot for the

4989
03:18:37.439 --> 03:18:40.439
Kuma liquor record committee.

4990
03:18:41.200 --> 03:18:43.016
I'll second that.

4991
03:18:43.040 --> 03:18:44.616
What what did they do? Well, let's find

4992
03:18:44.640 --> 03:18:46.936
out if there is one and if they require

4993
03:18:46.960 --> 03:18:49.496
a counselor like council.

4994
03:18:49.520 --> 03:18:52.520
Well, they asked for one deputy.

4995
03:18:53.279 --> 03:18:55.016
No, no. Well, they just said they'd

4996
03:18:55.040 --> 03:18:58.040
written to um to the council and said

4997
03:18:58.560 --> 03:19:01.560
they had a board and they don't want

4998
03:19:01.600 --> 03:19:04.536
they needed somebody from council to be

4999
03:19:04.560 --> 03:19:06.455
appointed.

5000
03:19:06.479 --> 03:19:08.136
Did I know about it

5001
03:19:08.160 --> 03:19:09.816
and

5002
03:19:09.840 --> 03:19:12.840
and also what's all record? No idea.

5003
03:19:14.160 --> 03:19:14.536
Yeah,

5004
03:19:14.560 --> 03:19:16.056
not me too.

5005
03:19:16.080 --> 03:19:19.080
Um what it is is all the liquor

5006
03:19:19.680 --> 03:19:21.656
distribution people like 

5007
03:19:21.680 --> 03:19:23.976
supermarkets, hotels,

5008
03:19:24.000 --> 03:19:25.656
um etc.

5009
03:19:25.680 --> 03:19:28.680
All be usually once a year just to talk

5010
03:19:29.680 --> 03:19:32.680
about common issues in  going through

5011
03:19:33.279 --> 03:19:36.279
the regula the liquor regulations and

5012
03:19:36.479 --> 03:19:38.536
they usually meet with the police and

5013
03:19:38.560 --> 03:19:40.295
see how previous

5014
03:19:40.319 --> 03:19:42.215
years have been going and what they can

5015
03:19:42.239 --> 03:19:45.239
do better. It it's um always done before

5016
03:19:45.680 --> 03:19:47.736
the ski season in genderbine. I don't

5017
03:19:47.760 --> 03:19:50.760
know when a meeting counc

5018
03:19:51.520 --> 03:19:54.520
 in that resolution  um we were

5019
03:19:55.279 --> 03:19:57.656
supposed to review all of our committees

5020
03:19:57.680 --> 03:19:58.936
still has not been done.

5021
03:19:58.960 --> 03:20:00.375
That's right. That's a very high

5022
03:20:00.399 --> 03:20:01.896
priority outstanding resolution. You're

5023
03:20:01.920 --> 03:20:02.215
right.

5024
03:20:02.239 --> 03:20:03.976
Which is why a lot of these things have

5025
03:20:04.000 --> 03:20:05.096
been actioned because we haven't

5026
03:20:05.120 --> 03:20:06.536
reviewed the committees.

5027
03:20:06.560 --> 03:20:08.215
Councelor Rose, any further questions

5028
03:20:08.239 --> 03:20:11.239
on Sorry, Cray.  we're wondering our

5029
03:20:13.520 --> 03:20:16.520
sister city in Japan council road um

5030
03:20:18.319 --> 03:20:21.319
again 961 council rose and I thought

5031
03:20:22.720 --> 03:20:24.375
we should go skiing every year in

5032
03:20:24.399 --> 03:20:26.856
January to keep up the contact with

5033
03:20:26.880 --> 03:20:28.295
seems to be in there. Do we have a

5034
03:20:28.319 --> 03:20:29.576
sister or not?

5035
03:20:29.600 --> 03:20:32.215
We do with a yeah

5036
03:20:32.239 --> 03:20:35.016
not on the not not

5037
03:20:35.040 --> 03:20:37.255
since the amalgamated council.

5038
03:20:37.279 --> 03:20:40.279
Sorry. Sorry. Um, madam chair that's

5039
03:20:40.399 --> 03:20:40.856
one.

5040
03:20:40.880 --> 03:20:42.856
Yeah, I was going to say we as a council

5041
03:20:42.880 --> 03:20:45.880
we do have registrations with um DEFAT

5042
03:20:46.399 --> 03:20:48.616
around sister cities. So they came out

5043
03:20:48.640 --> 03:20:50.215
to us. I believe that there's two sister

5044
03:20:50.239 --> 03:20:52.616
cities.  but and that's on their

5045
03:20:52.640 --> 03:20:55.415
national theat register. So that's what

5046
03:20:55.439 --> 03:20:57.415
they told me.

5047
03:20:57.439 --> 03:20:59.335
So DEFAT decides who our sister

5048
03:20:59.359 --> 03:21:01.496
No, no, no. This is from what um they've

5049
03:21:01.520 --> 03:21:04.215
done analysis of all the councils across

5050
03:21:04.239 --> 03:21:06.696
Australia in terms of what has been on

5051
03:21:06.720 --> 03:21:08.455
information and they came back to us and

5052
03:21:08.479 --> 03:21:10.616
said that we apparently have somewhere

5053
03:21:10.640 --> 03:21:12.375
in the past declared that we've got two

5054
03:21:12.399 --> 03:21:14.455
I think it was two cities.

5055
03:21:14.479 --> 03:21:15.016
Yeah.

5056
03:21:15.040 --> 03:21:16.536
Bomba never had I don't know where the

5057
03:21:16.560 --> 03:21:18.375
snowy fo was at

5058
03:21:18.399 --> 03:21:19.736
in the region. Yeah,

5059
03:21:19.760 --> 03:21:21.816
but how you going to have a sister city

5060
03:21:21.840 --> 03:21:23.576
when you got which which town's going to

5061
03:21:23.600 --> 03:21:26.600
be? Is it going Kind Bomba? Who's going?

5062
03:21:26.720 --> 03:21:29.720
Come on. Just we do a lot of gray area.

5063
03:21:30.319 --> 03:21:31.736
Leave that alone.

5064
03:21:31.760 --> 03:21:33.976
I'm sorry you brought up issue. Any

5065
03:21:34.000 --> 03:21:34.616
other questions?

5066
03:21:34.640 --> 03:21:36.375
Well, it's more it's in there. Do we

5067
03:21:36.399 --> 03:21:38.215
take it out or are we keeping our

5068
03:21:38.239 --> 03:21:41.176
we we can we can look at I don't know a

5069
03:21:41.200 --> 03:21:43.576
notice of motion in the future of of um

5070
03:21:43.600 --> 03:21:45.016
dissolving our sister, you know,

5071
03:21:45.040 --> 03:21:46.455
participation in the sister city

5072
03:21:46.479 --> 03:21:47.496
program. That's something that could be

5073
03:21:47.520 --> 03:21:49.576
considered but we can't around the table

5074
03:21:49.600 --> 03:21:51.096
just sort of say ah forget it we won't

5075
03:21:51.120 --> 03:21:52.455
do it on gone that's that's a

5076
03:21:52.479 --> 03:21:55.176
notation has a sister city they'll be

5077
03:21:55.200 --> 03:21:58.200
the represent

5078
03:21:58.239 --> 03:22:01.239
regional council of bombara there you go

5079
03:22:09.520 --> 03:22:11.736
which city in our region

5080
03:22:11.760 --> 03:22:13.415
are we referring to because we have

5081
03:22:13.439 --> 03:22:15.736
towns and villages

5082
03:22:15.760 --> 03:22:18.215
sister city is probably a city yet you

5083
03:22:18.239 --> 03:22:20.136
know loose term it's it's kuma and

5084
03:22:20.160 --> 03:22:22.536
yamanda that have the relationship

5085
03:22:22.560 --> 03:22:25.560
you go bomb or m

5086
03:22:27.040 --> 03:22:27.415
there you go

5087
03:22:27.439 --> 03:22:30.439
on page 963 on page 963 the not say

5088
03:22:31.359 --> 03:22:33.576
waiting for clarity from OG around when

5089
03:22:33.600 --> 03:22:36.136
workshops can be held in the format they

5090
03:22:36.160 --> 03:22:38.375
need to be in I was just a bit confused

5091
03:22:38.399 --> 03:22:39.576
about that

5092
03:22:39.600 --> 03:22:42.056
think we were told we can't do it

5093
03:22:42.080 --> 03:22:43.736
yeah

5094
03:22:43.760 --> 03:22:45.496
so I think that's just sorry three you

5095
03:22:45.520 --> 03:22:46.536
madam

5096
03:22:46.560 --> 03:22:48.696
um chair. Yes, that's just around the

5097
03:22:48.720 --> 03:22:50.696
fact that the workshop situation is

5098
03:22:50.720 --> 03:22:52.616
difficult because previous council

5099
03:22:52.640 --> 03:22:54.455
resolutions that said come back to

5100
03:22:54.479 --> 03:22:57.016
council with the resol  with a like

5101
03:22:57.040 --> 03:22:58.856
for example council form a working party

5102
03:22:58.880 --> 03:23:01.016
with counselors that is a workshop

5103
03:23:01.040 --> 03:23:02.936
essentially because when you have the

5104
03:23:02.960 --> 03:23:04.455
workshop and then you table the report

5105
03:23:04.479 --> 03:23:07.176
at a later date that's what the minister

5106
03:23:07.200 --> 03:23:09.896
has somewhat prohibited through this new

5107
03:23:09.920 --> 03:23:12.920
code of meeting practice. Okay. So

5108
03:23:13.359 --> 03:23:15.656
I can ask through you to the CEO. Is

5109
03:23:15.680 --> 03:23:18.215
there is it is the clarity about what we

5110
03:23:18.239 --> 03:23:19.976
can and can't do at this stage in terms

5111
03:23:20.000 --> 03:23:23.000
of workshops or workshops equivalent?

5112
03:23:24.880 --> 03:23:27.880
 through you madam chair I would say

5113
03:23:27.920 --> 03:23:30.920
it's very gray

5114
03:23:31.359 --> 03:23:33.896
and we we haven't got the supplementary

5115
03:23:33.920 --> 03:23:35.976
material that goes with the code of

5116
03:23:36.000 --> 03:23:37.896
meeting practice that tells us how and

5117
03:23:37.920 --> 03:23:40.616
why and what as well have we?  there

5118
03:23:40.640 --> 03:23:43.576
is a frequently asked questions guide on

5119
03:23:43.600 --> 03:23:45.096
the office of local government's website

5120
03:23:45.120 --> 03:23:45.976
around workshops.

5121
03:23:46.000 --> 03:23:49.000
Right. Okay. Um thank you. Um just a

5122
03:23:50.080 --> 03:23:53.080
couple more things on item 165 stroke 23

5123
03:23:54.560 --> 03:23:57.255
page 997.

5124
03:23:57.279 --> 03:23:59.976
Um it says there's no feedback from the

5125
03:24:00.000 --> 03:24:01.656
resident.

5126
03:24:01.680 --> 03:24:04.536
Um so it seems as though there on

5127
03:24:04.560 --> 03:24:06.696
outstanding issues in relation to this

5128
03:24:06.720 --> 03:24:09.576
particular item. Have those been solved

5129
03:24:09.600 --> 03:24:12.600
now or is this likely to to hold up this

5130
03:24:13.040 --> 03:24:15.976
issue into the foreseeable future?

5131
03:24:16.000 --> 03:24:19.000
Oh 997 I think it's referring to a death

5132
03:24:20.080 --> 03:24:20.696
on the

5133
03:24:20.720 --> 03:24:23.720
adjustments. Yeah.

5134
03:24:24.479 --> 03:24:26.776
Um do you madam chair? I'll have to take

5135
03:24:26.800 --> 03:24:27.976
that one on notice.

5136
03:24:28.000 --> 03:24:30.056
You and just the final one is 56 stroke

5137
03:24:30.080 --> 03:24:33.080
22 the bombardo show ground. Um

5138
03:24:33.279 --> 03:24:35.816
basically it's on hold. I think council

5139
03:24:35.840 --> 03:24:37.736
and I counted there've been 60 updates

5140
03:24:37.760 --> 03:24:40.536
over four years and it looks like this

5141
03:24:40.560 --> 03:24:43.496
is unresolvable. So can we just sh this

5142
03:24:43.520 --> 03:24:45.496
project and take it off the books

5143
03:24:45.520 --> 03:24:46.536
councelor Stewart

5144
03:24:46.560 --> 03:24:47.736
what project

5145
03:24:47.760 --> 03:24:49.736
this is the bomba showground all the

5146
03:24:49.760 --> 03:24:51.896
story about

5147
03:24:51.920 --> 03:24:54.920
getting this a deceased estate I think

5148
03:24:56.399 --> 03:24:57.656
I think I know a little bit I don't know

5149
03:24:57.680 --> 03:24:59.096
a lot about it but I know a little bit

5150
03:24:59.120 --> 03:25:00.215
about it. Yeah, there's um

5151
03:25:00.239 --> 03:25:02.776
there's one lot that

5152
03:25:02.800 --> 03:25:05.176
stops it all being completed in

5153
03:25:05.200 --> 03:25:06.856
Look, I I don't know. I'd have to ask

5154
03:25:06.880 --> 03:25:08.295
the management committee. I don't I

5155
03:25:08.319 --> 03:25:10.776
couldn't give you a lot of detail, but I

5156
03:25:10.800 --> 03:25:13.176
have heard of some issue up there over I

5157
03:25:13.200 --> 03:25:14.776
know who it is, but I have not known,

5158
03:25:14.800 --> 03:25:15.976
but um yeah,

5159
03:25:16.000 --> 03:25:17.816
councelor Rose, would you like to add an

5160
03:25:17.840 --> 03:25:19.976
an amendment to this to to request that

5161
03:25:20.000 --> 03:25:22.215
council contact the shground management

5162
03:25:22.239 --> 03:25:22.536
committee?

5163
03:25:22.560 --> 03:25:24.776
Yeah. Yeah. Just find out what's going

5164
03:25:24.800 --> 03:25:26.616
on. I can't

5165
03:25:26.640 --> 03:25:28.696
Yes. Is it is it resolvable or should we

5166
03:25:28.720 --> 03:25:30.136
get on

5167
03:25:30.160 --> 03:25:33.160
because you know 60 60 updates over the

5168
03:25:33.359 --> 03:25:35.096
period of almost four years it looks

5169
03:25:35.120 --> 03:25:36.616
like it might be

5170
03:25:36.640 --> 03:25:39.640
not um resolvable. So, so the the

5171
03:25:39.680 --> 03:25:42.056
wording company words into your mouth is

5172
03:25:42.080 --> 03:25:45.080
to   contact the it's the bombala

5173
03:25:46.880 --> 03:25:49.880
show. Yeah. Yeah. Show ground management

5174
03:25:49.920 --> 03:25:51.656
committee committee. They'll be able to

5175
03:25:51.680 --> 03:25:52.616
get you on the right

5176
03:25:52.640 --> 03:25:55.640
to request clarification in relation to

5177
03:25:55.920 --> 03:25:57.496
resolution

5178
03:25:57.520 --> 03:26:00.520
56-22.

5179
03:26:00.560 --> 03:26:02.536
And there is one more page

5180
03:26:02.560 --> 03:26:04.536
just a moment.

5181
03:26:04.560 --> 03:26:06.455
Um oh so both council rose and Elliot

5182
03:26:06.479 --> 03:26:09.479
you happy with that? One more to Oh,

5183
03:26:09.760 --> 03:26:12.215
sorry. Yes.

5184
03:26:12.239 --> 03:26:13.176
One more question.

5185
03:26:13.200 --> 03:26:15.896
, page 964

5186
03:26:15.920 --> 03:26:18.056
and it comes up a bit. Delegate

5187
03:26:18.080 --> 03:26:20.776
disadvantaged housing

5188
03:26:20.800 --> 03:26:22.616
and

5189
03:26:22.640 --> 03:26:25.640
it it just seems to be ongoing and I

5190
03:26:25.680 --> 03:26:27.176
think it's a bit of an issue down there,

5191
03:26:27.200 --> 03:26:30.200
but we keep deferring it

5192
03:26:30.640 --> 03:26:33.255
and the whole thing has been deferred

5193
03:26:33.279 --> 03:26:34.776
since

5194
03:26:34.800 --> 03:26:36.136
we have an update on that

5195
03:26:36.160 --> 03:26:38.696
20 24. Yeah, that night's

5196
03:26:38.720 --> 03:26:39.576
still out.

5197
03:26:39.600 --> 03:26:41.496
When we were down there at delegate,

5198
03:26:41.520 --> 03:26:44.056
they brought it up.

5199
03:26:44.080 --> 03:26:47.080
Yeah. Um, madam ch that one on notice in

5200
03:26:47.279 --> 03:26:49.176
terms of the plan of attack to bring

5201
03:26:49.200 --> 03:26:51.736
back to council.

5202
03:26:51.760 --> 03:26:53.176
I thought there had to be a community

5203
03:26:53.200 --> 03:26:55.976
meeting down there. Is that your

5204
03:26:56.000 --> 03:26:58.936
Well, I think so. But it's just the

5205
03:26:58.960 --> 03:27:00.616
community service don't do any

5206
03:27:00.640 --> 03:27:03.096
management on it. And so it's just

5207
03:27:03.120 --> 03:27:05.096
there's one or two units down there not

5208
03:27:05.120 --> 03:27:07.016
they haven't been used for one unit

5209
03:27:07.040 --> 03:27:09.896
hasn't been used but

5210
03:27:09.920 --> 03:27:11.896
two

5211
03:27:11.920 --> 03:27:13.176
other questions in relation to the

5212
03:27:13.200 --> 03:27:14.295
resolution action

5213
03:27:14.319 --> 03:27:15.576
wanted to stop.

5214
03:27:15.600 --> 03:27:17.176
Um in that case do we have  so

5215
03:27:17.200 --> 03:27:18.536
councelor Rose have you spoken for your

5216
03:27:18.560 --> 03:27:20.215
motion or just asked questions not speak

5217
03:27:20.239 --> 03:27:21.176
for it

5218
03:27:21.200 --> 03:27:22.856
then that's the end of my questions. I

5219
03:27:22.880 --> 03:27:25.880
just commend the motion. Does anybody

5220
03:27:26.560 --> 03:27:27.896
want to speak against the motion on the

5221
03:27:27.920 --> 03:27:29.656
board?

5222
03:27:29.680 --> 03:27:31.255
, sorry, councelor Ros, you don't get

5223
03:27:31.279 --> 03:27:33.496
a motion to reply. , all those in

5224
03:27:33.520 --> 03:27:35.656
favor?

5225
03:27:35.680 --> 03:27:38.536
You councelor Summons, councelor

5226
03:27:38.560 --> 03:27:40.056
Higgins, councelor Stewart, councelor

5227
03:27:40.080 --> 03:27:41.976
Rose, councelor Rooney, councelor Davis,

5228
03:27:42.000 --> 03:27:43.656
councelor Elliot, councelor Hopkins,

5229
03:27:43.680 --> 03:27:46.375
those against, councelor Paul again.

5230
03:27:46.399 --> 03:27:48.375
Yes, sorry I couldn't read it.

5231
03:27:48.399 --> 03:27:50.136
My apologies. So that's unanimous. Thank

5232
03:27:50.160 --> 03:27:51.576
you.

5233
03:27:51.600 --> 03:27:53.896
Moving on to item

5234
03:27:53.920 --> 03:27:56.295
 10.1 reports of committees. So minute

5235
03:27:56.319 --> 03:27:58.056
minutes from the management and advisory

5236
03:27:58.080 --> 03:28:00.455
committees. Councelor Davis moving

5237
03:28:00.479 --> 03:28:02.776
upwards recommendation.  do we have a

5238
03:28:02.800 --> 03:28:04.776
seconder?

5239
03:28:04.800 --> 03:28:06.776
Councelor Rudy. Councelor Davis you have

5240
03:28:06.800 --> 03:28:07.656
five minutes.

5241
03:28:07.680 --> 03:28:10.136
 I have a question first. Oh sorry. We

5242
03:28:10.160 --> 03:28:12.375
have three reports from management

5243
03:28:12.399 --> 03:28:14.375
committees and I'm quite sure that we

5244
03:28:14.399 --> 03:28:16.776
have many more management committees

5245
03:28:16.800 --> 03:28:19.800
across our council area

5246
03:28:20.640 --> 03:28:23.176
but it's we just seem to have a

5247
03:28:23.200 --> 03:28:25.976
disconnect. So we have regular reports

5248
03:28:26.000 --> 03:28:29.000
from Fontala Mikgo tennis courts and

5249
03:28:30.000 --> 03:28:33.000
hall. Um Murala had put in a report this

5250
03:28:33.840 --> 03:28:36.840
time. However, what happens to the show

5251
03:28:37.120 --> 03:28:40.120
committees, the  Liberty Bell Hall,

5252
03:28:40.880 --> 03:28:43.880
the Delgetti Hall,  etc. They're all

5253
03:28:46.479 --> 03:28:49.176
got community involvement. And what is

5254
03:28:49.200 --> 03:28:51.096
the process? And I think that's probably

5255
03:28:51.120 --> 03:28:52.936
one of our issues is we have this

5256
03:28:52.960 --> 03:28:55.736
disconnect with what the community are

5257
03:28:55.760 --> 03:28:58.455
doing with some of our asset assets and

5258
03:28:58.479 --> 03:29:01.479
the reports that we get. And I have

5259
03:29:01.920 --> 03:29:04.696
previously put minutes to back to

5260
03:29:04.720 --> 03:29:07.176
council from the Liberty B showground

5261
03:29:07.200 --> 03:29:09.415
for example going to the east. I don't

5262
03:29:09.439 --> 03:29:12.136
even know where they go but they don't

5263
03:29:12.160 --> 03:29:15.096
come into this  into the council

5264
03:29:15.120 --> 03:29:18.120
meeting. So, can we have a clear

5265
03:29:19.040 --> 03:29:22.040
understanding of what it is that our

5266
03:29:23.040 --> 03:29:26.040
community are actually managing? How do

5267
03:29:26.239 --> 03:29:28.056
some groups actually get a report to

5268
03:29:28.080 --> 03:29:31.080
council and others don't? And have some

5269
03:29:31.120 --> 03:29:33.335
equity around the process because I just

5270
03:29:33.359 --> 03:29:36.215
think that  it's actually fantastic

5271
03:29:36.239 --> 03:29:38.616
what our management committees do. Um,

5272
03:29:38.640 --> 03:29:40.696
and there are so many volunteers looking

5273
03:29:40.720 --> 03:29:42.856
after our assets.

5274
03:29:42.880 --> 03:29:44.696
However, we don't have a good

5275
03:29:44.720 --> 03:29:46.536
understanding of what those volunteers

5276
03:29:46.560 --> 03:29:49.096
are actually doing, the time, the

5277
03:29:49.120 --> 03:29:51.255
effort, and the how they're actually

5278
03:29:51.279 --> 03:29:53.736
spending  money to maintain our

5279
03:29:53.760 --> 03:29:55.736
assets. That would be fantastic.

5280
03:29:55.760 --> 03:29:56.776
Davis, you're actually absolutely

5281
03:29:56.800 --> 03:29:57.976
correct. And would you like to include

5282
03:29:58.000 --> 03:29:59.896
that in the um in the motion that we're

5283
03:29:59.920 --> 03:30:01.415
debating today? Because I think the

5284
03:30:01.439 --> 03:30:03.896
major problem is that there is no actual

5285
03:30:03.920 --> 03:30:06.375
um instruction manual or manual for the

5286
03:30:06.399 --> 03:30:08.776
members of management and advis advisory

5287
03:30:08.800 --> 03:30:09.896
committees. they don't actually know

5288
03:30:09.920 --> 03:30:11.415
what they're supposed to do and what the

5289
03:30:11.439 --> 03:30:13.576
expectations are. So would you like to

5290
03:30:13.600 --> 03:30:16.600
add another part to say that um along

5291
03:30:17.200 --> 03:30:20.200
those lines that this the the management

5292
03:30:20.560 --> 03:30:23.560
and advisory committee um that council

5293
03:30:24.560 --> 03:30:27.560
receive a what are the management and

5294
03:30:28.399 --> 03:30:30.136
revis and advisory committees that are

5295
03:30:30.160 --> 03:30:31.896
happening across our region?

5296
03:30:31.920 --> 03:30:33.255
We should know that.

5297
03:30:33.279 --> 03:30:34.936
Well, we don't know that.

5298
03:30:34.960 --> 03:30:36.295
It's on the website

5299
03:30:36.319 --> 03:30:37.096
is it?

5300
03:30:37.120 --> 03:30:38.616
No, I don't. Well, I

5301
03:30:38.640 --> 03:30:40.455
we we don't have a good understanding of

5302
03:30:40.479 --> 03:30:42.056
that. That that is not a good

5303
03:30:42.080 --> 03:30:44.776
understanding. And secondly,

5304
03:30:44.800 --> 03:30:47.800
um  how are those  how what are our

5305
03:30:48.960 --> 03:30:51.096
expectations in regard to their

5306
03:30:51.120 --> 03:30:53.255
reporting back to council and those

5307
03:30:53.279 --> 03:30:55.335
reports coming into a council meeting so

5308
03:30:55.359 --> 03:30:58.359
that it's very transparent.

5309
03:30:59.120 --> 03:31:02.120
 C just council Rooney happy with that

5310
03:31:04.319 --> 03:31:07.319
council Williamson question. I I was

5311
03:31:08.160 --> 03:31:10.375
just going to make a suggestion. So, I

5312
03:31:10.399 --> 03:31:13.399
like that idea. Um I'm just wondering

5313
03:31:14.560 --> 03:31:17.255
um what I think we need is effectively a

5314
03:31:17.279 --> 03:31:19.736
list of these committees.

5315
03:31:19.760 --> 03:31:22.760
Um a list  you know an understanding

5316
03:31:23.439 --> 03:31:26.439
of their their requirement to report

5317
03:31:27.200 --> 03:31:29.816
back to council. So, when should we be

5318
03:31:29.840 --> 03:31:32.840
expecting minutes to be provided to us?

5319
03:31:33.920 --> 03:31:35.896
and and then we could put people in and

5320
03:31:35.920 --> 03:31:37.976
see whether they're actually doing that

5321
03:31:38.000 --> 03:31:41.000
cuz right now it seems like we get

5322
03:31:41.439 --> 03:31:44.439
minutes from some of them occasionally

5323
03:31:44.479 --> 03:31:47.479
um you know what what's our expectation

5324
03:31:47.600 --> 03:31:50.600
in terms of how they're operating, what

5325
03:31:51.279 --> 03:31:53.415
they're reporting back, when they should

5326
03:31:53.439 --> 03:31:56.439
report back. Um, now it may mean once we

5327
03:31:56.960 --> 03:31:59.096
look at that that we need to go and look

5328
03:31:59.120 --> 03:32:01.016
at the terms of reference to make them

5329
03:32:01.040 --> 03:32:04.040
consistent and correct because I'm sure

5330
03:32:04.319 --> 03:32:07.319
they're not. Um but perhaps the if the

5331
03:32:08.399 --> 03:32:10.056
report

5332
03:32:10.080 --> 03:32:12.536
would have that detail in it, but I'd

5333
03:32:12.560 --> 03:32:15.560
suggest moving forward the first page of

5334
03:32:15.920 --> 03:32:18.920
this report at each council meeting

5335
03:32:19.600 --> 03:32:22.455
includes that list and and that that

5336
03:32:22.479 --> 03:32:25.479
matrix.

5337
03:32:27.359 --> 03:32:29.736
Sorry. So So what are the changes you'd

5338
03:32:29.760 --> 03:32:32.375
like to make to the two?

5339
03:32:32.399 --> 03:32:35.096
I think we should amend

5340
03:32:35.120 --> 03:32:38.120
the council papers moving forward to

5341
03:32:38.239 --> 03:32:41.239
include that that very inventory of what

5342
03:32:41.359 --> 03:32:43.176
are the committees

5343
03:32:43.200 --> 03:32:45.816
who were we expecting to report at this

5344
03:32:45.840 --> 03:32:48.215
meeting and did we get a report from

5345
03:32:48.239 --> 03:32:50.455
them at this point

5346
03:32:50.479 --> 03:32:53.479
madam chief um I was on aren't you the

5347
03:32:55.920 --> 03:32:58.920
chair of the overall regional 355

5348
03:33:00.160 --> 03:33:00.776
committee

5349
03:33:00.800 --> 03:33:03.576
no I'm self-appointed but I'm not

5350
03:33:03.600 --> 03:33:06.295
well Sorry, but we s sent a

5351
03:33:06.319 --> 03:33:08.936
representative into that meeting

5352
03:33:08.960 --> 03:33:11.960
and he represents the 355 committee for

5353
03:33:12.080 --> 03:33:14.696
the gender bine and they often go, "Oh,

5354
03:33:14.720 --> 03:33:16.856
where do our minutes go?" All right,

5355
03:33:16.880 --> 03:33:17.656
don't worry about that.

5356
03:33:17.680 --> 03:33:18.936
They go to the government's team for

5357
03:33:18.960 --> 03:33:21.960
inclusion in the business papers.

5358
03:33:22.399 --> 03:33:23.415
Well, no. Yeah.

5359
03:33:23.439 --> 03:33:25.415
So, that that ginderbine one for

5360
03:33:25.439 --> 03:33:27.415
argument say that just meets when they

5361
03:33:27.439 --> 03:33:30.295
need things like the the ginder.

5362
03:33:30.319 --> 03:33:33.016
Yeah. But I think what you're saying is

5363
03:33:33.040 --> 03:33:34.696
there's an awful lot of these ones out

5364
03:33:34.720 --> 03:33:37.720
there in the community and they no one

5365
03:33:37.920 --> 03:33:39.335
is connecting with them.

5366
03:33:39.359 --> 03:33:40.616
Before we go into discussion or if you

5367
03:33:40.640 --> 03:33:41.576
want to go to committee of the whole

5368
03:33:41.600 --> 03:33:42.776
you're very welcome to but let's let the

5369
03:33:42.800 --> 03:33:44.536
CEO just clarify a couple of things.

5370
03:33:44.560 --> 03:33:46.696
 yeah do you madam chair we actually

5371
03:33:46.720 --> 03:33:48.776
have the list of all of our management

5372
03:33:48.800 --> 03:33:50.455
committees and advisory committees on

5373
03:33:50.479 --> 03:33:52.455
our website. So that is publicly

5374
03:33:52.479 --> 03:33:54.616
available information. But I do draw

5375
03:33:54.640 --> 03:33:57.335
attention back to the previous council

5376
03:33:57.359 --> 03:33:59.896
resolution of 261 of 24 around that

5377
03:33:59.920 --> 03:34:02.295
working party  with council and st and

5378
03:34:02.319 --> 03:34:03.896
staff to review committee structures.

5379
03:34:03.920 --> 03:34:06.536
Like I think that would that would

5380
03:34:06.560 --> 03:34:07.976
highlight in terms of how many

5381
03:34:08.000 --> 03:34:10.056
committees are there. We know that in

5382
03:34:10.080 --> 03:34:12.295
terms of what their structure is and

5383
03:34:12.319 --> 03:34:14.136
what it looks like moving forward. And I

5384
03:34:14.160 --> 03:34:15.736
would say that a subsequent action out

5385
03:34:15.760 --> 03:34:18.696
of that is a 355 committee manual.

5386
03:34:18.720 --> 03:34:20.776
there's plenty of them going around and

5387
03:34:20.800 --> 03:34:23.415
actually embedding one um for for our

5388
03:34:23.439 --> 03:34:25.176
purposes there. So, I'm just wondering

5389
03:34:25.200 --> 03:34:27.736
if this is a duplicate to that previous

5390
03:34:27.760 --> 03:34:29.415
council resolution.

5391
03:34:29.439 --> 03:34:31.415
I think the issue is we haven't acted on

5392
03:34:31.439 --> 03:34:32.136
that.

5393
03:34:32.160 --> 03:34:33.016
Yeah.

5394
03:34:33.040 --> 03:34:36.040
As frustrating as it is and so we have

5395
03:34:37.359 --> 03:34:39.415
community members who were part of these

5396
03:34:39.439 --> 03:34:41.415
committee who are no longer part of

5397
03:34:41.439 --> 03:34:42.856
these committees because we haven't put

5398
03:34:42.880 --> 03:34:45.415
out the ad to actually ask them to

5399
03:34:45.439 --> 03:34:47.096
nominate.

5400
03:34:47.120 --> 03:34:49.096
Part of it was to review and then put

5401
03:34:49.120 --> 03:34:52.120
out the whole  nomination process but

5402
03:34:52.560 --> 03:34:54.455
then we need to have very clear process.

5403
03:34:54.479 --> 03:34:57.479
So we have charters for our management

5404
03:34:57.760 --> 03:35:00.215
committees but when we're talking about

5405
03:35:00.239 --> 03:35:03.239
community committees like these 

5406
03:35:03.760 --> 03:35:05.415
groups

5407
03:35:05.439 --> 03:35:07.496
my understanding is we don't have a

5408
03:35:07.520 --> 03:35:09.016
clear process.

5409
03:35:09.040 --> 03:35:10.295
That's right. So that's what the manual

5410
03:35:10.319 --> 03:35:13.319
needs to be bring forward that motion.

5411
03:35:14.319 --> 03:35:17.319
Um if if may may I speak in terms of the

5412
03:35:18.160 --> 03:35:21.160
355 management advisory committees? I

5413
03:35:21.439 --> 03:35:23.415
recall that it was discussed in my

5414
03:35:23.439 --> 03:35:24.936
performance review in terms of needing

5415
03:35:24.960 --> 03:35:26.455
to prioritize that because it is a

5416
03:35:26.479 --> 03:35:28.696
significant piece of work and I do think

5417
03:35:28.720 --> 03:35:31.255
that there is um there's consultancies

5418
03:35:31.279 --> 03:35:32.696
out there that have done previous

5419
03:35:32.720 --> 03:35:35.096
reviews of 355 committees. I do think

5420
03:35:35.120 --> 03:35:38.120
that given how delayed this process has

5421
03:35:38.160 --> 03:35:39.976
been, there's probably value in terms of

5422
03:35:40.000 --> 03:35:42.936
investing in that in that space.

5423
03:35:42.960 --> 03:35:45.960
Can I just clarify?

5424
03:35:46.319 --> 03:35:49.319
Not every committee is a 355 committee.

5425
03:35:49.600 --> 03:35:51.496
They can be just committees.

5426
03:35:51.520 --> 03:35:53.176
Oh, councelor Davis, I'm not too sure

5427
03:35:53.200 --> 03:35:55.816
that any any committee that's reporting

5428
03:35:55.840 --> 03:35:58.215
into us here will be either a 355

5429
03:35:58.239 --> 03:36:00.536
management or 355 advisory committee. So

5430
03:36:00.560 --> 03:36:02.136
they are there may be many many

5431
03:36:02.160 --> 03:36:04.536
independent committees, but in this in

5432
03:36:04.560 --> 03:36:06.776
this reports of committee 10.1, they

5433
03:36:06.800 --> 03:36:09.255
need to be a 355 either an advisory or a

5434
03:36:09.279 --> 03:36:10.056
management.

5435
03:36:10.080 --> 03:36:12.936
Yes. And what I'm saying is we have

5436
03:36:12.960 --> 03:36:15.960
committees who are managing assets or 

5437
03:36:17.040 --> 03:36:19.496
meeting about our council assets such as

5438
03:36:19.520 --> 03:36:21.976
showground committees  sub hall

5439
03:36:22.000 --> 03:36:24.776
committees etc. who to the best of my

5440
03:36:24.800 --> 03:36:27.576
knowledge aren't exactly a 355

5441
03:36:27.600 --> 03:36:27.976
committee.

5442
03:36:28.000 --> 03:36:29.415
They're on our list.

5443
03:36:29.439 --> 03:36:31.415
That would be probably interesting to to

5444
03:36:31.439 --> 03:36:34.215
to see who they are because my

5445
03:36:34.239 --> 03:36:35.415
understanding is

5446
03:36:35.439 --> 03:36:37.176
they understand they are

5447
03:36:37.200 --> 03:36:38.696
that well that's that's different. They

5448
03:36:38.720 --> 03:36:40.136
may well be and they may not understand

5449
03:36:40.160 --> 03:36:41.816
they are which is where it comes back to

5450
03:36:41.840 --> 03:36:44.375
the point that we need a manual so that

5451
03:36:44.399 --> 03:36:46.295
every 355 committee management or

5452
03:36:46.319 --> 03:36:48.696
otherwise understands a that they're a

5453
03:36:48.720 --> 03:36:51.176
355 committee and b what their role is

5454
03:36:51.200 --> 03:36:52.776
and what their expectations are and what

5455
03:36:52.800 --> 03:36:55.800
their responsibilities are.

5456
03:36:55.840 --> 03:36:57.736
So based on that are we happy with the

5457
03:36:57.760 --> 03:37:00.760
wording? Councelor Williamson,

5458
03:37:01.359 --> 03:37:03.496
just while we're sort of having an open

5459
03:37:03.520 --> 03:37:06.520
discussion, what is a project committee

5460
03:37:06.800 --> 03:37:09.800
and what is the Achinson House project?

5461
03:37:14.560 --> 03:37:16.295
Our website.

5462
03:37:16.319 --> 03:37:18.696
Are you on the 355 committee?

5463
03:37:18.720 --> 03:37:19.176
Okay. So,

5464
03:37:19.200 --> 03:37:21.976
we have two sorts of 355 committees.

5465
03:37:22.000 --> 03:37:24.616
Below that, we have project committee,

5466
03:37:24.640 --> 03:37:26.936
Richardson House project committee.

5467
03:37:26.960 --> 03:37:27.976
helps that one

5468
03:37:28.000 --> 03:37:31.000
one in Barryale Heritage House.

5469
03:37:31.680 --> 03:37:33.176
I'll have to take that one on notice in

5470
03:37:33.200 --> 03:37:34.455
terms of looking for a charter to

5471
03:37:34.479 --> 03:37:35.576
provide to counselors.

5472
03:37:35.600 --> 03:37:37.415
Councor Higgins, you have a question.

5473
03:37:37.439 --> 03:37:40.439
I have a question about the minutes

5474
03:37:40.960 --> 03:37:41.736
themselves.

5475
03:37:41.760 --> 03:37:44.616
Oh,

5476
03:37:44.640 --> 03:37:47.640
give it away.

5477
03:37:48.080 --> 03:37:50.616
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm happy for this

5478
03:37:50.640 --> 03:37:53.640
to be taken on notice, but um I noticed

5479
03:37:53.680 --> 03:37:56.680
in the  minutes from the Mikgo Hall

5480
03:37:56.800 --> 03:37:59.800
and Tennis Corpse Committee that the

5481
03:38:00.160 --> 03:38:02.455
committee had already waited 5 months to

5482
03:38:02.479 --> 03:38:05.479
get a response from council about how to

5483
03:38:05.520 --> 03:38:08.520
fix the termites.  these minutes were

5484
03:38:10.080 --> 03:38:13.016
from November. So I would just like to

5485
03:38:13.040 --> 03:38:16.040
check that they have actually that

5486
03:38:16.160 --> 03:38:17.976
council did get back to the committee

5487
03:38:18.000 --> 03:38:20.136
about the termite treatment.

5488
03:38:20.160 --> 03:38:22.455
Sorry. Was this new around the hall?

5489
03:38:22.479 --> 03:38:25.335
No. Mago

5490
03:38:25.359 --> 03:38:26.536
H312

5491
03:38:26.560 --> 03:38:27.255
clubhouse.

5492
03:38:27.279 --> 03:38:29.176
Um madam chair we'll have to take that

5493
03:38:29.200 --> 03:38:29.576
one off.

5494
03:38:29.600 --> 03:38:31.896
Yeah. No, that is fine. But um I'm

5495
03:38:31.920 --> 03:38:34.375
hoping the answer is yes.

5496
03:38:34.399 --> 03:38:36.536
Being down

5497
03:38:36.560 --> 03:38:39.560
there have a second question about

5498
03:38:39.760 --> 03:38:41.176
Nicolago.

5499
03:38:41.200 --> 03:38:44.200
ball and tennis courts committee. 

5500
03:38:44.479 --> 03:38:47.479
paragraph 6.3 that's on page 310

5501
03:38:49.279 --> 03:38:52.136
 refers to a request from council for

5502
03:38:52.160 --> 03:38:54.455
a list of priorities

5503
03:38:54.479 --> 03:38:56.776
 for major and minor maintenance at

5504
03:38:56.800 --> 03:38:59.656
Mclaggo Hall. And you'll see there a

5505
03:38:59.680 --> 03:39:02.680
list of  six  major works and and

5506
03:39:04.640 --> 03:39:07.640
three additional minor works. Now some

5507
03:39:08.080 --> 03:39:11.080
of these are beyond routine care and

5508
03:39:11.439 --> 03:39:14.215
maintenance are sort of like major major

5509
03:39:14.239 --> 03:39:17.239
capital works and I would imagine

5510
03:39:18.239 --> 03:39:19.896
could well be beyond the financial

5511
03:39:19.920 --> 03:39:22.920
resources of  of the hall committee.

5512
03:39:23.040 --> 03:39:25.335
So I'd like to know whether  council

5513
03:39:25.359 --> 03:39:28.359
can provide any assistance to the nec or

5514
03:39:28.880 --> 03:39:31.880
committee  to enable it to 

5515
03:39:32.080 --> 03:39:35.080
undertake repairs of those nine major

5516
03:39:36.239 --> 03:39:37.656
works that have been identified.

5517
03:39:37.680 --> 03:39:39.736
 should we add that in into the motion

5518
03:39:39.760 --> 03:39:41.255
um to request council to contact the

5519
03:39:41.279 --> 03:39:44.056
Mikgo  advisory committee in relation

5520
03:39:44.080 --> 03:39:46.856
to the maintenance list? Then it will be

5521
03:39:46.880 --> 03:39:49.736
a resolution action after

5522
03:39:49.760 --> 03:39:52.295
Davis. Would you be happy to do that?

5523
03:39:52.319 --> 03:39:55.096
Thank you.

5524
03:39:55.120 --> 03:39:57.816
In relation to the maintenance list,

5525
03:39:57.840 --> 03:39:59.335
the report will have to come back to

5526
03:39:59.359 --> 03:40:01.335
council if we get involved in the part.

5527
03:40:01.359 --> 03:40:02.536
Yeah. Yeah. But they need to find they

5528
03:40:02.560 --> 03:40:03.656
need to sort of talk to the committee

5529
03:40:03.680 --> 03:40:06.680
first to find out what they want. Yeah.

5530
03:40:07.200 --> 03:40:10.200
Council Williamson.

5531
03:40:10.479 --> 03:40:12.776
Just a question for my own education if

5532
03:40:12.800 --> 03:40:14.215
that's okay. Please.

5533
03:40:14.239 --> 03:40:17.239
Um so the the Mic committee has um

5534
03:40:19.040 --> 03:40:22.040
provided us with a profit and loss

5535
03:40:22.720 --> 03:40:24.295
statement

5536
03:40:24.319 --> 03:40:27.319
um and a um and a a balance sheet.

5537
03:40:29.840 --> 03:40:31.415
Um,

5538
03:40:31.439 --> 03:40:34.136
do we require each of these committees

5539
03:40:34.160 --> 03:40:37.160
to provide such financial stuff? And

5540
03:40:40.000 --> 03:40:42.536
given

5541
03:40:42.560 --> 03:40:44.616
well

5542
03:40:44.640 --> 03:40:47.640
at the end of the financial year, the

5543
03:40:47.760 --> 03:40:49.656
financial assets within these

5544
03:40:49.680 --> 03:40:52.680
committees, are they financial assets of

5545
03:40:53.840 --> 03:40:55.576
council

5546
03:40:55.600 --> 03:40:57.656
 and therefore have to roll up and be

5547
03:40:57.680 --> 03:40:59.816
reported in our annual financial

5548
03:40:59.840 --> 03:41:02.840
statements? And if so, does the does the

5549
03:41:04.160 --> 03:41:06.856
auditor consider these

5550
03:41:06.880 --> 03:41:08.776
 amounts and and how are they dealt

5551
03:41:08.800 --> 03:41:09.976
with?

5552
03:41:10.000 --> 03:41:13.000
To answer the first part, not all 355

5553
03:41:13.040 --> 03:41:15.255
committees have um the management of

5554
03:41:15.279 --> 03:41:17.415
funds. So if they do have management of

5555
03:41:17.439 --> 03:41:19.176
funds, then yes, they are required to

5556
03:41:19.200 --> 03:41:22.136
report that to council. In terms of um

5557
03:41:22.160 --> 03:41:24.295
the audit process, that's something I

5558
03:41:24.319 --> 03:41:25.896
will have to take on notice. My

5559
03:41:25.920 --> 03:41:28.920
understanding is um yeah I'll just in

5560
03:41:29.040 --> 03:41:31.335
terms of auditing 355 committees I'm not

5561
03:41:31.359 --> 03:41:32.936
quite sure in terms of how that fits in

5562
03:41:32.960 --> 03:41:34.856
with the audit process then.

5563
03:41:34.880 --> 03:41:35.736
So

5564
03:41:35.760 --> 03:41:37.656
what does that mean that the assets in

5565
03:41:37.680 --> 03:41:40.680
the bank controlled by this committee

5566
03:41:40.880 --> 03:41:43.736
council asset?

5567
03:41:43.760 --> 03:41:45.896
I'm like who owns some other I'm not

5568
03:41:45.920 --> 03:41:47.335
worried about the total I'm just trying

5569
03:41:47.359 --> 03:41:48.856
to understand. Yeah, I

5570
03:41:48.880 --> 03:41:50.136
works

5571
03:41:50.160 --> 03:41:51.576
um through you madam chair. I can't

5572
03:41:51.600 --> 03:41:53.736
specifically answer for the Michellego

5573
03:41:53.760 --> 03:41:55.816
Hall committee. So, and I can only talk

5574
03:41:55.840 --> 03:41:58.056
in general terms. Some councils have the

5575
03:41:58.080 --> 03:42:00.936
situation where it's um the committee

5576
03:42:00.960 --> 03:42:02.616
members as well as the staff member

5577
03:42:02.640 --> 03:42:05.016
having um you know access to the the

5578
03:42:05.040 --> 03:42:07.176
bank account. Um so it's just one of

5579
03:42:07.200 --> 03:42:08.375
those things I would have to go and

5580
03:42:08.399 --> 03:42:09.976
clarify. You're talking about just

5581
03:42:10.000 --> 03:42:12.936
generally speaking about those 355

5582
03:42:12.960 --> 03:42:14.696
committees or specifically this one.

5583
03:42:14.720 --> 03:42:17.415
I'll have to take it on notice. So my

5584
03:42:17.439 --> 03:42:18.936
question is at the end of the financial

5585
03:42:18.960 --> 03:42:21.096
year when we sort out our financial

5586
03:42:21.120 --> 03:42:23.335
statements and obviously going to act

5587
03:42:23.359 --> 03:42:26.359
the rest um is the money held within

5588
03:42:27.279 --> 03:42:28.936
management committees because they're

5589
03:42:28.960 --> 03:42:31.960
managing council assets in this case to

5590
03:42:33.920 --> 03:42:36.856
generate a profit which is great.

5591
03:42:36.880 --> 03:42:37.736
from

5592
03:42:37.760 --> 03:42:40.536
are those are is that financial assets

5593
03:42:40.560 --> 03:42:43.560
part of our financial asset base and and

5594
03:42:43.680 --> 03:42:45.816
do they roll up and how's all that and

5595
03:42:45.840 --> 03:42:47.576
so I think also this could be wrapped up

5596
03:42:47.600 --> 03:42:50.136
in our our bigger requests to clarify

5597
03:42:50.160 --> 03:42:53.160
the charters and the yeah so a lot of

5598
03:42:53.359 --> 03:42:55.335
this will come out as we actually review

5599
03:42:55.359 --> 03:42:57.255
the entire structure of our committees

5600
03:42:57.279 --> 03:43:00.279
because I am aware of some ball

5601
03:43:00.560 --> 03:43:02.776
committees for example that that do

5602
03:43:02.800 --> 03:43:04.936
operate the hall commercially

5603
03:43:04.960 --> 03:43:06.696
but I'm not aware that they ever provide

5604
03:43:06.720 --> 03:43:08.295
this level of detail to us.

5605
03:43:08.319 --> 03:43:10.616
That's right.  do we have a speaker?

5606
03:43:10.640 --> 03:43:11.976
What should we do? Speaker against the

5607
03:43:12.000 --> 03:43:14.375
motion.

5608
03:43:14.399 --> 03:43:16.856
 speaker Paul, councelor Thomas, I

5609
03:43:16.880 --> 03:43:17.896
don't think you need a right of reply.

5610
03:43:17.920 --> 03:43:19.255
We didn't really have anybody against or

5611
03:43:19.279 --> 03:43:20.215
would you like one?

5612
03:43:20.239 --> 03:43:22.375
No, no, thank you. I just want to move

5613
03:43:22.399 --> 03:43:23.816
it forward. Good thing.

5614
03:43:23.840 --> 03:43:25.175
Thank you. All those in favor of the

5615
03:43:25.199 --> 03:43:27.496
motion.  that is unanimous. Thank you

5616
03:43:27.520 --> 03:43:30.520
very much. Moving on to um  item 11,

5617
03:43:32.000 --> 03:43:34.295
notice of motions. Look, at this point I

5618
03:43:34.319 --> 03:43:37.255
would like to move a procedural motion

5619
03:43:37.279 --> 03:43:39.415
um which is as follows. What I would

5620
03:43:39.439 --> 03:43:42.439
like to do is to um defer the following

5621
03:43:43.359 --> 03:43:45.496
motions. I will list the numbers. Defer

5622
03:43:45.520 --> 03:43:47.736
the following motions to the March.

5623
03:43:47.760 --> 03:43:49.496
Council of motions.

5624
03:43:49.520 --> 03:43:50.696
One moment please. I would like to have

5625
03:43:50.720 --> 03:43:53.720
a procedural motion to defer them.

5626
03:43:53.920 --> 03:43:55.736
The following items to be deferred into

5627
03:43:55.760 --> 03:43:57.896
the March meeting.

5628
03:43:57.920 --> 03:44:00.056
Item 11.1

5629
03:44:00.080 --> 03:44:02.375
11.2 2

5630
03:44:02.399 --> 03:44:04.616
11.3

5631
03:44:04.640 --> 03:44:06.616
11.4

5632
03:44:06.640 --> 03:44:08.455
11.5

5633
03:44:08.479 --> 03:44:10.215
11.6

5634
03:44:10.239 --> 03:44:12.375
11.7

5635
03:44:12.399 --> 03:44:14.215
1110

5636
03:44:14.239 --> 03:44:16.856
and 11:21.

5637
03:44:16.880 --> 03:44:19.096
Do I have a seconder to defer the

5638
03:44:19.120 --> 03:44:21.976
motions as listed to the March meeting?

5639
03:44:22.000 --> 03:44:25.000
Mor Higgins discussion.

5640
03:44:25.199 --> 03:44:28.056
Um there's I I can speak on a procedural

5641
03:44:28.080 --> 03:44:31.080
motion, but I feel there's no need. Um

5642
03:44:32.560 --> 03:44:35.560
Oh, sorry. I've missed one. Um 11.12.

5643
03:44:36.399 --> 03:44:37.496
Oh, yes.

5644
03:44:37.520 --> 03:44:38.616
11.62.

5645
03:44:38.640 --> 03:44:41.640
I said I said 11.6. 11.7

5646
03:44:43.199 --> 03:44:46.199
there. Can you add 11.11

5647
03:44:46.800 --> 03:44:48.856
to that deferral?

5648
03:44:48.880 --> 03:44:49.335
That's it.

5649
03:44:49.359 --> 03:44:52.359
No, there's no no need. We I've thought

5650
03:44:52.560 --> 03:44:54.295
hard about that one. I would actually

5651
03:44:54.319 --> 03:44:57.255
like to keep that in this. I appreciate

5652
03:44:57.279 --> 03:44:57.896
what you're saying.

5653
03:44:57.920 --> 03:44:59.576
What's that one?

5654
03:44:59.600 --> 03:45:01.096
Recision motion that was brought by

5655
03:45:01.120 --> 03:45:02.616
three counselors at the time that that

5656
03:45:02.640 --> 03:45:04.455
recision motion was signed. Councelor

5657
03:45:04.479 --> 03:45:05.496
was indeed a counselor.

5658
03:45:05.520 --> 03:45:07.016
Well, I don't think um

5659
03:45:07.040 --> 03:45:08.455
I feel there's no

5660
03:45:08.479 --> 03:45:10.616
You can move a motion.

5661
03:45:10.640 --> 03:45:11.576
Well, that's right. We can move it

5662
03:45:11.600 --> 03:45:13.255
separately, but I would not I I would

5663
03:45:13.279 --> 03:45:15.016
prefer prefer not to include that.

5664
03:45:15.040 --> 03:45:16.616
There's only three and there's one hour.

5665
03:45:16.640 --> 03:45:18.056
Why would we be addressing

5666
03:45:18.080 --> 03:45:19.415
that? That's exactly right. That's why

5667
03:45:19.439 --> 03:45:21.016
I've not included it in my procedural

5668
03:45:21.040 --> 03:45:22.936
motion, but obviously council can do

5669
03:45:22.960 --> 03:45:24.455
what he chooses.

5670
03:45:24.479 --> 03:45:27.479
, can I just clarify?

5671
03:45:28.479 --> 03:45:31.175
Oh, sorry. Let me go. Um, yes. So, 11.1,

5672
03:45:31.199 --> 03:45:34.199
11.2, 11.3, 11.4.5,

5673
03:45:35.120 --> 03:45:38.120
6.7, 10, 12, and 21.

5674
03:45:40.319 --> 03:45:43.255
So, what are we doing with the um

5675
03:45:43.279 --> 03:45:44.616
precision motion?

5676
03:45:44.640 --> 03:45:46.616
Well, we're going to vote on this one

5677
03:45:46.640 --> 03:45:48.776
first. Yeah, another council may choose

5678
03:45:48.800 --> 03:45:50.295
to defer that to another meeting, but I

5679
03:45:50.319 --> 03:45:52.856
would like it.

5680
03:45:52.880 --> 03:45:55.880
So,  the procedural motion

5681
03:45:56.640 --> 03:45:59.335
 let's put that motion. All those in

5682
03:45:59.359 --> 03:46:01.736
favor to defer the motions listed items

5683
03:46:01.760 --> 03:46:03.096
listed

5684
03:46:03.120 --> 03:46:05.736
we should

5685
03:46:05.760 --> 03:46:08.536
in the that sorry I'm happy to give it

5686
03:46:08.560 --> 03:46:09.896
just so let's just come down there

5687
03:46:09.920 --> 03:46:11.496
there's been a question and I will just

5688
03:46:11.520 --> 03:46:13.816
um explain then the motion the items

5689
03:46:13.840 --> 03:46:15.096
that I've listed are the motions that

5690
03:46:15.120 --> 03:46:17.096
have been moved by Mr. Faylor in respect

5691
03:46:17.120 --> 03:46:18.856
to the fact that he's not here. I would

5692
03:46:18.880 --> 03:46:21.880
like to defer them to the March meeting.

5693
03:46:22.880 --> 03:46:24.136
So these are the motions that have been

5694
03:46:24.160 --> 03:46:27.160
put forward by Mr. Faylor.

5695
03:46:28.000 --> 03:46:30.856
If we vote on them today and council

5696
03:46:30.880 --> 03:46:33.016
fail is unhappy with the resolutions

5697
03:46:33.040 --> 03:46:36.040
that are reached in 3 months time you'd

5698
03:46:36.160 --> 03:46:38.295
be able to bring a different motion back

5699
03:46:38.319 --> 03:46:39.175
to council.

5700
03:46:39.199 --> 03:46:40.536
Absolutely. But if

5701
03:46:40.560 --> 03:46:41.656
why would we defer

5702
03:46:41.680 --> 03:46:42.936
the procedural motion that I'm putting

5703
03:46:42.960 --> 03:46:44.375
up is I want to give him the opportunity

5704
03:46:44.399 --> 03:46:46.136
to speak to his motions.

5705
03:46:46.160 --> 03:46:48.696
He can not today. Not unless well in

5706
03:46:48.720 --> 03:46:49.976
Yes, you're absolutely right, Councelor

5707
03:46:50.000 --> 03:46:52.056
Williamson. We can debate them today.

5708
03:46:52.080 --> 03:46:53.816
They may or may not be carried. If

5709
03:46:53.840 --> 03:46:55.896
they're not carried, he can then

5710
03:46:55.920 --> 03:46:58.455
resubmit them in 3 months time. What I'm

5711
03:46:58.479 --> 03:46:59.896
suggesting is that we move them to

5712
03:46:59.920 --> 03:47:01.415
March. So there's the opportunity to

5713
03:47:01.439 --> 03:47:03.496
debate them in 3 weeks time. So that

5714
03:47:03.520 --> 03:47:05.096
would, I would imagine, be more

5715
03:47:05.120 --> 03:47:06.936
preferable to do that. You can vote

5716
03:47:06.960 --> 03:47:07.816
against this

5717
03:47:07.840 --> 03:47:08.696
in three weeks time.

5718
03:47:08.720 --> 03:47:10.696
Well, March, the March meeting.

5719
03:47:10.720 --> 03:47:11.496
Three months time.

5720
03:47:11.520 --> 03:47:13.816
No, three. I want to defer them to the

5721
03:47:13.840 --> 03:47:16.616
March meeting to the next meeting.

5722
03:47:16.640 --> 03:47:18.295
Why would we defer him until he gets

5723
03:47:18.319 --> 03:47:21.255
back when he arrive?

5724
03:47:21.279 --> 03:47:22.536
Personally, I won't make it the mayor's

5725
03:47:22.560 --> 03:47:25.560
problem. So,

5726
03:47:27.279 --> 03:47:29.175
council is happy to support that.

5727
03:47:29.199 --> 03:47:30.856
But this is the motion that I would like

5728
03:47:30.880 --> 03:47:32.215
to put forward, seconded by councelor

5729
03:47:32.239 --> 03:47:33.576
Higgins, that the following items be

5730
03:47:33.600 --> 03:47:35.496
deferred to the March meeting. All those

5731
03:47:35.520 --> 03:47:37.576
in favor.

5732
03:47:37.600 --> 03:47:39.016
Oh, I'll go that way.

5733
03:47:39.040 --> 03:47:41.816
Councelor Summers, Higgins, Stewart,

5734
03:47:41.840 --> 03:47:44.840
Rose, Rooney, Davis, Elliot, Hopkins,

5735
03:47:44.960 --> 03:47:47.335
those against councelor Williamson. The

5736
03:47:47.359 --> 03:47:49.576
motion is carried. Therefore, we will

5737
03:47:49.600 --> 03:47:52.600
move on to item.

5738
03:47:53.840 --> 03:47:56.840
And that Oh, sorry.

5739
03:47:58.560 --> 03:48:00.375
Oh my goodness. We're on the clock. Five

5740
03:48:00.399 --> 03:48:02.536
minutes.

5741
03:48:02.560 --> 03:48:05.175
I'm worried about the time. Let's um

5742
03:48:05.199 --> 03:48:07.096
about 3:20. We'll start again at 3:20.

5743
03:48:07.120 --> 03:48:10.120
We'll have an 8 minute break.

5744
03:48:10.640 --> 03:48:12.136
First, thank you to counselors. I resume

5745
03:48:12.160 --> 03:48:15.160
the meeting at 3:19.  now we're up to

5746
03:48:15.199 --> 03:48:18.199
item 118 in review. Councelor Rose, 

5747
03:48:19.279 --> 03:48:21.736
we need a seconder. Do I have a second

5748
03:48:21.760 --> 03:48:22.455
for this motion?

5749
03:48:22.479 --> 03:48:24.936
Yeah. Councelor Elliot.

5750
03:48:24.960 --> 03:48:26.616
Councelor Rose, you have five minutes.

5751
03:48:26.640 --> 03:48:29.640
I'll read the I'll read the um I'll read

5752
03:48:30.080 --> 03:48:32.295
the motion um because people can't see

5753
03:48:32.319 --> 03:48:34.536
it at home on the screen. Um that

5754
03:48:34.560 --> 03:48:36.936
council one request a report reviewing

5755
03:48:36.960 --> 03:48:39.255
the all ecoourism facility development

5756
03:48:39.279 --> 03:48:41.656
consents within issued within the snow

5757
03:48:41.680 --> 03:48:44.295
Monero region since 1st of July 2020

5758
03:48:44.319 --> 03:48:47.255
identifying a their current operational

5759
03:48:47.279 --> 03:48:48.936
status and compliance with consent

5760
03:48:48.960 --> 03:48:51.096
conditions and b whether each

5761
03:48:51.120 --> 03:48:53.016
development demonstrabably satisfied the

5762
03:48:53.040 --> 03:48:56.040
intent of clause 5.13 ecoourrist

5763
03:48:56.239 --> 03:48:57.976
facilities of the relevant local

5764
03:48:58.000 --> 03:49:00.696
environmental plan. two that the report

5765
03:49:00.720 --> 03:49:02.536
also outlines options for improving

5766
03:49:02.560 --> 03:49:05.560
policy or leap DCP provisions to ensure

5767
03:49:06.080 --> 03:49:08.215
that EPO tourism developments in rural

5768
03:49:08.239 --> 03:49:10.856
zones deliver genuine environmental or

5769
03:49:10.880 --> 03:49:12.375
cultural outcomes and are not

5770
03:49:12.399 --> 03:49:14.696
functioning primarily the short-term

5771
03:49:14.720 --> 03:49:17.335
tourist accommodation and three that a

5772
03:49:17.359 --> 03:49:19.335
report be provided to council by the

5773
03:49:19.359 --> 03:49:22.359
ordinary council meeting in say May 226.

5774
03:49:27.680 --> 03:49:30.680
I don't know if that's enough time or

5775
03:49:31.040 --> 03:49:32.455
that might be a big project. I don't

5776
03:49:32.479 --> 03:49:34.936
know.

5777
03:49:34.960 --> 03:49:37.255
Happy with June

5778
03:49:37.279 --> 03:49:40.215
perhaps June 2026.

5779
03:49:40.239 --> 03:49:42.936
So

5780
03:49:42.960 --> 03:49:45.496
look, I'll just

5781
03:49:45.520 --> 03:49:48.455
speak to this motion. I think this is

5782
03:49:48.479 --> 03:49:50.056
something that's come up for a range of

5783
03:49:50.080 --> 03:49:52.936
different  situations that we've had

5784
03:49:52.960 --> 03:49:55.896
to deal with in the last period of time.

5785
03:49:55.920 --> 03:49:58.776
And um I think everyone here supports

5786
03:49:58.800 --> 03:50:01.415
sustainable tourism.

5787
03:50:01.439 --> 03:50:04.439
Certainly it supports local jobs and so

5788
03:50:04.479 --> 03:50:07.479
forth. But under clause 5.13 of the

5789
03:50:08.399 --> 03:50:10.616
leaps, the ecoouris facilities are

5790
03:50:10.640 --> 03:50:13.096
intended to be low impact developments

5791
03:50:13.120 --> 03:50:15.736
that are located in adjacent

5792
03:50:15.760 --> 03:50:17.656
or adjacent to areas with special

5793
03:50:17.680 --> 03:50:20.295
ecological or cultural features to

5794
03:50:20.319 --> 03:50:22.536
designed and managed to protect and

5795
03:50:22.560 --> 03:50:24.375
enhance those features and genuinely

5796
03:50:24.399 --> 03:50:27.175
tied to an environmental or cultural

5797
03:50:27.199 --> 03:50:28.936
experience.

5798
03:50:28.960 --> 03:50:31.960
Now, I know that councelor Summers was

5799
03:50:32.239 --> 03:50:34.455
very keen on a recent ecoourism

5800
03:50:34.479 --> 03:50:35.896
development because she felt it was

5801
03:50:35.920 --> 03:50:38.920
going to enhance the sort of ecological

5802
03:50:39.680 --> 03:50:41.576
experience for people. And I'm sure that

5803
03:50:41.600 --> 03:50:44.056
that's right. But sometimes the

5804
03:50:44.080 --> 03:50:47.080
ecological experience seems to be how

5805
03:50:47.279 --> 03:50:49.096
fast people can get skis on the top of

5806
03:50:49.120 --> 03:50:52.120
their cars and head off to the snow and

5807
03:50:52.479 --> 03:50:55.479
um and get back a duck. So I I think the

5808
03:50:55.840 --> 03:50:58.840
issues that we've got is are significant

5809
03:50:59.120 --> 03:51:01.896
because clearly these  ecoouris

5810
03:51:01.920 --> 03:51:03.656
facilities were never been meant to be a

5811
03:51:03.680 --> 03:51:06.680
walk or workound for development corrupt

5812
03:51:06.720 --> 03:51:09.496
controls in rural zones and they're not

5813
03:51:09.520 --> 03:51:11.496
intended to function just a short-term

5814
03:51:11.520 --> 03:51:14.520
accommodation on land where other forms

5815
03:51:14.640 --> 03:51:17.640
of development are prohibited. So what

5816
03:51:18.880 --> 03:51:21.335
we need to do I suppose is to check our

5817
03:51:21.359 --> 03:51:24.359
policy and see whether the intent is

5818
03:51:24.479 --> 03:51:27.335
being achieved in practice.

5819
03:51:27.359 --> 03:51:30.295
Certainly um a list of ecoourism

5820
03:51:30.319 --> 03:51:33.319
consents since 1st of July 2020 would

5821
03:51:33.840 --> 03:51:36.616
help us to understand what's happened

5822
03:51:36.640 --> 03:51:39.640
over that time and how those um

5823
03:51:40.160 --> 03:51:43.160
particular developments 

5824
03:51:43.520 --> 03:51:46.520
apply with the consent features of the

5825
03:51:46.560 --> 03:51:49.255
of the development. Um, so it's a

5826
03:51:49.279 --> 03:51:52.279
discrete category and we're really just

5827
03:51:52.960 --> 03:51:55.016
asking for their operational status

5828
03:51:55.040 --> 03:51:57.576
compliance with conditions. So I don't

5829
03:51:57.600 --> 03:51:59.335
think it's a huge amount of work.

5830
03:51:59.359 --> 03:52:01.175
Certainly we could very easily with a

5831
03:52:01.199 --> 03:52:03.496
push of a button identify which ones

5832
03:52:03.520 --> 03:52:06.520
classify as ecoourism facilities. the

5833
03:52:06.640 --> 03:52:09.335
the CEO makes the point that assessment

5834
03:52:09.359 --> 03:52:11.976
against the clause occurs at a time of

5835
03:52:12.000 --> 03:52:14.455
determination, but that's certainly the

5836
03:52:14.479 --> 03:52:17.096
process, but this doesn't mean the

5837
03:52:17.120 --> 03:52:19.016
council cannot review how the clause has

5838
03:52:19.040 --> 03:52:20.375
been applied. So, I think what's

5839
03:52:20.399 --> 03:52:22.215
happened is these are these are applied.

5840
03:52:22.239 --> 03:52:23.496
People say they're going to do this,

5841
03:52:23.520 --> 03:52:25.736
this, and this. I know one particular

5842
03:52:25.760 --> 03:52:28.760
area was applied or to look at at

5843
03:52:28.960 --> 03:52:31.335
koalas, but there hasn't been a koala in

5844
03:52:31.359 --> 03:52:33.976
that region for the last 100 years. So

5845
03:52:34.000 --> 03:52:35.576
this is not about relitigating

5846
03:52:35.600 --> 03:52:38.600
individual DAS. It's stepping back and

5847
03:52:38.720 --> 03:52:41.096
asking is the pattern of approvals

5848
03:52:41.120 --> 03:52:43.576
consistent with the policy objective

5849
03:52:43.600 --> 03:52:46.600
and are we seeing genuine eco tourism

5850
03:52:46.960 --> 03:52:48.616
enterprises

5851
03:52:48.640 --> 03:52:51.016
rather than just simply high-profit

5852
03:52:51.040 --> 03:52:53.656
tourism enterprises and I've got no

5853
03:52:53.680 --> 03:52:55.096
problem about high-profit tourism

5854
03:52:55.120 --> 03:52:57.415
enterprises at all. But if we disguise

5855
03:52:57.439 --> 03:52:59.656
it as e ecourism that's just not

5856
03:52:59.680 --> 03:53:02.680
appropriate. So I suppose the issue is

5857
03:53:02.960 --> 03:53:05.896
just for us to see what the situation is

5858
03:53:05.920 --> 03:53:07.816
and then be able to work out what our

5859
03:53:07.840 --> 03:53:09.096
next steps.

5860
03:53:09.120 --> 03:53:11.175
We are certainly you know we're

5861
03:53:11.199 --> 03:53:12.536
certainly responsible for the integrity

5862
03:53:12.560 --> 03:53:15.560
of leaps and

5863
03:53:16.080 --> 03:53:18.295
a number of people have come to

5864
03:53:18.319 --> 03:53:20.455
councelor Elliot and myself and said

5865
03:53:20.479 --> 03:53:23.175
that the ecoourism is being used as a

5866
03:53:23.199 --> 03:53:26.136
backdoor to achieve outcomes that would

5867
03:53:26.160 --> 03:53:29.160
otherwise not be possible. So the motion

5868
03:53:29.520 --> 03:53:31.656
actually asks for options to improve our

5869
03:53:31.680 --> 03:53:34.680
policy settings and I suppose really

5870
03:53:36.640 --> 03:53:39.640
this is a significant piece of work that

5871
03:53:40.319 --> 03:53:42.856
we probably do need to know because at

5872
03:53:42.880 --> 03:53:45.255
at the moment we just don't understand

5873
03:53:45.279 --> 03:53:46.856
um and we need to actually make some

5874
03:53:46.880 --> 03:53:49.016
decisions about this more broadly in our

5875
03:53:49.040 --> 03:53:51.816
area. So thank you and I just commend

5876
03:53:51.840 --> 03:53:53.976
the motion to councilors.

5877
03:53:54.000 --> 03:53:56.776
Thank you. Do we have speaker against

5878
03:53:56.800 --> 03:53:58.056
councelorie?

5879
03:53:58.080 --> 03:54:00.536
Well, I believe  madame deputy mayor

5880
03:54:00.560 --> 03:54:02.616
that this is a solution in such a

5881
03:54:02.640 --> 03:54:05.175
problem.  it's essentially a

5882
03:54:05.199 --> 03:54:08.199
compliance task and  as council rose

5883
03:54:08.800 --> 03:54:10.776
himself admits it would require

5884
03:54:10.800 --> 03:54:13.800
significant resources to uns

5885
03:54:17.199 --> 03:54:19.576
I don't I don't agree. I said I don't

5886
03:54:19.600 --> 03:54:20.936
believe we do need to know the answers

5887
03:54:20.960 --> 03:54:23.960
to it. Um we we have approved these

5888
03:54:24.239 --> 03:54:27.239
applications in good faith and  and

5889
03:54:27.279 --> 03:54:29.496
and now it is out of our hands. But we

5890
03:54:29.520 --> 03:54:32.136
shouldn't be exposing  project

5891
03:54:32.160 --> 03:54:33.816
proponents that this double jeopardy

5892
03:54:33.840 --> 03:54:36.455
that you know after the their approval

5893
03:54:36.479 --> 03:54:38.056
has been granted we then come back and

5894
03:54:38.080 --> 03:54:40.375
assess  how well they're complying

5895
03:54:40.399 --> 03:54:42.936
with it and given that the  the

5896
03:54:42.960 --> 03:54:45.960
standards of  ecological appreciation

5897
03:54:46.720 --> 03:54:48.295
fairly subjective. How will you measure

5898
03:54:48.319 --> 03:54:51.319
it? I mean how will you measure one's 

5899
03:54:52.239 --> 03:54:54.056
you know the intensity of one's rapture

5900
03:54:54.080 --> 03:54:56.536
at the natural beauty of the environment

5901
03:54:56.560 --> 03:54:59.496
council rose and furthermore what are

5902
03:54:59.520 --> 03:55:01.096
going to be the allowable and the

5903
03:55:01.120 --> 03:55:03.415
nonallowable activities you mentioned

5904
03:55:03.439 --> 03:55:05.576
skiing how you police that are you

5905
03:55:05.600 --> 03:55:07.096
proposing to have drones offering

5906
03:55:07.120 --> 03:55:10.120
overreach ecoourism cabin  following

5907
03:55:11.199 --> 03:55:13.415
people when they drive out or you going

5908
03:55:13.439 --> 03:55:15.896
to have police at the the gates the exit

5909
03:55:15.920 --> 03:55:18.056
say where are you going and they might

5910
03:55:18.080 --> 03:55:20.536
say agent of mine sir and you'll be so

5911
03:55:20.560 --> 03:55:23.016
to ski they might reply just for a drink

5912
03:55:23.040 --> 03:55:25.976
ch

5913
03:55:26.000 --> 03:55:28.375
we we we are not yet in a police state

5914
03:55:28.399 --> 03:55:30.455
 councelor rose but I'm I'm afraid

5915
03:55:30.479 --> 03:55:32.136
that you are taking it one step closer

5916
03:55:32.160 --> 03:55:34.936
to it and I suggest the council step

5917
03:55:34.960 --> 03:55:37.896
back from that and take note of the

5918
03:55:37.920 --> 03:55:40.776
CEO's comments which are we don't have

5919
03:55:40.800 --> 03:55:42.295
the resources to do this it would be

5920
03:55:42.319 --> 03:55:44.776
very resource intensive it's not budget

5921
03:55:44.800 --> 03:55:47.800
ad firstly it's not necessary it's not

5922
03:55:47.920 --> 03:55:50.920
budget it for and you haven't suggested

5923
03:55:50.960 --> 03:55:53.960
 what we will not do in order to do

5924
03:55:54.479 --> 03:55:57.479
this review of the  ecoourism strategy

5925
03:55:58.160 --> 03:56:00.776
and lastly I'd suggest that look if

5926
03:56:00.800 --> 03:56:03.800
there is a problem with the ecoourism

5927
03:56:04.640 --> 03:56:07.496
 legislation that's a problem for the

5928
03:56:07.520 --> 03:56:09.255
state government they're the ones who

5929
03:56:09.279 --> 03:56:12.056
designed the legislation and it's for

5930
03:56:12.080 --> 03:56:14.776
them to conduct a review of the

5931
03:56:14.800 --> 03:56:17.800
ecoourism  policy if such thing is

5932
03:56:18.319 --> 03:56:21.096
indeed necessary. It's not for us. And

5933
03:56:21.120 --> 03:56:23.255
even if we did do the review and that

5934
03:56:23.279 --> 03:56:26.279
we've and we discovered that visitors to

5935
03:56:26.319 --> 03:56:29.016
Snow Monero weren't appreciating the

5936
03:56:29.040 --> 03:56:31.576
environment sufficiently and were

5937
03:56:31.600 --> 03:56:34.600
indulging in a range of non ecological

5938
03:56:35.439 --> 03:56:37.656
 but typically tourist style. What are

5939
03:56:37.680 --> 03:56:39.016
you going to do about it? Are you going

5940
03:56:39.040 --> 03:56:42.040
to withdraw the the approval? You can't

5941
03:56:42.239 --> 03:56:43.016
do that. Mhm.

5942
03:56:43.040 --> 03:56:46.040
Are you going to punish the offending

5943
03:56:46.080 --> 03:56:47.976
tourist who who's not being sufficiently

5944
03:56:48.000 --> 03:56:50.776
greed? I don't think you can do that

5945
03:56:50.800 --> 03:56:53.800
either. So, there's nothing. Firstly, we

5946
03:56:54.000 --> 03:56:55.816
we don't need the information. Secondly,

5947
03:56:55.840 --> 03:56:57.175
we can't do anything with the

5948
03:56:57.199 --> 03:56:58.295
information.

5949
03:56:58.319 --> 03:56:59.576
To debate, please. And

5950
03:56:59.600 --> 03:57:02.295
thank you. But I'm just going to stop by

5951
03:57:02.319 --> 03:57:04.136
saying I'm going to withdraw the motion.

5952
03:57:04.160 --> 03:57:05.816
Councelor Rud is so compelling in his

5953
03:57:05.840 --> 03:57:08.840
arguments. I'm going to take

5954
03:57:13.279 --> 03:57:14.856
I was going to say we should be right

5955
03:57:14.880 --> 03:57:17.576
into council we would you have a

5956
03:57:17.600 --> 03:57:19.016
question or something or this is a

5957
03:57:19.040 --> 03:57:22.040
nonissue now easy on that

5958
03:57:22.880 --> 03:57:24.455
how's it stop this has all been

5959
03:57:24.479 --> 03:57:25.976
withdrawn so I feel the questions are

5960
03:57:26.000 --> 03:57:26.936
all null and void

5961
03:57:26.960 --> 03:57:29.816
yeah no move on motion's been moved and

5962
03:57:29.840 --> 03:57:30.616
seconded has

5963
03:57:30.640 --> 03:57:32.375
yeah but he been withdrawn by

5964
03:57:32.399 --> 03:57:34.295
can it be withdrawn

5965
03:57:34.319 --> 03:57:37.319
can it

5966
03:57:37.520 --> 03:57:39.816
is withdrawing the motion Yeah,

5967
03:57:39.840 --> 03:57:42.840
I just got a second. We've already

5968
03:57:45.279 --> 03:57:46.616
Okay, stand by. We'll just check.

5969
03:57:46.640 --> 03:57:48.215
And if we can, we'll have to go back and

5970
03:57:48.239 --> 03:57:51.239
change last ruling to the opposite.

5971
03:57:58.880 --> 03:58:00.776
You create a meeting practice just

5972
03:58:00.800 --> 03:58:01.255
checking.

5973
03:58:01.279 --> 03:58:02.856
Can I ask a question?

5974
03:58:02.880 --> 03:58:03.816
Yeah. While we're looking at that

5975
03:58:03.840 --> 03:58:06.840
question. Sure. Councelor Rose, I

5976
03:58:07.040 --> 03:58:10.040
understood the root cause of this is

5977
03:58:10.160 --> 03:58:12.375
because the LEP

5978
03:58:12.399 --> 03:58:14.536
in the gender the old Ginderbine area is

5979
03:58:14.560 --> 03:58:15.255
about this.

5980
03:58:15.279 --> 03:58:15.576
Correct.

5981
03:58:15.600 --> 03:58:18.536
And it has nothing to do with the state

5982
03:58:18.560 --> 03:58:20.616
government ecoourism reforms.

5983
03:58:20.640 --> 03:58:21.255
That's correct.

5984
03:58:21.279 --> 03:58:23.896
Correct. Okay. Thank you.

5985
03:58:23.920 --> 03:58:25.016
Thanks so much.

5986
03:58:25.040 --> 03:58:26.455
It's not a state government. It's a

5987
03:58:26.479 --> 03:58:28.215
council question.

5988
03:58:28.239 --> 03:58:30.455
It's it's part of the the Snowy River

5989
03:58:30.479 --> 03:58:32.215
LP.

5990
03:58:32.239 --> 03:58:35.239
Nothing to do with tourism.

5991
03:58:40.560 --> 03:58:41.816
The code meeting practice doesn't

5992
03:58:41.840 --> 03:58:43.255
clarify one way or another. So, let's

5993
03:58:43.279 --> 03:58:45.335
let it go. We'll see where we go.

5994
03:58:45.359 --> 03:58:47.335
Councelor Re, would you like Oh, we

5995
03:58:47.359 --> 03:58:48.616
finished.

5996
03:58:48.640 --> 03:58:49.496
How much time do I have?

5997
03:58:49.520 --> 03:58:50.936
You had about a minute.

5998
03:58:50.960 --> 03:58:53.960
About a minute.

5999
03:58:56.479 --> 03:58:58.856
Disrupted my flow.

6000
03:58:58.880 --> 03:59:00.696
It was obviously terribly conflicting.

6001
03:59:00.720 --> 03:59:02.696
So, you could actually Hopefully not

6002
03:59:02.720 --> 03:59:04.295
taken at the gap.

6003
03:59:04.319 --> 03:59:06.375
Let's congratulate you for that.

6004
03:59:06.399 --> 03:59:08.616
So, so councilors

6005
03:59:08.640 --> 03:59:11.415
I think we have higher priority issues.

6006
03:59:11.439 --> 03:59:14.439
For example, if um if this was to cost a

6007
03:59:14.560 --> 03:59:15.816
million dollars, wouldn't you rather put

6008
03:59:15.840 --> 03:59:18.215
it into the gender bind pool?

6009
03:59:18.239 --> 03:59:20.375
I think I would put into Michelang.

6010
03:59:20.399 --> 03:59:21.896
Thank you, councelor. Do we have anybody

6011
03:59:21.920 --> 03:59:24.455
speaking for the motion? Councelor

6012
03:59:24.479 --> 03:59:25.976
Davis.

6013
03:59:26.000 --> 03:59:28.776
Wow. Council Rudy needs a little bit of

6014
03:59:28.800 --> 03:59:31.335
education in regard to why we have this

6015
03:59:31.359 --> 03:59:34.359
provision in the former Snowy River SH

6016
03:59:34.720 --> 03:59:36.295
L.

6017
03:59:36.319 --> 03:59:39.319
It is only in the Snowy River SH L and

6018
03:59:40.800 --> 03:59:43.800
in the four years I have been on in the

6019
03:59:44.000 --> 03:59:45.255
last two terms,

6020
03:59:45.279 --> 03:59:48.279
it has been a thorn in our sides. It is

6021
03:59:48.720 --> 03:59:51.720
a loophole to allow developers to come

6022
03:59:52.479 --> 03:59:55.479
in and put a number of buildings on a

6023
03:59:55.520 --> 03:59:57.335
site that they possibly couldn't even

6024
03:59:57.359 --> 04:00:00.136
put a residential dwelling on. We had a

6025
04:00:00.160 --> 04:00:03.160
situation two years ago where a eco

6026
04:00:04.080 --> 04:00:07.080
development  facility was  put on in

6027
04:00:08.880 --> 04:00:10.856
East Japan

6028
04:00:10.880 --> 04:00:13.175
and there's no way if it was a

6029
04:00:13.199 --> 04:00:15.335
residential situation that you would be

6030
04:00:15.359 --> 04:00:16.856
allowed to do that and it was in a

6031
04:00:16.880 --> 04:00:19.880
residential zone. It was just crazy.

6032
04:00:20.319 --> 04:00:23.319
This  this

6033
04:00:24.239 --> 04:00:27.239
facility in our leap causes us no end of

6034
04:00:28.080 --> 04:00:29.175
pain.

6035
04:00:29.199 --> 04:00:32.199
And I would actually like to see rather

6036
04:00:32.479 --> 04:00:35.479
than having u the compliance we actually

6037
04:00:35.680 --> 04:00:38.680
work on can we actually have it amended

6038
04:00:38.800 --> 04:00:41.800
in the leap so we don't have to actually

6039
04:00:42.239 --> 04:00:45.239
deal with it because it is cor it is it

6040
04:00:45.920 --> 04:00:48.920
is just abused because of

6041
04:00:49.439 --> 04:00:51.175
yeah not quite sure if we're speaking to

6042
04:00:51.199 --> 04:00:52.536
the motion or not but we'll go

6043
04:00:52.560 --> 04:00:55.560
I'm speaking to the motion but  if

6044
04:00:55.760 --> 04:00:58.760
councelor Rose is happy take

6045
04:00:59.120 --> 04:01:02.120
 one and just leave it to that leap

6046
04:01:02.479 --> 04:01:05.479
and and three because doing the

6047
04:01:05.760 --> 04:01:08.295
compliance  audit is going to take a

6048
04:01:08.319 --> 04:01:10.295
lot of resources but actually

6049
04:01:10.319 --> 04:01:12.936
concentrating on the leap and how we

6050
04:01:12.960 --> 04:01:15.816
manage this provision in the LAP will be

6051
04:01:15.840 --> 04:01:17.576
far better

6052
04:01:17.600 --> 04:01:20.600
than  anything else that we do because

6053
04:01:20.800 --> 04:01:23.800
we will continue to be pained by this

6054
04:01:24.560 --> 04:01:27.560
provision in the LP and we all grown

6055
04:01:27.680 --> 04:01:30.215
when they when it comes in front of us

6056
04:01:30.239 --> 04:01:32.536
because we can see that it is just a

6057
04:01:32.560 --> 04:01:35.560
loophole and it allows

6058
04:01:35.760 --> 04:01:38.760
landholders to undertake a development

6059
04:01:39.199 --> 04:01:41.415
that no other residential person can

6060
04:01:41.439 --> 04:01:43.255
undertake.

6061
04:01:43.279 --> 04:01:44.375
I may just stop you there while we sort

6062
04:01:44.399 --> 04:01:46.696
out what the motion actually is. So did

6063
04:01:46.720 --> 04:01:48.375
you want to remove

6064
04:01:48.399 --> 04:01:51.096
package is yes for for councelor Davis I

6065
04:01:51.120 --> 04:01:52.536
think we we removed one

6066
04:01:52.560 --> 04:01:53.496
and and three

6067
04:01:53.520 --> 04:01:55.415
and then

6068
04:01:55.439 --> 04:01:58.439
yeah remove one um and then the council

6069
04:01:58.880 --> 04:02:01.016
report request

6070
04:02:01.040 --> 04:02:04.040
um the CEO to provide the report

6071
04:02:04.479 --> 04:02:07.096
request the CF report provide a report

6072
04:02:07.120 --> 04:02:09.896
out my options for improving policy or

6073
04:02:09.920 --> 04:02:12.920
leap provisions um that's probably okay

6074
04:02:13.520 --> 04:02:16.520
and then um as short-term credit by um

6075
04:02:17.840 --> 04:02:20.840
the June 2023 council

6076
04:02:21.600 --> 04:02:22.856
then we've got

6077
04:02:22.880 --> 04:02:24.295
would that work

6078
04:02:24.319 --> 04:02:26.856
sorry to you madam chair we this is in

6079
04:02:26.880 --> 04:02:29.016
terms of our rural land strategy our

6080
04:02:29.040 --> 04:02:30.696
residential industrial commercial land

6081
04:02:30.720 --> 04:02:33.016
strategy this piece of work has been

6082
04:02:33.040 --> 04:02:34.696
done in terms of what we've put put

6083
04:02:34.720 --> 04:02:36.616
forward to council and recommendations

6084
04:02:36.640 --> 04:02:39.255
there the ecoouris facilities obviously

6085
04:02:39.279 --> 04:02:41.656
something in the snowy river leap that

6086
04:02:41.680 --> 04:02:43.816
is an issue for us if um we are

6087
04:02:43.840 --> 04:02:45.175
progressing this work and we just need

6088
04:02:45.199 --> 04:02:47.096
you to continue to support us in terms

6089
04:02:47.120 --> 04:02:49.255
of endorsing those strategies into the

6090
04:02:49.279 --> 04:02:50.536
future for us to consider a

6091
04:02:50.560 --> 04:02:52.136
comprehensive leap.

6092
04:02:52.160 --> 04:02:53.096
Thank you, council.

6093
04:02:53.120 --> 04:02:55.896
This is only the revise of Snowy River.

6094
04:02:55.920 --> 04:02:57.976
Council's rejected the rule end strategy

6095
04:02:58.000 --> 04:02:59.335
twice.

6096
04:02:59.359 --> 04:03:01.255
Yes.

6097
04:03:01.279 --> 04:03:02.295
Yes.

6098
04:03:02.319 --> 04:03:04.215
But it's right.

6099
04:03:04.239 --> 04:03:05.175
Yeah.

6100
04:03:05.199 --> 04:03:08.136
Want me to sorry um through you madam

6101
04:03:08.160 --> 04:03:09.976
chair. I don't believe that is correct

6102
04:03:10.000 --> 04:03:12.295
in terms of saying it's not right. But

6103
04:03:12.319 --> 04:03:13.896
anyway, I will pass it over to our

6104
04:03:13.920 --> 04:03:16.696
coordinator of strategy.

6105
04:03:16.720 --> 04:03:19.415
Rather rude.

6106
04:03:19.439 --> 04:03:22.215
You ch um

6107
04:03:22.239 --> 04:03:25.175
so I think the best approach in moving

6108
04:03:25.199 --> 04:03:27.175
forward is when we've already got

6109
04:03:27.199 --> 04:03:29.576
planned to undertake the consolidated

6110
04:03:29.600 --> 04:03:32.600
leap. We already have that identified

6111
04:03:33.199 --> 04:03:35.415
within the current delivery program to

6112
04:03:35.439 --> 04:03:37.415
start that work.

6113
04:03:37.439 --> 04:03:39.255
You could go about amending the Snow

6114
04:03:39.279 --> 04:03:41.816
River LEP on its own, but you're still

6115
04:03:41.840 --> 04:03:44.136
subject to the time frames within the

6116
04:03:44.160 --> 04:03:47.160
leap making guideline and to be honest

6117
04:03:47.520 --> 04:03:49.255
with you, the time frame is going to be

6118
04:03:49.279 --> 04:03:51.335
no different to the program that we have

6119
04:03:51.359 --> 04:03:54.359
in place for the consolidated LEP. In

6120
04:03:54.560 --> 04:03:57.335
terms of you're already considering

6121
04:03:57.359 --> 04:03:59.496
reports in regards to the residential,

6122
04:03:59.520 --> 04:04:01.335
commercial and industrial land strategy

6123
04:04:01.359 --> 04:04:04.359
over the coming months. Um in regards to

6124
04:04:04.720 --> 04:04:07.720
the rural land use strategy, um the last

6125
04:04:09.279 --> 04:04:12.279
um  recommend last um resolution from

6126
04:04:12.800 --> 04:04:15.800
council was deferral of that um strategy

6127
04:04:16.560 --> 04:04:18.936
and it may come up in another mo motion

6128
04:04:18.960 --> 04:04:21.960
later on. But um I can assure you that

6129
04:04:22.399 --> 04:04:25.335
um the ecoourism resort issue has

6130
04:04:25.359 --> 04:04:27.576
already been identified as one of one of

6131
04:04:27.600 --> 04:04:29.255
the issues that we'll be considering as

6132
04:04:29.279 --> 04:04:31.736
part of the consolidated leap. I would

6133
04:04:31.760 --> 04:04:34.760
rather council put their effort and um

6134
04:04:36.399 --> 04:04:39.175
into that consolidated leap process

6135
04:04:39.199 --> 04:04:41.576
rather than just singling out one for

6136
04:04:41.600 --> 04:04:43.335
amendment because it's going to be done

6137
04:04:43.359 --> 04:04:45.255
in the same time frame anyway.

6138
04:04:45.279 --> 04:04:46.215
Yeah, I agree.

6139
04:04:46.239 --> 04:04:48.056
Thank you. B council

6140
04:04:48.080 --> 04:04:49.016
just withdraw it.

6141
04:04:49.040 --> 04:04:51.016
Can't it's already it's already mid

6142
04:04:51.040 --> 04:04:52.455
debate. We we need to vote. We need to

6143
04:04:52.479 --> 04:04:53.896
stop debate and vote on it. We can't

6144
04:04:53.920 --> 04:04:56.056
withdraw it. Just wrote it down.

6145
04:04:56.080 --> 04:04:59.016
Council Williamson. Um I wanted to

6146
04:04:59.040 --> 04:05:01.096
suggest an amendment to the motion.

6147
04:05:01.120 --> 04:05:01.976
Sure.

6148
04:05:02.000 --> 04:05:05.000
Um so um

6149
04:05:08.479 --> 04:05:10.696
having watched many of these things come

6150
04:05:10.720 --> 04:05:13.720
through council um there's been quite a

6151
04:05:14.080 --> 04:05:16.696
lot of variation in them.  some of

6152
04:05:16.720 --> 04:05:17.976
them that have come through and

6153
04:05:18.000 --> 04:05:21.000
ultimately been recommended for approval

6154
04:05:21.120 --> 04:05:24.120
 did not meet all requirements in the

6155
04:05:24.239 --> 04:05:25.816
OAP. kind of need the wording of your

6156
04:05:25.840 --> 04:05:26.696
amendment

6157
04:05:26.720 --> 04:05:29.720
including um you know quite very large

6158
04:05:30.399 --> 04:05:33.399
buildings that were certainly visible

6159
04:05:33.439 --> 04:05:35.255
on the horizon.

6160
04:05:35.279 --> 04:05:36.856
So what should we put as the amendment

6161
04:05:36.880 --> 04:05:39.880
then? Um, so my amendment would be that

6162
04:05:40.960 --> 04:05:43.960
 that we get  a report back to us as

6163
04:05:46.080 --> 04:05:49.080
to whether or not the provisions in the

6164
04:05:50.239 --> 04:05:52.375
current le

6165
04:05:52.399 --> 04:05:55.335
are being applied appropriately

6166
04:05:55.359 --> 04:05:58.056
through the planning process because it

6167
04:05:58.080 --> 04:05:59.976
would be

6168
04:06:00.000 --> 04:06:03.000
my my lay person's belief that we could

6169
04:06:04.560 --> 04:06:07.496
um  knock some of these house because

6170
04:06:07.520 --> 04:06:09.335
they're clearly not complying with the

6171
04:06:09.359 --> 04:06:12.136
existing lepros. Are you happy to accept

6172
04:06:12.160 --> 04:06:13.415
that as part of your original motion

6173
04:06:13.439 --> 04:06:14.215
with the debate?

6174
04:06:14.239 --> 04:06:16.136
No, look, I don't think so. My I think I

6175
04:06:16.160 --> 04:06:19.096
was persuaded by council that there's um

6176
04:06:19.120 --> 04:06:21.096
we don't want to do extra work. This

6177
04:06:21.120 --> 04:06:22.616
would require a significant piece of

6178
04:06:22.640 --> 04:06:24.936
work. So, I could see that I think we'd

6179
04:06:24.960 --> 04:06:26.295
have to debate that separately.

6180
04:06:26.319 --> 04:06:27.576
Great. Do we have a second for the

6181
04:06:27.600 --> 04:06:30.600
amendment?

6182
04:06:33.279 --> 04:06:34.936
Sorry, councelor Williamson. I'm sorry.

6183
04:06:34.960 --> 04:06:37.335
 back to the original motion. Did we

6184
04:06:37.359 --> 04:06:38.616
have a question? Are we

6185
04:06:38.640 --> 04:06:39.175
have a question?

6186
04:06:39.199 --> 04:06:40.776
Yes.  just in relation to

6187
04:06:40.800 --> 04:06:43.800
consolidation of the leap and when this

6188
04:06:43.840 --> 04:06:46.696
issue would be anticipated to be

6189
04:06:46.720 --> 04:06:49.016
resolved. Do you have a subsets which

6190
04:06:49.040 --> 04:06:50.776
six months that might be?

6191
04:06:50.800 --> 04:06:53.800
Six months.

6192
04:06:54.000 --> 04:06:55.976
Yeah. Wish

6193
04:06:56.000 --> 04:06:58.056
 which six months would it be? This

6194
04:06:58.080 --> 04:07:01.080
year, next year? I know it's staggered.

6195
04:07:01.760 --> 04:07:03.736
Yes. Yes. Yes. It's staggered in the

6196
04:07:03.760 --> 04:07:06.760
delivery program. So for 26 27

6197
04:07:07.199 --> 04:07:10.199
 dependent on um how we land with the

6198
04:07:11.199 --> 04:07:12.936
um residential

6199
04:07:12.960 --> 04:07:15.335
um commercial and industrial land use

6200
04:07:15.359 --> 04:07:17.335
strategy. Um it's a following the

6201
04:07:17.359 --> 04:07:20.295
bouncing ball process to amend an LEP.

6202
04:07:20.319 --> 04:07:21.896
Um it's no different to any other

6203
04:07:21.920 --> 04:07:23.736
planning proposal. would have to

6204
04:07:23.760 --> 04:07:26.760
demonstrate strategic merit um and sight

6205
04:07:26.880 --> 04:07:28.616
specific merit to some degree, but

6206
04:07:28.640 --> 04:07:30.856
strategic merit is reliant on those land

6207
04:07:30.880 --> 04:07:32.776
use strategies to support any decisions

6208
04:07:32.800 --> 04:07:35.415
we're making in the LEP itself. While

6209
04:07:35.439 --> 04:07:37.816
they're not legislated as such, you can

6210
04:07:37.840 --> 04:07:40.840
still move forward with an LEP. Um if

6211
04:07:41.199 --> 04:07:42.616
you're looking at making significant

6212
04:07:42.640 --> 04:07:44.616
changes, etc., it should be supported by

6213
04:07:44.640 --> 04:07:47.096
some level of strategic merit strategy.

6214
04:07:47.120 --> 04:07:48.536
It's a following the bouncing ball

6215
04:07:48.560 --> 04:07:51.560
process. um putting the cart for the

6216
04:07:52.000 --> 04:07:55.000
horse so to speak um basically can stall

6217
04:07:55.920 --> 04:07:58.920
a process um following the leap making

6218
04:07:58.960 --> 04:08:01.415
guidelines is council's um best way

6219
04:08:01.439 --> 04:08:04.439
moving forward. It is a timely process

6220
04:08:04.800 --> 04:08:07.800
um for a comprehensive LEP um or a

6221
04:08:08.720 --> 04:08:11.720
complex planning proposal um from end to

6222
04:08:12.560 --> 04:08:15.560
end um once um the report comes to

6223
04:08:16.080 --> 04:08:17.496
council for gateway you're looking at

6224
04:08:17.520 --> 04:08:20.215
420 days

6225
04:08:20.239 --> 04:08:22.136
councelor if there's no further debate

6226
04:08:22.160 --> 04:08:24.616
council would you reuse would you like

6227
04:08:24.640 --> 04:08:25.656
your right of reply

6228
04:08:25.680 --> 04:08:28.375
yes thank you um

6229
04:08:28.399 --> 04:08:30.856
madame deputy may I want to say just

6230
04:08:30.880 --> 04:08:33.736
what a responsive and pliable counselor

6231
04:08:33.760 --> 04:08:36.536
I am. I'm always responsive to great

6232
04:08:36.560 --> 04:08:39.496
arguments from people of great school

6233
04:08:39.520 --> 04:08:42.455
and go on

6234
04:08:42.479 --> 04:08:45.479
and councelor Rooney and  councelor

6235
04:08:46.239 --> 04:08:48.375
Rooney reminded us about six months ago

6236
04:08:48.399 --> 04:08:49.976
that we're not living in North Korea

6237
04:08:50.000 --> 04:08:52.936
yet. So, um we don't need to be um sort

6238
04:08:52.960 --> 04:08:55.335
of out there with the the ecoourism

6239
04:08:55.359 --> 04:08:57.496
police, although I'd like to be

6240
04:08:57.520 --> 04:08:59.016
appointed as one of those when that

6241
04:08:59.040 --> 04:09:02.040
position comes up. But I think what I've

6242
04:09:02.080 --> 04:09:04.215
realized is that we don't want to

6243
04:09:04.239 --> 04:09:06.936
actually as councelor Steuart up says

6244
04:09:06.960 --> 04:09:08.215
overcook it.

6245
04:09:08.239 --> 04:09:10.295
So I don't want to put an extra load on

6246
04:09:10.319 --> 04:09:12.056
staff to do this. But I think this is an

6247
04:09:12.080 --> 04:09:13.816
intermediate position which says well

6248
04:09:13.840 --> 04:09:16.840
look let's have a look at some options

6249
04:09:17.120 --> 04:09:19.415
for how we can actually change if we

6250
04:09:19.439 --> 04:09:21.736
needed to in this area. I'm very

6251
04:09:21.760 --> 04:09:23.415
supportive of ecoourism because they've

6252
04:09:23.439 --> 04:09:26.439
actually been an overall net net benefit

6253
04:09:26.479 --> 04:09:29.016
I'm certain for our region and the snowy

6254
04:09:29.040 --> 04:09:31.896
the old snowy river area has benefited

6255
04:09:31.920 --> 04:09:34.455
from ecoourism.

6256
04:09:34.479 --> 04:09:36.696
There is though a perception that there

6257
04:09:36.720 --> 04:09:39.496
may be this might be being rotted to

6258
04:09:39.520 --> 04:09:42.295
some degree and people have to jump

6259
04:09:42.319 --> 04:09:45.319
through hoops to show that they are 

6260
04:09:45.680 --> 04:09:48.680
ecoourism and so they may or may not be

6261
04:09:48.880 --> 04:09:50.856
but we at least need to be consistent

6262
04:09:50.880 --> 04:09:52.215
and we don't need to have compliance

6263
04:09:52.239 --> 04:09:55.016
offices every everywhere. So I think if

6264
04:09:55.040 --> 04:09:57.016
we just put this into the overall

6265
04:09:57.040 --> 04:09:59.255
strategy it just gets lost in the noise.

6266
04:09:59.279 --> 04:10:02.279
So, it seems good for us to try and give

6267
04:10:02.319 --> 04:10:05.319
some focus on it to see what we might be

6268
04:10:05.600 --> 04:10:07.175
able to do to improve our policy. It

6269
04:10:07.199 --> 04:10:09.096
might be nothing and we might be fine to

6270
04:10:09.120 --> 04:10:12.120
do it some the way we are. It seems

6271
04:10:12.319 --> 04:10:14.056
significant that we've had this on our

6272
04:10:14.080 --> 04:10:17.080
books. Um, councelor Davis, you're the

6273
04:10:17.279 --> 04:10:19.016
most experienced person here. What when

6274
04:10:19.040 --> 04:10:21.736
would this have come into the leap that

6275
04:10:21.760 --> 04:10:23.096
would have come into the Snowy River

6276
04:10:23.120 --> 04:10:25.255
region? Would it would it have been 15

6277
04:10:25.279 --> 04:10:28.279
years ago? 2013

6278
04:10:28.319 --> 04:10:30.455
right of apply so no no new information

6279
04:10:30.479 --> 04:10:32.056
in a right of apply where there is a

6280
04:10:32.080 --> 04:10:33.816
process that's new information I'm

6281
04:10:33.840 --> 04:10:34.856
afraid counselor rose

6282
04:10:34.880 --> 04:10:36.215
oh thank you

6283
04:10:36.239 --> 04:10:38.215
2 minutes 53

6284
04:10:38.239 --> 04:10:40.455
but in any case there was obviously a

6285
04:10:40.479 --> 04:10:43.479
good reason why it's been there  and I

6286
04:10:43.760 --> 04:10:46.536
think we need to you know acknowledge

6287
04:10:46.560 --> 04:10:48.056
that and we don't want to do something

6288
04:10:48.080 --> 04:10:50.856
that's going to um you know cause

6289
04:10:50.880 --> 04:10:52.696
further problems for us but we do need

6290
04:10:52.720 --> 04:10:55.175
to actually consider this whole story

6291
04:10:55.199 --> 04:10:57.736
because a number of people have spoken

6292
04:10:57.760 --> 04:10:59.335
to me about it and are concerned about

6293
04:10:59.359 --> 04:11:02.359
it. And so I think um we've taken away

6294
04:11:02.479 --> 04:11:04.136
the the big piece of work. We've taken

6295
04:11:04.160 --> 04:11:06.936
away the compliance story and um

6296
04:11:06.960 --> 04:11:09.415
councelor Rooney's concerned about

6297
04:11:09.439 --> 04:11:11.976
officers inspecting ski cars at 7:30 in

6298
04:11:12.000 --> 04:11:14.616
the morning in the data. So this looks

6299
04:11:14.640 --> 04:11:16.936
to be a reasonable option for us to at

6300
04:11:16.960 --> 04:11:19.255
least we can get some further ideas

6301
04:11:19.279 --> 04:11:20.856
about what and this might be able to be

6302
04:11:20.880 --> 04:11:22.536
fed well it will be fed into the overall

6303
04:11:22.560 --> 04:11:24.776
strategy. So I think this is not a bad

6304
04:11:24.800 --> 04:11:25.976
solution.

6305
04:11:26.000 --> 04:11:27.175
Thank you. With that, I put the motion.

6306
04:11:27.199 --> 04:11:29.496
All those in favor,

6307
04:11:29.520 --> 04:11:32.520
councilors Williamson, Rose, Elliot, and

6308
04:11:33.920 --> 04:11:36.776
Hopkins. Those against, Councelor

6309
04:11:36.800 --> 04:11:39.800
Summers, Higgins, Stewart, Rooney,

6310
04:11:40.319 --> 04:11:42.056
Davis.

6311
04:11:42.080 --> 04:11:45.080
Messions lost. You um so moving on to

6312
04:11:45.760 --> 04:11:48.455
11.9. Um, councelor Rose, before

6313
04:11:48.479 --> 04:11:49.816
commencing debate, would you like to

6314
04:11:49.840 --> 04:11:51.496
proceed with me asking for a second or

6315
04:11:51.520 --> 04:11:54.136
would you like to withdraw the motion?

6316
04:11:54.160 --> 04:11:56.536
The regular staffing update we're on to.

6317
04:11:56.560 --> 04:11:57.175
Yes.

6318
04:11:57.199 --> 04:12:00.056
Um, which one? I'll put that motion on

6319
04:12:00.080 --> 04:12:00.936
page three.

6320
04:12:00.960 --> 04:12:02.536
Thank you. Um, in that case, so moved by

6321
04:12:02.560 --> 04:12:04.295
councelor Rose. Do I have a second? It's

6322
04:12:04.319 --> 04:12:07.319
item  11.9 regular staffing update

6323
04:12:07.439 --> 04:12:09.656
seconded by councelor Williamson.

6324
04:12:09.680 --> 04:12:11.175
Councelor Rose,

6325
04:12:11.199 --> 04:12:13.255
I'll read the motion of the council

6326
04:12:13.279 --> 04:12:16.279
receive a quarterly report outlining one

6327
04:12:16.399 --> 04:12:18.136
the current total headcount of council

6328
04:12:18.160 --> 04:12:21.160
full-time council staff full-time,

6329
04:12:21.359 --> 04:12:23.335
part-time and casual to the number of

6330
04:12:23.359 --> 04:12:25.175
vacant positions by directorate and

6331
04:12:25.199 --> 04:12:27.335
three the number of positions being

6332
04:12:27.359 --> 04:12:29.415
temporarily backfilled through external

6333
04:12:29.439 --> 04:12:32.439
consultancies and and contractors.

6334
04:12:35.680 --> 04:12:38.536
So, Madame Deputy May, this is a a

6335
04:12:38.560 --> 04:12:41.560
simple motion, I think. Um, it's about

6336
04:12:41.600 --> 04:12:43.335
strengthening transparency and

6337
04:12:43.359 --> 04:12:45.896
accountability around council's most

6338
04:12:45.920 --> 04:12:47.255
important resource, that is the

6339
04:12:47.279 --> 04:12:48.936
workforce.

6340
04:12:48.960 --> 04:12:51.096
Staffing levels, vacancies, and turnover

6341
04:12:51.120 --> 04:12:52.936
have a direct impact on the delivery of

6342
04:12:52.960 --> 04:12:55.335
our services, community satisfaction,

6343
04:12:55.359 --> 04:12:57.335
and and our financial sustainability.

6344
04:12:57.359 --> 04:12:59.415
and we discovered towards the end of the

6345
04:12:59.439 --> 04:13:02.295
last year that um that we had 38

6346
04:13:02.319 --> 04:13:05.096
vacancies in one particular area and

6347
04:13:05.120 --> 04:13:08.120
that was a shock to me. So

6348
04:13:08.239 --> 04:13:09.656
we can see it's actually difficult to

6349
04:13:09.680 --> 04:13:11.896
recruit and retain skilled staff in

6350
04:13:11.920 --> 04:13:13.896
areas like planning, project delivery

6351
04:13:13.920 --> 04:13:16.776
and engineering. Um and we've seen also

6352
04:13:16.800 --> 04:13:18.295
even we've had it confirmed today that

6353
04:13:18.319 --> 04:13:20.616
small shifts in staffing can have a

6354
04:13:20.640 --> 04:13:23.175
significant consequences in areas such

6355
04:13:23.199 --> 04:13:26.199
as water. So what I'm proposing is not a

6356
04:13:27.120 --> 04:13:29.096
complex or ownorous story. It's really

6357
04:13:29.120 --> 04:13:30.936
simply that we receive regular summary

6358
04:13:30.960 --> 04:13:33.960
updates perhaps quarterly on the staff

6359
04:13:34.319 --> 04:13:36.135
numbers, vacancies, recruitment activity

6360
04:13:36.159 --> 04:13:38.696
and workforce trends. This is obviously

6361
04:13:38.720 --> 04:13:40.455
all within a system. It should be in the

6362
04:13:40.479 --> 04:13:42.375
HR system. You push a button and you get

6363
04:13:42.399 --> 04:13:44.295
that information. So this is not a huge

6364
04:13:44.319 --> 04:13:46.375
amount of work.

6365
04:13:46.399 --> 04:13:47.976
Many other councils I've discovered

6366
04:13:48.000 --> 04:13:49.576
already provide this information as part

6367
04:13:49.600 --> 04:13:52.375
of their routine governance reports. But

6368
04:13:52.399 --> 04:13:54.375
having this visibility helps councilors

6369
04:13:54.399 --> 04:13:55.816
make better informed decisions on

6370
04:13:55.840 --> 04:13:57.576
budgets, resourcing and community

6371
04:13:57.600 --> 04:14:00.536
expectations. It also helps to ensure

6372
04:14:00.560 --> 04:14:02.295
that when we discuss performance or

6373
04:14:02.319 --> 04:14:03.736
project delays, we understanding

6374
04:14:03.760 --> 04:14:06.215
staffing realities that are behind them.

6375
04:14:06.239 --> 04:14:08.936
So importantly, this is not about

6376
04:14:08.960 --> 04:14:11.255
interfering in management. It's about

6377
04:14:11.279 --> 04:14:13.816
ensuring council as the governing body

6378
04:14:13.840 --> 04:14:16.840
has the information it needs to fulfill

6379
04:14:16.880 --> 04:14:18.135
its strategic oversight

6380
04:14:18.159 --> 04:14:20.295
responsibilities.

6381
04:14:20.319 --> 04:14:22.215
The CEO hasn't raised any objection to

6382
04:14:22.239 --> 04:14:24.056
the proposal and I believe the regular

6383
04:14:24.080 --> 04:14:25.496
staffing update will become a

6384
04:14:25.520 --> 04:14:27.896
constructive and fact-based tool that

6385
04:14:27.920 --> 04:14:29.736
benefits both counselors and the

6386
04:14:29.760 --> 04:14:31.976
organization. Thank you.

6387
04:14:32.000 --> 04:14:35.000
Thank you.  speaker question.

6388
04:14:35.199 --> 04:14:36.936
Yes. Through to the CEO.

6389
04:14:36.960 --> 04:14:39.576
Yeah. Just in the response

6390
04:14:39.600 --> 04:14:42.536
to the um to the motion can quality

6391
04:14:42.560 --> 04:14:45.016
reporting from the February 26. So we're

6392
04:14:45.040 --> 04:14:47.096
talking about March for the previous

6393
04:14:47.120 --> 04:14:48.135
financial order.

6394
04:14:48.159 --> 04:14:50.375
Um through you, Madam Chair. When this

6395
04:14:50.399 --> 04:14:51.816
notice of motion was put up, it was

6396
04:14:51.840 --> 04:14:53.175
actually last year. This one's been

6397
04:14:53.199 --> 04:14:54.696
carried over. So that's the reason why

6398
04:14:54.720 --> 04:14:56.375
that comment hasn't actually been

6399
04:14:56.399 --> 04:14:58.455
updated. But in terms of just for

6400
04:14:58.479 --> 04:15:00.936
council  Rose's consideration, is it

6401
04:15:00.960 --> 04:15:02.936
something that we could um say that it

6402
04:15:02.960 --> 04:15:05.016
goes into the quarterly report when we

6403
04:15:05.040 --> 04:15:06.776
do our delivery program reporting?

6404
04:15:06.800 --> 04:15:08.696
Because this would be I guess a a

6405
04:15:08.720 --> 04:15:10.936
workforce management strategy.

6406
04:15:10.960 --> 04:15:11.496
Yeah.

6407
04:15:11.520 --> 04:15:14.520
Yeah. Yeah, I speak against the motion.

6408
04:15:16.960 --> 04:15:18.215
Davis,

6409
04:15:18.239 --> 04:15:20.215
um

6410
04:15:20.239 --> 04:15:23.239
I I'm really struggling to understand

6411
04:15:23.359 --> 04:15:26.359
the relevance of that reporting unless

6412
04:15:27.040 --> 04:15:29.415
it's actually based on what are the

6413
04:15:29.439 --> 04:15:32.439
risks in regard to the vacant positions

6414
04:15:33.199 --> 04:15:35.736
and actually being able to undertake our

6415
04:15:35.760 --> 04:15:38.455
service delivery as required.

6416
04:15:38.479 --> 04:15:41.335
So, as it currently stands, I'm really

6417
04:15:41.359 --> 04:15:43.816
struggling why we would actually need

6418
04:15:43.840 --> 04:15:46.215
that information quarterly unless we

6419
04:15:46.239 --> 04:15:49.239
actually had a substantive report around

6420
04:15:49.439 --> 04:15:52.375
the risk of not being able to fulfill

6421
04:15:52.399 --> 04:15:55.399
thill those positions. Um, not being

6422
04:15:55.439 --> 04:15:57.576
able to actually have full-time

6423
04:15:57.600 --> 04:15:59.496
positions if if we have part-time

6424
04:15:59.520 --> 04:16:01.415
positions. So, do we need a full-time

6425
04:16:01.439 --> 04:16:03.816
person? We only have a part-time person.

6426
04:16:03.840 --> 04:16:05.335
 what are the risks to the

6427
04:16:05.359 --> 04:16:08.359
organization in regard to our vacancies

6428
04:16:09.199 --> 04:16:12.199
and then  what are the shortfalls in

6429
04:16:12.239 --> 04:16:15.239
regard to engaging consultancies or is a

6430
04:16:15.680 --> 04:16:17.576
consultancy actually a better value for

6431
04:16:17.600 --> 04:16:20.600
money. So it needs to have context and

6432
04:16:21.279 --> 04:16:24.279
at the moment has the the motion stands

6433
04:16:24.640 --> 04:16:27.016
or the resolution stands it has no

6434
04:16:27.040 --> 04:16:29.656
context. So we would get numbers and we

6435
04:16:29.680 --> 04:16:31.976
we could just draw our own conclusions.

6436
04:16:32.000 --> 04:16:33.656
I'd actually like to see it as a risk

6437
04:16:33.680 --> 04:16:36.616
based report in regard to our workforce

6438
04:16:36.640 --> 04:16:39.496
issues.

6439
04:16:39.520 --> 04:16:42.520
Thank you, speaker.

6440
04:16:44.080 --> 04:16:46.936
, councelor Rose.

6441
04:16:46.960 --> 04:16:48.215
Thank you.

6442
04:16:48.239 --> 04:16:50.616
Um, I agree with councelor Davis. I

6443
04:16:50.640 --> 04:16:52.536
think the issue of risk is important in

6444
04:16:52.560 --> 04:16:55.560
relation to this and I suppose in a way

6445
04:16:55.840 --> 04:16:58.616
councelor Davis I think that the the

6446
04:16:58.640 --> 04:17:01.016
data speaks for itself. So for instance,

6447
04:17:01.040 --> 04:17:02.936
we found out quite late that we had 38

6448
04:17:02.960 --> 04:17:05.960
vacancies in a very significant area the

6449
04:17:06.720 --> 04:17:08.295
it would be nice to have that on a

6450
04:17:08.319 --> 04:17:11.096
regular story because then we can move

6451
04:17:11.120 --> 04:17:13.255
some motions about what might be or the

6452
04:17:13.279 --> 04:17:15.016
the staff themselves can report to us.

6453
04:17:15.040 --> 04:17:17.175
So I feel the first part of the story is

6454
04:17:17.199 --> 04:17:20.199
getting data and what we our governance

6455
04:17:20.800 --> 04:17:22.936
responsibility is to see well if there

6456
04:17:22.960 --> 04:17:24.696
are some real gaps what are the risks

6457
04:17:24.720 --> 04:17:27.415
and then what we can actually make some

6458
04:17:27.439 --> 04:17:29.175
some discussions about what to do about

6459
04:17:29.199 --> 04:17:32.199
it. I I don't think that um that there's

6460
04:17:32.720 --> 04:17:35.720
any downside to this and I take your

6461
04:17:36.000 --> 04:17:37.576
point but I think that we probably need

6462
04:17:37.600 --> 04:17:40.135
to have follow on about the implications

6463
04:17:40.159 --> 04:17:41.335
of it because

6464
04:17:41.359 --> 04:17:43.496
in the case of of what happened

6465
04:17:43.520 --> 04:17:45.096
previously there was a number of

6466
04:17:45.120 --> 04:17:47.016
consultancies that were that filled the

6467
04:17:47.040 --> 04:17:49.175
gap or in some cases the gap wasn't

6468
04:17:49.199 --> 04:17:51.576
filled but if you think of 38 if you

6469
04:17:51.600 --> 04:17:53.656
think of 38 vacancies there's around4

6470
04:17:53.680 --> 04:17:56.680
million um dollars in in expenditure and

6471
04:17:58.080 --> 04:18:00.616
I suppose that's a very big change in

6472
04:18:00.640 --> 04:18:03.415
our budget in terms of what's what money

6473
04:18:03.439 --> 04:18:05.496
that hasn't been spent, but also it's a

6474
04:18:05.520 --> 04:18:06.936
very significant issue in terms of work

6475
04:18:06.960 --> 04:18:09.736
that isn't being done. So to me, I just

6476
04:18:09.760 --> 04:18:11.896
think having the data is good. If it's

6477
04:18:11.920 --> 04:18:13.335
part of our quarterly reporting process,

6478
04:18:13.359 --> 04:18:15.175
it's easy for us to do and then we can

6479
04:18:15.199 --> 04:18:17.175
actually work out if there is if there

6480
04:18:17.199 --> 04:18:19.335
are issues or not. I think the issues

6481
04:18:19.359 --> 04:18:21.976
are lessening, madame deputy mayor, than

6482
04:18:22.000 --> 04:18:24.375
than we had in the situation before

6483
04:18:24.399 --> 04:18:26.375
because we haven't had the story of 38

6484
04:18:26.399 --> 04:18:28.295
vacancies. But it's clear in some areas

6485
04:18:28.319 --> 04:18:30.455
we've got some significant problems in

6486
04:18:30.479 --> 04:18:32.135
recruitment. Um and it particularly

6487
04:18:32.159 --> 04:18:34.056
looks like in the sort of water

6488
04:18:34.080 --> 04:18:36.536
wastewater area as a as a problem for

6489
04:18:36.560 --> 04:18:38.375
us. So I think this will just give us

6490
04:18:38.399 --> 04:18:39.976
information that we can then use to the

6491
04:18:40.000 --> 04:18:41.896
next step. But I I take councelor

6492
04:18:41.920 --> 04:18:43.736
Davis's point. Well,

6493
04:18:43.760 --> 04:18:45.175
thank you. With that, I put the motion.

6494
04:18:45.199 --> 04:18:48.199
All those in favor, councelors

6495
04:18:48.319 --> 04:18:49.976
Williamson,

6496
04:18:50.000 --> 04:18:53.000
Rose, Rooney, Elliot, and Hopkins. All

6497
04:18:53.520 --> 04:18:56.520
those against council summers Higgins

6498
04:18:57.120 --> 04:19:00.120
Stewart Davis the motion is carried.

6499
04:19:02.560 --> 04:19:05.560
Now um council item 11.11 before I move

6500
04:19:05.760 --> 04:19:08.375
to a procedural motion can I confirm is

6501
04:19:08.399 --> 04:19:10.776
is this motion proceeding or going to be

6502
04:19:10.800 --> 04:19:13.800
withdrawn? Proceeding.

6503
04:19:14.239 --> 04:19:17.239
Well pard me I'd like to defer it. No

6504
04:19:18.640 --> 04:19:19.896
poor people. Um,

6505
04:19:19.920 --> 04:19:20.536
no.

6506
04:19:20.560 --> 04:19:22.375
Okay. In in that case, councilors, I

6507
04:19:22.399 --> 04:19:23.976
have a um a conflict of interest with

6508
04:19:24.000 --> 04:19:26.295
this motion. So, I would  like to call

6509
04:19:26.319 --> 04:19:27.976
for a nomination for somebody to chair

6510
04:19:28.000 --> 04:19:30.536
item 11-11. We have a nomination for a

6511
04:19:30.560 --> 04:19:31.096
chair.

6512
04:19:31.120 --> 04:19:31.976
Yeah, I'll do it.

6513
04:19:32.000 --> 04:19:33.896
Councelor Higgins, any other further

6514
04:19:33.920 --> 04:19:35.415
nominations?

6515
04:19:35.439 --> 04:19:37.255
, those in favor for councelor Higgins

6516
04:19:37.279 --> 04:19:40.279
to chair item 1111.

6517
04:19:40.720 --> 04:19:43.496
, I I'm not sure. Councelor Summers,

6518
04:19:43.520 --> 04:19:45.896
Stewart,

6519
04:19:45.920 --> 04:19:47.656
unanimous.

6520
04:19:47.680 --> 04:19:50.680
Excuse me. Um are you required to state

6521
04:19:52.159 --> 04:19:53.656
the nature of your conflict?

6522
04:19:53.680 --> 04:19:56.375
 yes I did um last

6523
04:19:56.399 --> 04:19:58.616
Thursday. I have a business relationship

6524
04:19:58.640 --> 04:20:00.696
which um causes me significant conflict

6525
04:20:00.720 --> 04:20:02.936
and I will remove myself from the red.

6526
04:20:02.960 --> 04:20:05.960
Thank you.

6527
04:20:06.159 --> 04:20:08.295
Which one's the

6528
04:20:08.319 --> 04:20:11.319
um 11 point

6529
04:20:12.800 --> 04:20:15.800
that I don't think it could be withdrawn

6530
04:20:15.840 --> 04:20:18.135
because of the time frame. It's a

6531
04:20:18.159 --> 04:20:20.936
recision motion.

6532
04:20:20.960 --> 04:20:22.936
Are we proceeding with this motion?

6533
04:20:22.960 --> 04:20:23.816
Yes.

6534
04:20:23.840 --> 04:20:25.496
Yes. Think so.

6535
04:20:25.520 --> 04:20:27.656
I'll move I move that we proceed with

6536
04:20:27.680 --> 04:20:28.696
the motion.

6537
04:20:28.720 --> 04:20:29.816
Second.

6538
04:20:29.840 --> 04:20:31.576
Who would like to speak to the motion

6539
04:20:31.600 --> 04:20:34.600
then since there's three?

6540
04:20:36.720 --> 04:20:37.976
Yeah.

6541
04:20:38.000 --> 04:20:39.896
I just I just move that we weren't going

6542
04:20:39.920 --> 04:20:42.536
to withdraw it but we proceed with

6543
04:20:42.560 --> 04:20:45.560
Rooney. Are you moving this motion? 

6544
04:20:45.920 --> 04:20:47.976
no. Look by.

6545
04:20:48.000 --> 04:20:49.175
Yes or no?

6546
04:20:49.199 --> 04:20:52.056
Oh, but I'm speaking to it. It's been

6547
04:20:52.080 --> 04:20:53.016
moved by C.

6548
04:20:53.040 --> 04:20:56.040
We have I only move that we proceed with

6549
04:20:56.399 --> 04:20:59.399
with the with the motion that's in front

6550
04:20:59.520 --> 04:21:00.696
of I haven't moved.

6551
04:21:00.720 --> 04:21:03.720
I have a mover for this motion. No. Are

6552
04:21:04.800 --> 04:21:05.255
we

6553
04:21:05.279 --> 04:21:06.616
I'll move.

6554
04:21:06.640 --> 04:21:08.455
Thank you, councelor Williamson.

6555
04:21:08.479 --> 04:21:11.175
Do we have a seconder for this motion?

6556
04:21:11.199 --> 04:21:13.736
Councelor Renie. Thank you. Councelor

6557
04:21:13.760 --> 04:21:15.096
Williamson, would you like to speak to

6558
04:21:15.120 --> 04:21:18.120
this motion?

6559
04:21:18.239 --> 04:21:21.239
, yes. Thank you.

6560
04:21:24.479 --> 04:21:27.096
, the clock is going.

6561
04:21:27.120 --> 04:21:27.736
One second.

6562
04:21:27.760 --> 04:21:27.976
Okay.

6563
04:21:28.000 --> 04:21:29.016
I won't take all five.

6564
04:21:29.040 --> 04:21:32.040
No, that's all right. Just making sure.

6565
04:21:34.159 --> 04:21:37.159
Maybe you could pause it.

6566
04:21:39.279 --> 04:21:42.279
Yeah. So I I having reflected on um 

6567
04:21:44.560 --> 04:21:47.016
the debate at the last  last time this

6568
04:21:47.040 --> 04:21:50.040
motion came up and um having thought

6569
04:21:50.640 --> 04:21:53.255
more about the situation. I I think we

6570
04:21:53.279 --> 04:21:55.736
got it wrong.  for that reason, I was

6571
04:21:55.760 --> 04:21:58.760
happy for the recision motion to come

6572
04:21:58.960 --> 04:22:01.960
forward.  I  agree  with the

6573
04:22:03.359 --> 04:22:05.896
details in section B and I would commend

6574
04:22:05.920 --> 04:22:08.920
it to colleagues to accept

6575
04:22:09.920 --> 04:22:12.920
Thank you, Council Williamson. Anyone to

6576
04:22:13.199 --> 04:22:16.199
speak against this motion? Councelor

6577
04:22:17.120 --> 04:22:17.736
Rose.

6578
04:22:17.760 --> 04:22:20.760
Um, thanks,

6579
04:22:21.359 --> 04:22:23.576
Madame acting chair. Is it?

6580
04:22:23.600 --> 04:22:25.335
Yes, madame chair. Sorry.

6581
04:22:25.359 --> 04:22:27.656
Thank you. Um, look,

6582
04:22:27.680 --> 04:22:28.936
madame acting chair,

6583
04:22:28.960 --> 04:22:31.496
I do oppose the decision motion. I I

6584
04:22:31.520 --> 04:22:33.096
really realize that reasonable people

6585
04:22:33.120 --> 04:22:35.415
can disagree on planning matters, but I

6586
04:22:35.439 --> 04:22:36.776
don't believe there's any new planning

6587
04:22:36.800 --> 04:22:38.776
information before us that justifies

6588
04:22:38.800 --> 04:22:41.175
advert

6589
04:22:41.199 --> 04:22:43.896
in December. So in December, the

6590
04:22:43.920 --> 04:22:45.656
majority of council carefully considered

6591
04:22:45.680 --> 04:22:47.816
the application against the statutory

6592
04:22:47.840 --> 04:22:50.840
framework of 4.15 of the environmental

6593
04:22:50.960 --> 04:22:53.175
planning assessment act and the decision

6594
04:22:53.199 --> 04:22:55.415
to refuse consent was not emotional or

6595
04:22:55.439 --> 04:22:57.175
political or anti- business. It was

6596
04:22:57.199 --> 04:23:00.199
grounded in planning principles and

6597
04:23:00.319 --> 04:23:01.976
really councilors had received

6598
04:23:02.000 --> 04:23:03.576
wellressearched feedback from local

6599
04:23:03.600 --> 04:23:05.816
residents about the development that I

6600
04:23:05.840 --> 04:23:07.656
believe argued successfully that

6601
04:23:07.680 --> 04:23:10.056
development should be refused.

6602
04:23:10.080 --> 04:23:11.896
The core issue remains unchanged. That

6603
04:23:11.920 --> 04:23:13.976
is this is an industrial style freight

6604
04:23:14.000 --> 04:23:15.896
transport facility proposed within an

6605
04:23:15.920 --> 04:23:18.776
RU1 primary production zone. Now the

6606
04:23:18.800 --> 04:23:21.415
purpose of RU1 zoning is clear. is to

6607
04:23:21.439 --> 04:23:23.016
protect the land for primary production,

6608
04:23:23.040 --> 04:23:25.335
minimize land use conflict, avoid

6609
04:23:25.359 --> 04:23:27.096
development that generates significant

6610
04:23:27.120 --> 04:23:29.016
additional traffic on rural roads and

6611
04:23:29.040 --> 04:23:32.040
protects rural landscape character.

6612
04:23:32.399 --> 04:23:34.696
The freight transport depot with he

6613
04:23:34.720 --> 04:23:36.375
heavy vehicles, hard stand, extended

6614
04:23:36.399 --> 04:23:38.856
hours and frequent truck movements is

6615
04:23:38.880 --> 04:23:41.175
not rural support activity. It's

6616
04:23:41.199 --> 04:23:43.576
industrial in character. It's

6617
04:23:43.600 --> 04:23:45.576
fundamentally incompatible and that

6618
04:23:45.600 --> 04:23:47.896
hasn't changed. The traffic issue

6619
04:23:47.920 --> 04:23:50.920
remains unresolved. Carlinda road is as

6620
04:23:51.439 --> 04:23:54.439
a narrow road the the the agreed areas

6621
04:23:56.239 --> 04:23:58.536
that the we received the information

6622
04:23:58.560 --> 04:24:00.135
about about upgrading it's just not

6623
04:24:00.159 --> 04:24:03.159
going to cut cut the mustard  and it's

6624
04:24:03.600 --> 04:24:05.255
not going to do the job. We've also got

6625
04:24:05.279 --> 04:24:08.279
the issue that we saw more recently of

6626
04:24:08.399 --> 04:24:11.096
the significant impact of fog on that

6627
04:24:11.120 --> 04:24:14.120
road. So we ask ourselves a simple

6628
04:24:14.560 --> 04:24:16.536
question. If a development requires

6629
04:24:16.560 --> 04:24:18.375
significant upgrades to a rural road

6630
04:24:18.399 --> 04:24:21.175
just to make it safe,

6631
04:24:21.199 --> 04:24:22.936
is that not evidence the site is

6632
04:24:22.960 --> 04:24:25.656
fundamentally unsuitable? That's a a

6633
04:24:25.680 --> 04:24:27.335
question I think has answered itself.

6634
04:24:27.359 --> 04:24:30.056
Yes, it does. Third, amenity aspects.

6635
04:24:30.080 --> 04:24:31.816
The proposal involves heavy vehicle

6636
04:24:31.840 --> 04:24:34.455
movements over extended hours, including

6637
04:24:34.479 --> 04:24:36.375
early morning operations. This is

6638
04:24:36.399 --> 04:24:38.375
inconsistent with the quiet enjoyment of

6639
04:24:38.399 --> 04:24:40.696
nearby rural residences.

6640
04:24:40.720 --> 04:24:42.455
Rural amenity is not an abstract

6641
04:24:42.479 --> 04:24:45.096
concept. It's the the lived experience

6642
04:24:45.120 --> 04:24:47.415
of residents whom we've heard from and

6643
04:24:47.439 --> 04:24:49.415
they live there pricly precisely because

6644
04:24:49.439 --> 04:24:51.175
it is a rural zone, not because it's

6645
04:24:51.199 --> 04:24:52.936
industrial land.

6646
04:24:52.960 --> 04:24:55.335
Fourthly, suitability. There's a need

6647
04:24:55.359 --> 04:24:57.255
for extensive earthworks, hard stand

6648
04:24:57.279 --> 04:24:58.616
mitigation measures and traffic

6649
04:24:58.640 --> 04:25:00.696
management for solutions demonstrates

6650
04:25:00.720 --> 04:25:03.415
this site is being adapted to suit the

6651
04:25:03.439 --> 04:25:05.096
proposal rather than proposal being

6652
04:25:05.120 --> 04:25:07.415
searched at the site.

6653
04:25:07.439 --> 04:25:09.576
Certainly I understand the problem and

6654
04:25:09.600 --> 04:25:11.016
I'm sympathetic with the problem but

6655
04:25:11.040 --> 04:25:13.816
it's no good imposing a solution on

6656
04:25:13.840 --> 04:25:15.496
residents that would actually make the

6657
04:25:15.520 --> 04:25:18.520
life of residents just miserable.

6658
04:25:18.960 --> 04:25:21.960
So public interest is the final part and

6659
04:25:22.159 --> 04:25:23.976
we we often speak about the integrity of

6660
04:25:24.000 --> 04:25:26.616
our planning fra framework. If we

6661
04:25:26.640 --> 04:25:28.936
improve if we approve industrial style

6662
04:25:28.960 --> 04:25:31.960
freight depots in RU1 land we dilute the

6663
04:25:32.399 --> 04:25:34.936
meaning of zoning. If our U1 can

6664
04:25:34.960 --> 04:25:37.335
accommodate this, then what can it not

6665
04:25:37.359 --> 04:25:40.295
accommodate? Once a precedent is set, it

6666
04:25:40.319 --> 04:25:42.295
becomes very difficult to defend future

6667
04:25:42.319 --> 04:25:43.816
refusals.

6668
04:25:43.840 --> 04:25:46.375
I also think just as an aside, we end up

6669
04:25:46.399 --> 04:25:48.776
with a range of compliance issues. Truck

6670
04:25:48.800 --> 04:25:51.335
movements, was it 5 to 5 rather than

6671
04:25:51.359 --> 04:25:54.359
5:00? Did they ext extend up through

6672
04:25:54.800 --> 04:25:57.576
past 8:00 at night? What are the issues?

6673
04:25:57.600 --> 04:25:59.736
Was is the road suitable? So, we end up

6674
04:25:59.760 --> 04:26:01.816
with a whole lot of downstream issues

6675
04:26:01.840 --> 04:26:04.840
then. So I think the December decision

6676
04:26:05.680 --> 04:26:07.255
actually reflected the genuine and

6677
04:26:07.279 --> 04:26:08.856
reasonable concerns of residents in the

6678
04:26:08.880 --> 04:26:10.375
area. We've had a couple of different

6679
04:26:10.399 --> 04:26:13.016
presentations. Those are not abstract

6680
04:26:13.040 --> 04:26:14.856
objections. They are practical concerns

6681
04:26:14.880 --> 04:26:17.576
about traffic safety, noise, and rural

6682
04:26:17.600 --> 04:26:19.656
character. The council listened,

6683
04:26:19.680 --> 04:26:21.096
assessed the proposal against the law,

6684
04:26:21.120 --> 04:26:23.816
and made a decision. So recision motion

6685
04:26:23.840 --> 04:26:25.576
shouldn't be used simply because some

6686
04:26:25.600 --> 04:26:27.335
counselors regret a vote or wish for a

6687
04:26:27.359 --> 04:26:28.616
different outcome. neighbor should be

6688
04:26:28.640 --> 04:26:30.135
reserved for situations where new

6689
04:26:30.159 --> 04:26:33.159
information emerges and when a material

6690
04:26:33.279 --> 04:26:35.896
error has occurred or where substantial

6691
04:26:35.920 --> 04:26:37.976
circumstances have changed. So there

6692
04:26:38.000 --> 04:26:40.696
hasn't been any such new information and

6693
04:26:40.720 --> 04:26:43.016
so for us to to revisit and overturn

6694
04:26:43.040 --> 04:26:45.175
such a properly made decision without

6695
04:26:45.199 --> 04:26:47.175
new planning grounds risks sending a

6696
04:26:47.199 --> 04:26:49.175
message that our determinations are

6697
04:26:49.199 --> 04:26:51.576
unstable and subject to repeated

6698
04:26:51.600 --> 04:26:54.600
political pressure. So madame chair I

6699
04:26:55.359 --> 04:26:57.816
say really without any hostility the

6700
04:26:57.840 --> 04:26:59.335
December decision was sound and

6701
04:26:59.359 --> 04:27:00.936
defensible and consistent with our

6702
04:27:00.960 --> 04:27:03.415
statutory obligations there was no

6703
04:27:03.439 --> 04:27:05.896
compelling planning basis to resend it

6704
04:27:05.920 --> 04:27:07.896
and so therefore for that reason I'll be

6705
04:27:07.920 --> 04:27:10.056
voting against the recision motion thank

6706
04:27:10.080 --> 04:27:11.415
you

6707
04:27:11.439 --> 04:27:13.736
thank you councelor Rose is there anyone

6708
04:27:13.760 --> 04:27:16.295
else who would like to speak for this

6709
04:27:16.319 --> 04:27:18.536
recision motion councelor Rooney

6710
04:27:18.560 --> 04:27:21.560
thank you and chair  look I speak for

6711
04:27:21.840 --> 04:27:24.840
the recision motion on grounds of  

6712
04:27:25.279 --> 04:27:28.279
a lack of procedural fairness. The the

6713
04:27:28.640 --> 04:27:31.640
project proponent  the um the owner of

6714
04:27:31.920 --> 04:27:34.375
Snowy Mountains Transport wanted to

6715
04:27:34.399 --> 04:27:37.175
present to council his case for why this

6716
04:27:37.199 --> 04:27:40.199
facility was needed.  he turned up to

6717
04:27:40.399 --> 04:27:43.255
our meeting in Ginderbine, but he was

6718
04:27:43.279 --> 04:27:46.215
blindsided by our change of meeting

6719
04:27:46.239 --> 04:27:48.696
format. Rather than starting the meeting

6720
04:27:48.720 --> 04:27:51.255
at 11:00, which is what he expected with

6721
04:27:51.279 --> 04:27:53.736
the public forum,  we had our public

6722
04:27:53.760 --> 04:27:56.760
forum at 11:00.  sorry, did I say

6723
04:27:56.800 --> 04:27:59.800
you know what I mean? Carted at 11:00.

6724
04:27:59.840 --> 04:28:01.976
He wasn't here cuz he expected it to

6725
04:28:02.000 --> 04:28:05.000
start at 1. So the project proponent has

6726
04:28:05.680 --> 04:28:08.536
not had the opportunity to put his side

6727
04:28:08.560 --> 04:28:11.560
of the story to council. So councelor

6728
04:28:13.040 --> 04:28:15.175
the reason why I was um wanting a

6729
04:28:15.199 --> 04:28:17.496
deferral  was to give him that

6730
04:28:17.520 --> 04:28:19.096
opportunity. He's not here today. He

6731
04:28:19.120 --> 04:28:20.616
didn't expect it to be considered today

6732
04:28:20.640 --> 04:28:23.640
either.  he he he wants he I think he

6733
04:28:24.560 --> 04:28:26.696
should be here.  he should make his

6734
04:28:26.720 --> 04:28:29.496
case for why this facility is needed and

6735
04:28:29.520 --> 04:28:32.135
councilor should be making a decision 

6736
04:28:32.159 --> 04:28:34.936
weighing up  both sides of the story.

6737
04:28:34.960 --> 04:28:37.335
Now, we've heard from  the residents

6738
04:28:37.359 --> 04:28:39.576
of Carlinda Road, and we have a lot of

6739
04:28:39.600 --> 04:28:42.135
sympathy for their concerns, but we have

6740
04:28:42.159 --> 04:28:45.159
not heard from the owner  and and in

6741
04:28:45.279 --> 04:28:47.175
his absence, I guess it falls to me to

6742
04:28:47.199 --> 04:28:50.199
try and make his case for him.  which

6743
04:28:51.359 --> 04:28:52.776
I'm not really well qualified to do

6744
04:28:52.800 --> 04:28:54.295
because I don't know his circumstance

6745
04:28:54.319 --> 04:28:56.455
that much. But let me just say in broad

6746
04:28:56.479 --> 04:28:57.976
generalities

6747
04:28:58.000 --> 04:29:01.000
 this is a new  and growing business

6748
04:29:01.680 --> 04:29:04.680
which is servicing the needs for for 

6749
04:29:04.880 --> 04:29:06.375
kuma and the same in our region

6750
04:29:06.399 --> 04:29:09.175
generally for for transport as a result

6751
04:29:09.199 --> 04:29:11.335
of our growth and that's a good thing

6752
04:29:11.359 --> 04:29:14.359
councilors we've got snowy 2.0 is

6753
04:29:14.560 --> 04:29:17.335
bringing  thousands of  new

6754
04:29:17.359 --> 04:29:20.359
employees into our region that  it is

6755
04:29:20.720 --> 04:29:22.776
increasing the demand for ancillary 

6756
04:29:22.800 --> 04:29:25.800
services.  we've got Alpine Rise up in

6757
04:29:25.840 --> 04:29:28.696
Northkuma where there are 200 new houses

6758
04:29:28.720 --> 04:29:31.720
under construction. Now we don't have a

6759
04:29:32.159 --> 04:29:34.776
rail link here in Kuma. Everything that

6760
04:29:34.800 --> 04:29:37.576
comes to Kuma, be it building materials,

6761
04:29:37.600 --> 04:29:40.536
 food, clothing,  everything comes

6762
04:29:40.560 --> 04:29:42.536
by truck. And those trucks need

6763
04:29:42.560 --> 04:29:44.856
somewhere to park when they're not being

6764
04:29:44.880 --> 04:29:47.096
 driven. And we can't expect 

6765
04:29:47.120 --> 04:29:49.096
drivers to be operating their vehicles

6766
04:29:49.120 --> 04:29:51.496
24 hours a day. It's a safety issue

6767
04:29:51.520 --> 04:29:54.520
there. Now the the owner is currently

6768
04:29:55.520 --> 04:29:58.520
 leasing premises just to to  

6769
04:29:59.120 --> 04:30:02.120
park his trust. Now it's it's a very

6770
04:30:02.239 --> 04:30:04.455
expensive lease counselors. I'm not at

6771
04:30:04.479 --> 04:30:06.215
liberty to tell you what it is cuz I

6772
04:30:06.239 --> 04:30:07.816
haven't been given permission by the

6773
04:30:07.840 --> 04:30:10.840
owner, but it's an eyewateringly high 

6774
04:30:11.199 --> 04:30:13.736
expense that he is paying and that's

6775
04:30:13.760 --> 04:30:14.936
what he's trying to avoid. He's trying

6776
04:30:14.960 --> 04:30:16.616
to get away from that by parking on his

6777
04:30:16.640 --> 04:30:19.640
own land. Now, if he if he's not allowed

6778
04:30:20.080 --> 04:30:22.776
to do this, , Snowy Mountains

6779
04:30:22.800 --> 04:30:25.800
Transport, you know, a a new a new Kuma

6780
04:30:26.560 --> 04:30:28.295
business rapidly growing, employing

6781
04:30:28.319 --> 04:30:31.255
about a dozen locals and their families

6782
04:30:31.279 --> 04:30:33.496
who are dependent upon those jobs, it

6783
04:30:33.520 --> 04:30:36.520
risks closing. It'll it'll close and and

6784
04:30:36.800 --> 04:30:39.335
we could see 12 poor people thrown out

6785
04:30:39.359 --> 04:30:41.175
of work. We could see families leaving

6786
04:30:41.199 --> 04:30:42.696
Kuma altogether because they haven't got

6787
04:30:42.720 --> 04:30:45.720
any way to meet their mortgages. Um

6788
04:30:47.120 --> 04:30:49.976
because you know this is a very steep

6789
04:30:50.000 --> 04:30:52.375
business cost that we are imposing upon

6790
04:30:52.399 --> 04:30:54.295
him by saying no you can't park your

6791
04:30:54.319 --> 04:30:55.496
trucks on your own land. You got to

6792
04:30:55.520 --> 04:30:58.215
lease someone else's land in Polo Flat.

6793
04:30:58.239 --> 04:31:01.239
Now is it unreasonable that  he he

6794
04:31:01.520 --> 04:31:04.520
could be  wanting to park his he his

6795
04:31:04.720 --> 04:31:07.720
trucks  on his land adjacent to Polo

6796
04:31:07.920 --> 04:31:10.375
Flat.  well I don't think so. I think

6797
04:31:10.399 --> 04:31:13.255
okay Polo Flat is growing. It's reached

6798
04:31:13.279 --> 04:31:15.175
there. He tells me there is no available

6799
04:31:15.199 --> 04:31:17.175
land in Poland flat. Now I'm not his

6800
04:31:17.199 --> 04:31:18.856
agent. I can't verify his claim, but

6801
04:31:18.880 --> 04:31:21.096
that's what he tells me. So is it

6802
04:31:21.120 --> 04:31:23.415
reasonable that  we should look to

6803
04:31:23.439 --> 04:31:25.656
expand Polaro Flat to accommodate a

6804
04:31:25.680 --> 04:31:28.375
growing business? I believe it is. Yes,

6805
04:31:28.399 --> 04:31:30.856
it will inconvenience  the natives.

6806
04:31:30.880 --> 04:31:32.696
We've heard from them and we have

6807
04:31:32.720 --> 04:31:35.720
sympathy for their plan. But um what

6808
04:31:36.239 --> 04:31:38.455
they are going to experience is is not

6809
04:31:38.479 --> 04:31:40.455
that different from what most of us

6810
04:31:40.479 --> 04:31:43.415
experience. I live on a narrow road. 

6811
04:31:43.439 --> 04:31:45.415
it's a gravel grade. It's not big enough

6812
04:31:45.439 --> 04:31:48.439
for the school bus that thunders past 

6813
04:31:48.640 --> 04:31:50.536
a couple of times a day in the

6814
04:31:50.560 --> 04:31:52.295
afternoon. I've got to pull over into

6815
04:31:52.319 --> 04:31:54.375
this evening to let it go past there.

6816
04:31:54.399 --> 04:31:55.976
There is an industrial facility that

6817
04:31:56.000 --> 04:31:58.776
started up there, a gas pumping station

6818
04:31:58.800 --> 04:32:01.800
which forced residents to move. So you

6819
04:32:01.920 --> 04:32:04.536
know this is Michgo people are adjusting

6820
04:32:04.560 --> 04:32:07.255
to industrial growth and and and putting

6821
04:32:07.279 --> 04:32:10.279
up with inadequate roads. Malago.  now

6822
04:32:10.560 --> 04:32:12.056
 the pressures of growth are coming to

6823
04:32:12.080 --> 04:32:15.080
Kuma and it's not a bad thing. I think

6824
04:32:15.279 --> 04:32:17.656
we should be facilitating the growth of

6825
04:32:17.680 --> 04:32:20.536
business and enterprises like Snap

6826
04:32:20.560 --> 04:32:23.560
Transport in  in Kuma because how else

6827
04:32:24.800 --> 04:32:26.856
are we going to grow this region? We've

6828
04:32:26.880 --> 04:32:29.335
heard councelor Rose say on in a

6829
04:32:29.359 --> 04:32:30.455
previous

6830
04:32:30.479 --> 04:32:31.496
you nearly finished.

6831
04:32:31.520 --> 04:32:33.255
Have I got 30 seconds?

6832
04:32:33.279 --> 04:32:34.856
No, you had your 30 seconds. You had

6833
04:32:34.880 --> 04:32:36.295
your 5 minutes

6834
04:32:36.319 --> 04:32:38.696
is too big. We got too many roads, not

6835
04:32:38.720 --> 04:32:40.776
enough rate payers. We need more

6836
04:32:40.800 --> 04:32:43.175
businesses. We need more rate payers. We

6837
04:32:43.199 --> 04:32:45.175
need more population and more income in

6838
04:32:45.199 --> 04:32:47.255
this region. And only private enterprise

6839
04:32:47.279 --> 04:32:50.279
can deliver that. So let's not act as a

6840
04:32:50.399 --> 04:32:53.096
roadblock to the growth of GMA. Snowy

6841
04:32:53.120 --> 04:32:55.656
Monero needs this business and so does

6842
04:32:55.680 --> 04:32:57.816
our council.

6843
04:32:57.840 --> 04:33:00.536
Thank you councelor Rigi.  is there

6844
04:33:00.560 --> 04:33:03.016
anyone who would like to speak against

6845
04:33:03.040 --> 04:33:05.896
this recision motion?

6846
04:33:05.920 --> 04:33:07.095
I have questions.

6847
04:33:07.119 --> 04:33:08.935
Yes, we will allow questions.

6848
04:33:08.959 --> 04:33:11.896
Thank you. Um, it was mentioned that

6849
04:33:11.920 --> 04:33:13.656
there's no further information in

6850
04:33:13.680 --> 04:33:15.175
relation to this development. Is that

6851
04:33:15.199 --> 04:33:18.199
correct? What there's just been no

6852
04:33:18.561 --> 04:33:21.415
further information submitted either way

6853
04:33:21.439 --> 04:33:23.175
for the development applications? Yes.

6854
04:33:23.199 --> 04:33:25.415
So, what's been presented um from my

6855
04:33:25.439 --> 04:33:27.015
understanding is in terms of what was

6856
04:33:27.039 --> 04:33:28.537
presented at the December meeting. I

6857
04:33:28.561 --> 04:33:31.561
might just refer over to our chair or

6858
04:33:32.320 --> 04:33:33.896
there's been no change to the

6859
04:33:33.920 --> 04:33:35.175
recommendation from staff.

6860
04:33:35.199 --> 04:33:38.056
Yeah. From perspective the proponent, do

6861
04:33:38.080 --> 04:33:39.736
they have an opportunity? This is if if

6862
04:33:39.760 --> 04:33:41.976
the um development is refused again, do

6863
04:33:42.000 --> 04:33:43.896
they have an opportunity to resubmit

6864
04:33:43.920 --> 04:33:46.920
another DA perhaps an amended proposal

6865
04:33:46.959 --> 04:33:48.216
of lighter use?

6866
04:33:48.240 --> 04:33:48.855
Yes,

6867
04:33:48.879 --> 04:33:49.415
they do.

6868
04:33:49.439 --> 04:33:49.816
Yeah.

6869
04:33:49.840 --> 04:33:51.015
Okay.

6870
04:33:51.039 --> 04:33:54.039
Um that J to speak against motion. Y

6871
04:33:55.760 --> 04:33:57.976
I recognize that I've had an opposite

6872
04:33:58.000 --> 04:34:01.000
side last time, but I have a very strong

6873
04:34:01.279 --> 04:34:02.935
philosophical position in relation to

6874
04:34:02.959 --> 04:34:04.537
decision motions that should be used

6875
04:34:04.561 --> 04:34:07.496
very sparingly and in um circumstances

6876
04:34:07.520 --> 04:34:10.520
of real merit, not just to try and flip

6877
04:34:11.439 --> 04:34:13.656
things over that people don't like the

6878
04:34:13.680 --> 04:34:16.680
outcome of or for other reasons. So I

6879
04:34:16.879 --> 04:34:18.537
think it's important that they are used

6880
04:34:18.561 --> 04:34:20.615
sparingly on the basis of decision

6881
04:34:20.639 --> 04:34:23.639
motion. Um I'm going to um not support

6882
04:34:24.959 --> 04:34:27.959
it today. Um however, I would make the

6883
04:34:28.799 --> 04:34:31.335
point that we really do need to support

6884
04:34:31.359 --> 04:34:33.896
the upcoming policies in relation to our

6885
04:34:33.920 --> 04:34:36.920
land use for zoning for Nashville. Polo

6886
04:34:37.279 --> 04:34:39.335
flat is landlocked now. I went to the

6887
04:34:39.359 --> 04:34:41.656
workshop out there and there is a a lot

6888
04:34:41.680 --> 04:34:44.136
of need for something to be done.

6889
04:34:44.160 --> 04:34:46.695
Whether it's trying to get Snow Hydro to

6890
04:34:46.719 --> 04:34:49.015
lease some of their unused land out

6891
04:34:49.039 --> 04:34:51.496
there or  we probably really got to

6892
04:34:51.520 --> 04:34:52.855
put our shoulder on the wheel to make

6893
04:34:52.879 --> 04:34:54.537
things happen out there so that this

6894
04:34:54.561 --> 04:34:57.561
sort of circumstance doesn't arise again

6895
04:34:57.600 --> 04:35:00.216
u and and look at loaning of zoning and

6896
04:35:00.240 --> 04:35:02.456
looking for land that will be available

6897
04:35:02.480 --> 04:35:05.175
for industrial use. Thank you.

6898
04:35:05.199 --> 04:35:06.855
Thank you councelor Summers. Is there

6899
04:35:06.879 --> 04:35:09.879
anyone who would like to speak

6900
04:35:10.240 --> 04:35:12.615
for

6901
04:35:12.639 --> 04:35:15.639
this recision motion?

6902
04:35:16.080 --> 04:35:18.695
Anyone else who'd like to speak against

6903
04:35:18.719 --> 04:35:19.576
council Stewart?

6904
04:35:19.600 --> 04:35:22.600
Yeah. No. , acting madame mayor. I

6905
04:35:22.799 --> 04:35:25.799
just um I think we we've got to support

6906
04:35:27.199 --> 04:35:30.199
councelor Rose how he um presented that

6907
04:35:32.561 --> 04:35:34.775
although we want growth and and that

6908
04:35:34.799 --> 04:35:37.799
we've got to do it properly and there's

6909
04:35:38.240 --> 04:35:41.240
nothing worse than the where there's

6910
04:35:41.439 --> 04:35:44.439
community people that have have set up

6911
04:35:44.480 --> 04:35:46.935
their living and living in an area where

6912
04:35:46.959 --> 04:35:48.935
they they've

6913
04:35:48.959 --> 04:35:51.576
um set up and got developed over the

6914
04:35:51.600 --> 04:35:54.136
years And um for council to let

6915
04:35:54.160 --> 04:35:57.160
industrial area um

6916
04:35:58.879 --> 04:36:01.496
industrial um facilities coming into

6917
04:36:01.520 --> 04:36:03.816
those those areas, we've got to tread

6918
04:36:03.840 --> 04:36:06.840
with caution and I am sure that there's

6919
04:36:07.199 --> 04:36:08.775
there's going to be other options for

6920
04:36:08.799 --> 04:36:11.799
the um for the um transport company to

6921
04:36:12.639 --> 04:36:15.639
find  the a more suitable area to to

6922
04:36:16.000 --> 04:36:19.000
to set up around around the  around

6923
04:36:19.119 --> 04:36:22.119
Kerma, but to to um to to go against the

6924
04:36:24.240 --> 04:36:25.656
community out there and there's been

6925
04:36:25.680 --> 04:36:27.896
very strong supporting against the

6926
04:36:27.920 --> 04:36:30.615
concern of of getting industrial type

6927
04:36:30.639 --> 04:36:33.335
development out there. I think it's it

6928
04:36:33.359 --> 04:36:36.359
would be a backward step for the um for

6929
04:36:36.639 --> 04:36:39.095
the township of Kerma because those

6930
04:36:39.119 --> 04:36:41.496
areas you got to hold with with fairly

6931
04:36:41.520 --> 04:36:44.376
high regard for for the future

6932
04:36:44.400 --> 04:36:47.335
development and I'm sure against what

6933
04:36:47.359 --> 04:36:49.255
councelor Rooney says I'm sure there

6934
04:36:49.279 --> 04:36:52.279
will be other opportunities for um the

6935
04:36:52.320 --> 04:36:55.320
transport operator to to um to get a

6936
04:36:55.760 --> 04:36:57.896
facility that will be more appropriate

6937
04:36:57.920 --> 04:37:00.056
and won't cause the angst to those those

6938
04:37:00.080 --> 04:37:03.080
people out there that um have set up and

6939
04:37:03.119 --> 04:37:06.056
got their their lifestyle set up out in

6940
04:37:06.080 --> 04:37:07.896
that area. So that's why I'm I'm not

6941
04:37:07.920 --> 04:37:10.537
supporting the recision motion and plus

6942
04:37:10.561 --> 04:37:12.456
I would support that I don't think

6943
04:37:12.480 --> 04:37:14.855
recision motion should come back in

6944
04:37:14.879 --> 04:37:17.879
unless there's there's a a really good

6945
04:37:18.000 --> 04:37:21.000
reason for it. I think council voted

6946
04:37:21.680 --> 04:37:23.816
pretty strongly the other day not to

6947
04:37:23.840 --> 04:37:26.840
have  against the the concern at this

6948
04:37:27.439 --> 04:37:30.439
application. So I I can't support it.

6949
04:37:31.119 --> 04:37:33.816
Thank you, councelor Stewart. Are there

6950
04:37:33.840 --> 04:37:35.335
is there any other councelor who would

6951
04:37:35.359 --> 04:37:37.896
like to have something to say? No. Then

6952
04:37:37.920 --> 04:37:40.695
I put the motion. Everyone in favor of

6953
04:37:40.719 --> 04:37:43.719
this recision motion

6954
04:37:43.840 --> 04:37:44.615
get to

6955
04:37:44.639 --> 04:37:47.496
Oh, right. Yes. Sorry. L plates. Right

6956
04:37:47.520 --> 04:37:50.520
on. Go for it. Councelor Williams. Thank

6957
04:37:50.639 --> 04:37:53.015
you.

6958
04:37:53.039 --> 04:37:56.039
Thank you, acting mayor.

6959
04:37:57.199 --> 04:38:00.199
Emphasis on the acting.

6960
04:38:00.959 --> 04:38:03.255
Look, it's it's an interesting debate.

6961
04:38:03.279 --> 04:38:06.279
 Kuma is is beginning to grow. Um Kuma

6962
04:38:08.799 --> 04:38:11.799
has a serious challenge as snowy 2.0

6963
04:38:12.480 --> 04:38:15.480
will complete one day.  when that that

6964
04:38:16.400 --> 04:38:19.400
 happens,  we're going to have to

6965
04:38:19.520 --> 04:38:22.456
look for new bases of employment here.

6966
04:38:22.480 --> 04:38:25.480
 councelor Rooney has um

6967
04:38:26.160 --> 04:38:29.160
articulated a very strong argument that

6968
04:38:30.080 --> 04:38:33.080
 this is needed for the economy. Um

6969
04:38:34.959 --> 04:38:37.959
 and the outskirts of towns is where

6970
04:38:39.039 --> 04:38:41.496
land transfers from one class to

6971
04:38:41.520 --> 04:38:44.520
another. Cities get bigger. They don't

6972
04:38:44.799 --> 04:38:47.255
grow in rings with with space between

6973
04:38:47.279 --> 04:38:50.056
them.  and  and that's going to

6974
04:38:50.080 --> 04:38:51.656
happen here and that's what we're

6975
04:38:51.680 --> 04:38:54.680
seeing. We're seeing reasonable request

6976
04:38:56.400 --> 04:38:59.400
to utilize land to meet the needs of the

6977
04:38:59.520 --> 04:39:02.520
economy. Now,

6978
04:39:02.879 --> 04:39:05.879
yes, as as as others have said,  it's

6979
04:39:07.359 --> 04:39:09.415
rural land,

6980
04:39:09.439 --> 04:39:10.855
but we're not looking to change the

6981
04:39:10.879 --> 04:39:12.695
leap.

6982
04:39:12.719 --> 04:39:14.136
The reason we're not looking to change

6983
04:39:14.160 --> 04:39:16.855
the leap is this is allowed with consent

6984
04:39:16.879 --> 04:39:19.879
on rural land in the same way we consent

6985
04:39:20.400 --> 04:39:23.335
to many pieces changes. That's why they

6986
04:39:23.359 --> 04:39:26.359
come to council. So this is reasonable

6987
04:39:26.639 --> 04:39:29.576
growth in an area where we expect land

6988
04:39:29.600 --> 04:39:32.600
to transition.  and it's allowed under

6989
04:39:32.799 --> 04:39:34.456
the LAP.

6990
04:39:34.480 --> 04:39:36.695
 now

6991
04:39:36.719 --> 04:39:39.336
you know the the when that happens

6992
04:39:39.360 --> 04:39:41.096
people come into conflict and that was

6993
04:39:41.120 --> 04:39:43.736
discussed  here you know we have

6994
04:39:43.760 --> 04:39:46.614
difference of opinions. Um but the

6995
04:39:46.638 --> 04:39:49.638
reality is if we want our towns to grow

6996
04:39:50.560 --> 04:39:51.976
 they're going to grow at the

6997
04:39:52.000 --> 04:39:54.536
outskirts of the town and we're going to

6998
04:39:54.560 --> 04:39:57.176
have this problem. This is a reasonable

6999
04:39:57.200 --> 04:39:58.694
proposition.

7000
04:39:58.718 --> 04:40:01.496
Now yes the road gets fogged such as the

7001
04:40:01.520 --> 04:40:04.456
Monero Highway. I drive it every day

7002
04:40:04.480 --> 04:40:06.536
through the week to go to CRA. Some days

7003
04:40:06.560 --> 04:40:08.056
you can't see 100 meters in front of

7004
04:40:08.080 --> 04:40:10.934
you. Some days you can't see 20. There's

7005
04:40:10.958 --> 04:40:12.694
more trucks on that highway than there

7006
04:40:12.718 --> 04:40:15.576
ever will be in a day than there ever

7007
04:40:15.600 --> 04:40:18.376
will be on Calaminda Road.

7008
04:40:18.400 --> 04:40:21.176
And we've asked them to upgrade the rate

7009
04:40:21.200 --> 04:40:23.736
to help accommodate that. Right? We need

7010
04:40:23.760 --> 04:40:26.376
to be reasonable and prudent and

7011
04:40:26.400 --> 04:40:29.400
realistic. We want the economy to be

7012
04:40:29.760 --> 04:40:31.736
vibrant. These are the things that need

7013
04:40:31.760 --> 04:40:33.336
to happen.

7014
04:40:33.360 --> 04:40:35.816
Um, so look, again, I'd commend the

7015
04:40:35.840 --> 04:40:37.576
motion to you. We got it wrong the other

7016
04:40:37.600 --> 04:40:40.600
day. , and it's time , well, we have

7017
04:40:40.878 --> 04:40:42.376
an opportunity to correct that. Thank

7018
04:40:42.400 --> 04:40:44.136
you.

7019
04:40:44.160 --> 04:40:46.694
Thank you, Councelor Williamson. Very

7020
04:40:46.718 --> 04:40:49.718
interesting debate. Right, let's now put

7021
04:40:49.840 --> 04:40:52.840
the motion. , everyone in favor of the

7022
04:40:53.440 --> 04:40:55.576
recision motion.

7023
04:40:55.600 --> 04:40:58.600
Councelor Williamson, Councelor Rooney,

7024
04:40:59.440 --> 04:41:01.976
 those who are against the recision

7025
04:41:02.000 --> 04:41:05.000
motion, please.

7026
04:41:05.360 --> 04:41:07.256
Councelor Summers, Councelor Stewart,

7027
04:41:07.280 --> 04:41:08.774
Councelor

7028
04:41:08.798 --> 04:41:11.798
Rose, Councelor Davis, Councelor Elliot,

7029
04:41:12.160 --> 04:41:13.736
it

7030
04:41:13.760 --> 04:41:14.376
were you.

7031
04:41:14.400 --> 04:41:17.400
Oh, and me. Yes. And me. Yes.

7032
04:41:18.638 --> 04:41:20.774
 yes. No, that has not passed. Thank

7033
04:41:20.798 --> 04:41:22.296
you very much. I will go and get

7034
04:41:22.320 --> 04:41:23.736
Oh, no. Yeah.

7035
04:41:23.760 --> 04:41:24.934
Yep.

7036
04:41:24.958 --> 04:41:27.096
Thank you.

7037
04:41:27.120 --> 04:41:30.120
I'll go back to my chair.

7038
04:41:42.560 --> 04:41:44.536
Very good, very good and article

7039
04:41:44.560 --> 04:41:47.560
arguments and you know very impressive.

7040
04:41:53.200 --> 04:41:54.694
Thank

7041
04:41:54.718 --> 04:41:56.854
you madam chair. The motion is lost.

7042
04:41:56.878 --> 04:41:59.878
Thank you. Thank you for pleasure. Only

7043
04:42:00.320 --> 04:42:03.320
muddled up once.

7044
04:42:03.440 --> 04:42:06.440
Good day. Moving on to 11.13 operational

7045
04:42:07.520 --> 04:42:08.536
expenditure.

7046
04:42:08.560 --> 04:42:11.560
Excuse me.  madam chair we have gone

7047
04:42:12.400 --> 04:42:14.536
up over 400 p.m.

7048
04:42:14.560 --> 04:42:15.096
Oh

7049
04:42:15.120 --> 04:42:18.120
and point let's do a procedural motion.

7050
04:42:18.400 --> 04:42:19.816
Sorry about that. I just forgot what

7051
04:42:19.840 --> 04:42:21.336
time was given we were having so much

7052
04:42:21.360 --> 04:42:23.256
fun. I would like to move a procedural

7053
04:42:23.280 --> 04:42:26.280
motion that we extend by up to well up

7054
04:42:27.360 --> 04:42:29.496
to 5:00 p.m. to allow us to get through

7055
04:42:29.520 --> 04:42:31.976
the regular items of business. Um do I

7056
04:42:32.000 --> 04:42:34.854
have a an  a second to extend to 5:00

7057
04:42:34.878 --> 04:42:37.496
p.m.

7058
04:42:37.520 --> 04:42:40.520
Council, thank you. Um I will just

7059
04:42:40.718 --> 04:42:43.718
really briefly speak for this. We we we

7060
04:42:44.160 --> 04:42:46.056
just can't keep fairing business. I know

7061
04:42:46.080 --> 04:42:47.496
I know it's late and I know we've had a

7062
04:42:47.520 --> 04:42:49.576
long day, but I I feel it's it's prudent

7063
04:42:49.600 --> 04:42:51.816
for us just to push on a little bit more

7064
04:42:51.840 --> 04:42:54.376
and and and try and achieve a little bit

7065
04:42:54.400 --> 04:42:55.816
more of a result and at least get

7066
04:42:55.840 --> 04:42:57.096
through the notice of motions, which are

7067
04:42:57.120 --> 04:42:58.694
what council submissions are. I think

7068
04:42:58.718 --> 04:43:00.056
it's unfair to keep pushing them back

7069
04:43:00.080 --> 04:43:02.216
meeting after meeting.

7070
04:43:02.240 --> 04:43:04.056
Um so with that, the procedural motion

7071
04:43:04.080 --> 04:43:07.080
to extend to 5:00 p.m. um can ask for a

7072
04:43:07.760 --> 04:43:09.496
vote. All those in favor of extending to

7073
04:43:09.520 --> 04:43:11.576
5:00 p.m.

7074
04:43:11.600 --> 04:43:14.600
Councor Rose, Rooney, Elliot, and

7075
04:43:14.638 --> 04:43:17.638
Hopkins. All those against, Councelor

7076
04:43:17.680 --> 04:43:19.736
Summers, Higgins, Stewart, Williamson,

7077
04:43:19.760 --> 04:43:21.976
Davis, the motion is lost. With that, I

7078
04:43:22.000 --> 04:43:24.614
close the meeting and all items of

7079
04:43:24.638 --> 04:43:27.096
business not yet debated today will be

7080
04:43:27.120 --> 04:43:29.736
um  included in the March business

7081
04:43:29.760 --> 04:43:32.760
papers. Cers, thank you very much for

7082
04:43:33.360 --> 04:43:36.360
your um commitment and attendance today.

7083
04:43:36.480 --> 04:43:39.480
That's it.